Decriminalize Testosterone.

[buck]

We don't have a direct democracy, voting doesn't accomplish jack squat when politicians are bought off, and make no mistake about it, scheduling anabolics and making them illegal is all about money, big pharma doesn't like competition, if they can't make money they tell politicians to outlaw it.

And even if you had a direct democracy, it's doesn't mean the people voting are enlightened. Have you taken a look at the average citizen or even politician in this country? I'd say 98% of the human race is a complete waste of perfectly good air. The people in this country are nightmarishly stupid.

Then vote them out after 1 term and try again sort of like dating till you get the right one. Politicians want to stay in power that is what they like more then money.

I don't think most people are happy, 18% of the population is on antidepressants, pain killers, gobs of narcotics, alcohol, food addictions and various other things to sedate them to the point they don't go stark raving mad. This isn't a happy country, that's the media that helps to gloss over the icky parts of life. Americans have been brainwashed to vote against what is in their own interests, suffering is a point of pride.

I don't see any hope for this country, certainly not voting, certainly not the typical American that blindly waves their flag and clings to their jesus, only to become enraged if you call this place a shithole.

The best approach would be chaos, it's the only way to level the playing field. Set up parts of this country where people are free to do as they please, if someone doesn't like it they can go back to the nanny state.

And how many people aren't happy with how their body is. So they go out and push themselves with drugs or training that brings on injury. And for what? Because sooner or later they will start to deteriorate to where they were or worse. So I guess they shouldn't even try to work out. And I guess that same thinking would apply to voting? I don't think so.

 

[Soren]

Then vote them out after 1 term and try again sort of like dating till you get the right one. Politicians want to stay in power that is what they like more then money.

And how many people aren't happy with how their body is. So they go out and push themselves with drugs or training that brings on injury. And for what? Because sooner or later they will start to deteriorate to where they were or worse. So I guess they shouldn't even try to work out. And I guess that same thinking would apply to voting? I don't think so.

People aren't taught to be free thinkers in this country. So while there are a certain percentage of us that can sit back and point out the obvious wrongs and perhaps how to fix them or if nothing else just to destroy these systems and not replace them with anything at all, because lets face it more rules and regulations suck, and the closer we are to libertarian or even anarchy the better.

You are dealing with a country full of people that love to deep throat on a jesus dick, they are raised on fast food, they are brainwashed to believe that this country is all about freedom and that soldiers and cops are the true hero's of this nation. In other words it's all 100% bullshit and most of the masses can't see it.

As for people and their bodies, that is of little concern. Sure I see young kids and young people really wrapped up in how they look, but trust me once you start approaching 50, you've long since lost interest in preserving something you know it going to break down and be tossed in the trash. Taking steroids in my case is all about restoring energy and staying strong. I know that it will probably take years off my life, but I'd rather be able to move around and get shit done then be frail and scared of the world.

 

[buck]

People aren't taught to be free thinkers in this country. So while there are a certain percentage of us that can sit back and point out the obvious wrongs and perhaps how to fix them or if nothing else just to destroy these systems and not replace them with anything at all, because lets face it more rules and regulations suck, and the closer we are to libertarian or even anarchy the better.

You are dealing with a country full of people that love to deep throat on a jesus dick, they are raised on fast food, they are brainwashed to believe that this country is all about freedom and that soldiers and cops are the true hero's of this nation. In other words it's all 100% bullshit and most of the masses can't see it.

As for people and their bodies, that is of little concern. Sure I see young kids and young people really wrapped up in how they look, but trust me once you start approaching 50, you've long since lost interest in preserving something you know it going to break down and be tossed in the trash. Taking steroids in my case is all about restoring energy and staying strong. I know that it will probably take years off my life, but I'd rather be able to move around and get shit done then be frail and scared of the world.

So you admit to doing things that are bad for you and are willing accept those consequences, and have made excuses to support your desires, which I am OK with. Yet when others make the same choice for them to do the negative things because it supports there desire you condemn them as not thinkers. Have you spent a lot of time studying how their values and goals are different then your own and give them the freedom to not copy you. Because it seems as you already know that you are going to end up in the same condition as those other people that you speak against. And as I passed 50 some time back I have learned that people like to condemn others for not being perfect or as they think they should be. Yet will defend their own bad choices and inadequacies to make them selves feel justified in their own actions. And the reason I know is I look around and have done the same things and try to continue to learn and grow. But I can sometimes be the biggest impediment to the process. But the is what ageing can teach you if you are lucky.

 

[Soren]

So you admit to doing things that are bad for you and are willing accept those consequences, and have made excuses to support your desires, which I am OK with. Yet when others make the same choice for them to do the negative things because it supports there desire you condemn them as not thinkers.

