Does anyone here use a serm instead of an ai with high test?

[Juicedhead]

curious if anyone does this? what would be the advantage of using a serm instead of an ai? I use arimidex but have heard guys say they use nolva.

 

[Swcar]

I let my e2 go as high as it goes even on a gram of test, i have no BP or estrogen sides though, i find i grow best like this, if anyone does this just make sure you keep BP in check

 

[BigTomJ]

I don't see any real benefit. Most of the people I hear running a serm over a second generation AI are just old heads that don't know any better and think their nolva lowers estrogen.

AI's, in general, are far more well tolerated with much less and more predictable side effects than long term serm use, so for me, being more health conscious, i personally would stick with aromasin and keep my levels in a side effect free level than let it run buck wild and just hoping to block it at the breast tissue.

Also nolva isn't going to do anything for any of the non-gyno sides of intolerably high e2

 

[lukiss96]

There was some dude at T nation who bs'ed everybody that he's a doctor and takes steroids himself. He came up with this bullshit theory about taking nolvadex instead of AI and that all ai's are poison. He was exposed later on to be fake ass. I see his theories have still survived long enough to be spreas around.

I too don't think serm is really helpful outside of gyno prevention/control and pct. I just use anastrozole as it's easiest one to deal with.

 

[GuerillaPete]

Just look at guys transitioning male to female they have very high estrogen and are growing muscles on top of muscles….
NOT

 

[cdoubleu]

I don't see any real benefit. Most of the people I hear running a serm over a second generation AI are just old heads that don't know any better and think their nolva lowers estrogen.

AI's, in general, are far more well tolerated with much less and more predictable side effects than long term serm use, so for me, being more health conscious, i personally would stick with aromasin and keep my levels in a side effect free level than let it run buck wild and just hoping to block it at the breast tissue.

Also nolva isn't going to do anything for any of the non-gyno sides of intolerably high e2

Do you think it would be beneficial to run a serm from the onset, for gyno prevention, until assessing e2 and dialling it in if needed?

 

[narta]

Serms are on hand in case of gyno/itchy nips. But having masteron on hand is even better, more anabolics, same breast tissue protection from estrogen

 

[BigTomJ]

Do you think it would be beneficial to run a serm from the onset, for gyno prevention, until assessing e2 and dialling it in if needed?

No, serms are fast acting enough that you don't need to run them profilactically in my opinion.

They should be on hand in case of a flare up to stave off tissue growth until you can get new bloodwork and dial in an AI

 

[Drex]

They really are different things, to avoid gynecomastia a SERM such as raloxifene or tamoxifen is more effective than an AI such as letrozole, exemestane,..., because SERMs block the action of estrogens in breast tissue, while AIs lower the estradiol, but they do not prevent gynecomastia, since estrogens could continue to bind to the estrogen receptor and this could cause gynecomastia.

Many times a very high estradiol can cause gynecomastia even when using tamoxifen and this is when an AI could be added or when excess estrogen causes lack of libido, impotence, retention,...Although before using an AI I would always use a DHT derivative such as primobolan, proviron, masteron,... at high doses.

At the cardiovascular level, lipid profile, bone, muscle hypertrophy,....it is always better to have high estradiol than low, so I would use IAs as little as possible.

Then, it must also be clarified that gynecomastia can occur due to an imbalance in androgen/estrogen values (due to the use of finasteride for example), alteration of progesterone/estrone levels (due to nandrolone, trenbolone,...), increased prolactin (maybe due to nandrolone, trenbolone,...),...and in these cases serms do not help to avoid it, but other ways should be chosen.

 

[RiceNKimchi]

My personal take. When I have nipple sensitivity, I take a serm, nolva or ralox first, then get bloods to see how my e is looking. It's usually from changing compounds or doses ime. Afterwards I increase my ai accordingly and get off the serm

 

[Juicedhead]

yeah fuck serms. I just heard another idiot say he uses nolva on cycle for e2 sides but the dude clearly knows fuck all about e2 since nolva doesnt even lower e2 in the body which defeats the whole fucking purpose of using it. i told him that too i said you idiot nolva doesnt lower e2 on a blood test.

 

[connoristiny]

can serms or masteron reverse gyno?

 

[RiceNKimchi]

can serms or masteron reverse gyno?

Totally because gyno surgery is a scam./s

If it has set in, the gyno is there. You can control flare up and initial stages

 

[PCTAccount]

I prefer raloxifene at 60mg for a few days as needed. Nolvadex is alright too but more old school, seems to be something I'm going to just steer away from now moving forward.

I don't like AI in general, but I've had way better result using Arimidex over exemestane. Both need to be dialed in but exemestane is a suicidal AI and will shit all over your aromatase enzyme, once it's gone you're fucked for at least 2 weeks. Crashed my shit on Trestolone once. Never again. Threw all that shit in the garbo. Had 2g raw. Lol. Arimidex is way better. 0.25mg daily usually does it for most people. Just know when you stop it, you have to consider that your deactivated aromatase enzyme will be coming back.