I wanted to do a cycle of high dose anavar maybe 100 mg with a test base. I am looking to increase strength but not gain weight. I am an endurance athlete and more weight would be counter productive. Ive read that anavar was good for this and should be ran with a test base. Are there other recommendations and is this an okay cycle?
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
First cycle anavar.
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Hi mate this is a post I found on another forum, its pretty helpful - this is not my post, just forwarding it! (it's quite long sorry!)
MYTHS
Myth #1 - Anavar will not suppress the HPTA.
False. Anavar, used in adequate dosages, will shut you down. To what degree you experience side effects of suppression (loss of libido, lethargy) is entirely dependent upon the individual and the dosages used.
Myth #2 - Var is a weak anabolic, and is not effective unless stacked with a more androgenic compound.
This could not be further from the truth. At dosages of 40mg a day and higher, anavar is incredibly effective at adding water free LBM. At around day 6-7, increased vascularity should become apparent (assuming your oxandrolone is legitimate in its dosing), and strength gains should start appearing around day 14.
If used during a clean bulk, gains of 10-20 pounds are possible. If cutting, you will maintain weight, or even put on 5-10 pounds (depending on the rate of fat loss/severity of diet). You will keep all of your gains with proper PCT.
Myth #3 - Anavar will not require any type of PCT.
This is one ive never understood. It's a pretty commonly known fact now that var is a suppressive compound. So why is it that some individuals still refuse to make a small investment in some clomid/nolva....this is your testicular function we're talking about. That said, PCT required for var is not as "heavy" as PCT for, say, a test/eq cycle. 15-20 days @ 50mg clomid should be sufficient.
LIBIDO
The only real issue of concern that i have found when running anavar alone is slight libido suppression. Anavar is suppressive enough to where you WILL feel a difference in your sex drive (and not for the better ) when using 40+mg a day. There are three options to counteract this.
#1 - Tribulus + Avena Sativa - Trib at 4-7g a day and Avena Sativa at 3-4g a day tend to help prevent any loss in performance or ability to get it up. However, using effective dosages is going to end up being as or more expensive than options 2 or 3...but its your call.
#2 - Proviron - If hairloss is an issue in your choice to use anavar, then you may want to avoid this one. But 25mg ED proviron, starting after week 2, will keep you rock hard. And it will help to harden up your muscles too .
#3 - Maintenance Test Dosage - Finally, you could choose to use testosterone to keep your willy in shape. At a dosage of around 200mg, split bi weekly, everything should keep running smoothly. Also, this will contribute to your gains much moreso than than options 1 or 2. I would keep nolva onhand on the off chance that you are severely gyno prone. Bloating should not be an issue at this dosage.
BENEFITS
Anavar is a badass drug. This is why.
#1 - Vascularity
Oxandrolone will make you veiny as all hell. And quickly. Look out for brand new bulging forearms veins by around day 6. If you are following a cutting regimen, expect new spider webs in your chest, shoulders and quads by around day 21.
#2 - Pumps
When on var, the pumps are constant. Bored sitting in class/at work? Do some unweighted calf raises. After about three minutes, your calves will be ready to pop. Youll be doing something like drinking a cup of water, and after a minute of holding it, your bi will be completely full and pumped. You may have to cut some sets short in the gym due to the painful pumpage.
#3 - Strength
Even when cutting, you can expect new strength gains every workout after about day 14-21.
#4 - Fat Loss
Anavar has been shown to contribute to accelerated fat loss in both subcutaneous and visceral fat, concentrated effects in the abdomen and thigh area. And if youve used the drug, you can attest to this...if you cant sport the 6-8 pack look on var, its not gonna happen .
CYCLE
Anavar should be run @ at least 40mg a day to see all of the benefits it offers. Dosages upwards of 80mg have been shown to exhibit diminishing returns. Also, i cant imagine the intensity of the pumps at that kind of dosage.
Cycle #1
Anavar 40-50mg ED Weeks 1-8
Tribulus 5-8g ED Weeks 1-12
Avena Sativa 2-4g ED Weeks 1-12
Clomid 50mg ED Weeks 9-11
Cycle #2
Anavar 40-50mg ED Weeks 1-8
Proviron 25mg ED Weeks 3-8
Clomid 50mg ED Weeks 9-11
Cycle #3
Anavar 40-50mg ED Weeks 1-8
Test Prop 50mg EOD Weeks 1-8
Clomid 50mg ED Weeks 9-11
If bulking, Test Enanthate could be substituted for prop, and 100mg could be injected every 3-4 days...however, this could cause more bloating, and complicate PCT timing.
LIVER PROTECTION
Anavar is a 17 Alpha Alkylated steroid, and is toxic. It has been shown to be less toxic than other orals, and is even used as liver treatment for recovering alcoholics. Still, i would limit my time using it to 8 weeks, 10 at the most.
It would be beneficial to you liver to use several different OTC supplements during, and perhaps after your cycle. A few preventive measures never hurt anyone .