Buck the things I condemn or ridicule others doing clearly serve no purpose. Like being religious which leads to morals, which leads to dogma, which leads to a major pain in the ass. Fast food I could care less, but most of these people are really after immediate gratification from dopamine, they aren't thinking about anything with depth, like how to put together a healthy well thought meal, it's just shove garbage into their mouths and their brains, they are fastfood consumers of food and info. So no I don't look to these people to support the cause of decriminalizing anything, because they are incapable of thinking past their next snack. Of course if these people could develop a self sense of awareness that would be a different matter, but for right now I don't see it happening.

As for use of steroids, it's my body and yes I've done extensive reading on the subject and know the risks and rewards. I won't have a government telling me what I can and can't do with my body when we all know it's a system based on hypocrisy.
Which is more dangerous to your health, using 300mg of testosterone every week, or flying down a highway on a motorcycle. The guy on the bike is legal, me however I can go to jail for 1 year and be fined .

Being obese, smoking, drinking alcohol, having unprotected sex, driving a motorcycle, all are far more dangerous then steroids and all of them are legal except one....steroids.

 

[buck]

Buck the things I condemn or ridicule others doing clearly serve no purpose. Like being religious which leads to morals, which leads to dogma, which leads to a major pain in the ass. Fast food I could care less, but most of these people are really after immediate gratification from dopamine, they aren't thinking about anything with depth, like how to put together a healthy well thought meal, it's just shove garbage into their mouths and their brains, they are fastfood consumers of food and info. So no I don't look to these people to support the cause of decriminalizing anything, because they are incapable of thinking past their next snack. Of course if these people could develop a self sense of awareness that would be a different matter, but for right now I don't see it happening.

As for use of steroids, it's my body and yes I've done extensive reading on the subject and know the risks and rewards. I won't have a government telling me what I can and can't do with my body when we all know it's a system based on hypocrisy.
Which is more dangerous to your health, using 300mg of testosterone every week, or flying down a highway on a motorcycle. The guy on the bike is legal, me however I can go to jail for 1 year and be fined .

Being obese, smoking, drinking alcohol, having unprotected sex, driving a motorcycle, all are far more dangerous then steroids and all of them are legal except one....steroids.

So you are still trying to justifying how you are destroying your body slower so that must make you a much better person. That is not a logical excuse. Overweight people I talk to make the same arguments. So I would think you would have empathy for them as your value and logic system is much the same. No those people may not be thinking about a healthy meal but that is a value that me and you hold not them. How do you know what they may be thinking about or working to accomplish that may be something you do not value? I used to train a very overweight man that missed many of his workouts and felt bad about it. When I finally asked him about his time. He told me how he didn't hit the gym the night before because he was the coach for his daughters softball team and was there for a few hours before he went home to spend time with his family. The night before same thing but a coaching a different daughters team. The night before that He coached a soccer team because none of the parents would get involved and he didn't want to see those kids without a coach. So I asked him who is a better person me because I eat well and look good or him for being a more giving and generous person. Judging how good a person is is pretty much an inside job.

 

[Soren]

So you are still trying to justifying how you are destroying your body slower so that must make you a much better person. That is not a logical excuse.

First steroids don't destroy the body, in many diseases they can actually keep you alive a lot longer. Take a look at those suffering from muscle wasting disorders or HIV.

Testosterone has major effects on cns, we know DHT conversion enhances cognitive function in those with low T. If you have low testosterone this is a disaster for a man, you simply won't have strength and endurance to live the kind of life most men want. Most men don't want to sit around like a fat flabby sack of crap getting weaker and weaker, never having erections, never having any fun because they're scared of getting hurt.

Depression and suicide have been linked to low T, so if a person kills themselves instead of being able to self administer a hormone that could radically alter their view of life, who is to say this person has committed anything wrong, as it is their life and we have the ability to easily obtain steroids.

It's simple. The government should drop the horseshit war on drugs and let people do as they please.

The only thing that should be illegal in the states are Murder, Rape, Assault, Theft or Damage to private and public property. That's all the the laws that should exist, everything else should be flushed down the toilet. And while were at it, fire about 99% of the politicians and flush law as a profession down the toilet.

 

[buck]

First steroids don't destroy the body, in many diseases they can actually keep you alive a lot longer. Take a look at those suffering from muscle wasting disorders or HIV.

Testosterone has major effects on cns, we know DHT conversion enhances cognitive function in those with low T. If you have low testosterone this is a disaster for a man, you simply won't have strength and endurance to live the kind of life most men want. Most men don't want to sit around like a fat flabby sack of crap getting weaker and weaker, never having erections, never having any fun because they're scared of getting hurt.

Depression and suicide have been linked to low T, so if a person kills themselves instead of being able to self administer a hormone that could radically alter their view of life, who is to say this person has committed anything wrong, as it is their life and we have the ability to easily obtain steroids.

It's simple. The government should drop the horseshit war on drugs and let people do as they please.

The only thing that should be illegal in the states are Murder, Rape, Assault, Theft or Damage to private and public property. That's all the the laws that should exist, everything else should be flushed down the toilet. And while were at it, fire about 99% of the politicians and flush law as a profession down the toilet.

Your previous posts you were talking about taking way over the therapeutic dose. And now you are talking about things that have been shown to help men at a therapeutic level which I didn't disagree on. So you are really not helping your case by jumping back and forth and not following a logical path.

And while I may tend to agree your your views on law in general. But that is all theoretical and idealistic. Which doesn't happen in reality and I choose not to wasted my time on dreaming and deal with things as they are and work within societies guidelines to eschew change. Because compromise is the only thing that lasts.

 

[Sworder]

Your previous posts you were talking about taking way over the therapeutic dose. And now you are talking about things that have been shown to help men at a therapeutic level which I didn't disagree on. So you are really not helping your case by jumping back and forth and not following a logical path.

No, he hasn't! You are putting words in his mouth.

Btw the term is "supraphysiological," been dying to tell you.

 

[Soren]

Your previous posts you were talking about taking way over the therapeutic dose. And now you are talking about things that have been shown to help men at a therapeutic level which I didn't disagree on.
But that is all theoretical and idealistic. Which doesn't happen in reality and I choose not to wasted my time on dreaming and deal with things as they are and work within societies guidelines to eschew change. Because compromise is the only thing that lasts.

Theraputic levels aren't the same for everyone. Some people do well on lower doses, some of us do better on higher doses. I don't look at the natural production of testosterone which has an upper limit of about 15ng/day and say that's where I should be. I might feel alright at that level, but then again perhaps I do better at 30-50ng/day.

The thing about all of this is side effects will present themselves and you will have plenty of warnings if things get out of hand, you can address all of these issues with education and perseverance. We aren't talking about drugs that will cause you to fall over dead a few seconds after taking them.

As for living in a fantasy world. I think the war on drugs has caused huge numbers of people to be robbed of their freedom and that to me is a crime against humanity. I'm not sure it's a fantasy, but like I said, things don't change in this country when you have huge numbers of people that never question the status quo, often it's the opposite, they think it the highest virtue to do as they are told at all times and obey authority. God, Bible, Flag, Moms Apple Pie, Football on a Sunday afternoon, this is all Americans are supposed to want.

 

[buck]

Theraputic levels aren't the same for everyone. Some people do well on lower doses, some of us do better on higher doses. I don't look at the natural production of testosterone which has an upper limit of about 15ng/day and say that's where I should be. I might feel alright at that level, but then again perhaps I do better at 30-50ng/day.

The thing about all of this is side effects will present themselves and you will have plenty of warnings if things get out of hand, you can address all of these issues with education and perseverance. We aren't talking about drugs that will cause you to fall over dead a few seconds after taking them.

As for living in a fantasy world. I think the war on drugs has caused huge numbers of people to be robbed of their freedom and that to me is a crime against humanity. I'm not sure it's a fantasy, but like I said, things don't change in this country when you have huge numbers of people that never question the status quo, often it's the opposite, they think it the highest virtue to do as they are told at all times and obey authority. God, Bible, Flag, Moms Apple Pie, Football on a Sunday afternoon, this is all Americans are supposed to want.

Therapeutic levels are the same for everyone. They are levels that keep you healthy. I know of people that say they feel better at a gram a week. Feeling is one factor. What is proven to be healthy long term is the standard I go by for health. If I choose more I don't argue that it is good for me just to sooth my ego so I can feel better about myself and pretend I am better then others. I am just man enough to know I will pay the consequences of my actions and I am fine with self responsibility. You may want to start hanging out with different people and you will find that they are not all like the people you know. I know many people that spend their time outdoors climbing hiking and mushroom hunting. Volunteer their time to charities go down to central america every year to help build hospitals etc. There is a wide variety in my world.
If you would like to do some thing that I think may be positive then you may want to look here
Take male hormones off the controlled substances list | We the People: Your Voice in Our Government

If you want to keep hating on people and society and the world I am more then happy to leave you with that choice as well. As I am a fan of choice. And everyone choice has got them to where they are at the moment. It is time for me to do some thing positive that will help my life. As you know no one really changes their mind by what some one says on the internet.

 

[Soren]

Therapeutic levels are the same for everyone. They are levels that keep you healthy. I know of people that say they feel better at a gram a week.

There are anywhere between 6-12 million steroid users in this country. Most have jobs or go to school, most don't do anything to anyone at all. Steroid use is a victim-less crime in this country.

Who gets to decide what is safe and what isn't. That is the entire point of this conversation. Do we follow the libertarian credo "my body, my choice", or do we mindlessly defer our rights to so called authorities that often have an agenda whether that be the medical community tied to big business with armies of lobbyist and bought off politicians, or Law Enforcement/Lawyers/Judges/Legislators tied to the prison industrial complex.

It's really a simple matter. Do adults have the right to do as they please as long as they aren't interfering or taking the rights of others away.

Does a steroid user cause society any real problems. Do I as a user for the past twelve years cause society problems, someone that has only missed two days of work in 24 years and doesn't even have a simple traffic citation, never been to court for any reason at all?

Who's business is it that I stick a needle in myself several times a week? It should be mine and mine alone.