1 - Milk Thistle
The classic liver protectant herb.supposedly works by blocking the entrance of harmful substances to liver cells, and hastening their expulsion. Make sure there is a high standardization of Silymarin
2 - R ALA
A powerful antioxidant
3 - NAC
Supports liver function and production of l-glutathione
4 - Vitamin C and E
Antioxidants
5 - LOADS of water
Helps to flush out your entire system
LIPID PROTECTION
Anavar isnt going to kill your cholesterol levels like some drugs (winny being one of the worst), but it may put your LDL/HDL profiles outside of the normal range. There are a few things that help, but as long as your not using 60+mg daily or running it for more than 10 weeks, i would just use flax...
1 - Flax Oil
Consuming lots of omega fatty acids promotes overall health, as well as helping to keep your lipid profile from becoming too bad.
2 - Policosanol
Used at 20mg daily to keep your HDL (good cholesterol) levels from crashing, and your LDL from becoming too high.
3 - Niacin
Preferably the flush free variety. If you wish, niacin can be used at 1-2g ED for a short period post-cycle to normalize HDL levels. Do not use for more than 7-14 days, as liver toxicity can be an issue when using those dosages of niacin for long periods of tim
MYTHS
Myth #1 - Anavar will not suppress the HPTA.
False. Anavar, used in adequate dosages, will shut you down. To what degree you experience side effects of suppression (loss of libido, lethargy) is entirely dependent upon the individual and the dosages used.
Myth #2 - Var is a weak anabolic, and is not effective unless stacked with a more androgenic compound.
This could not be further from the truth. At dosages of 40mg a day and higher, anavar is incredibly effective at adding water free LBM. At around day 6-7, increased vascularity should become apparent (assuming your oxandrolone is legitimate in its dosing), and strength gains should start appearing around day 14.
If used during a clean bulk, gains of 10-20 pounds are possible. If cutting, you will maintain weight, or even put on 5-10 pounds (depending on the rate of fat loss/severity of diet). You will keep all of your gains with proper PCT.
Myth #3 - Anavar will not require any type of PCT.
This is one ive never understood. It's a pretty commonly known fact now that var is a suppressive compound. So why is it that some individuals still refuse to make a small investment in some clomid/nolva....this is your testicular function we're talking about. That said, PCT required for var is not as "heavy" as PCT for, say, a test/eq cycle. 15-20 days @ 50mg clomid should be sufficient.
LIBIDO
The only real issue of concern that i have found when running anavar alone is slight libido suppression. Anavar is suppressive enough to where you WILL feel a difference in your sex drive (and not for the better ) when using 40+mg a day. There are three options to counteract this.
#1 - Tribulus + Avena Sativa - Trib at 4-7g a day and Avena Sativa at 3-4g a day tend to help prevent any loss in performance or ability to get it up. However, using effective dosages is going to end up being as or more expensive than options 2 or 3...but its your call.
#2 - Proviron - If hairloss is an issue in your choice to use anavar, then you may want to avoid this one. But 25mg ED proviron, starting after week 2, will keep you rock hard. And it will help to harden up your muscles too .
#3 - Maintenance Test Dosage - Finally, you could choose to use testosterone to keep your willy in shape. At a dosage of around 200mg, split bi weekly, everything should keep running smoothly. Also, this will contribute to your gains much moreso than than options 1 or 2. I would keep nolva onhand on the off chance that you are severely gyno prone. Bloating should not be an issue at this dosage.
BENEFITS
Anavar is a badass drug. This is why.
#1 - Vascularity
Oxandrolone will make you veiny as all hell. And quickly. Look out for brand new bulging forearms veins by around day 6. If you are following a cutting regimen, expect new spider webs in your chest, shoulders and quads by around day 21.
#2 - Pumps
When on var, the pumps are constant. Bored sitting in class/at work? Do some unweighted calf raises. After about three minutes, your calves will be ready to pop. Youll be doing something like drinking a cup of water, and after a minute of holding it, your bi will be completely full and pumped. You may have to cut some sets short in the gym due to the painful pumpage.
#3 - Strength
Even when cutting, you can expect new strength gains every workout after about day 14-21.
#4 - Fat Loss
Anavar has been shown to contribute to accelerated fat loss in both subcutaneous and visceral fat, concentrated effects in the abdomen and thigh area. And if youve used the drug, you can attest to this...if you cant sport the 6-8 pack look on var, its not gonna happen .
CYCLE
Anavar should be run @ at least 40mg a day to see all of the benefits it offers. Dosages upwards of 80mg have been shown to exhibit diminishing returns. Also, i cant imagine the intensity of the pumps at that kind of dosage.
Cycle #1
Anavar 40-50mg ED Weeks 1-8
Tribulus 5-8g ED Weeks 1-12
Avena Sativa 2-4g ED Weeks 1-12
Clomid 50mg ED Weeks 9-11
Cycle #2
Anavar 40-50mg ED Weeks 1-8
Proviron 25mg ED Weeks 3-8
Clomid 50mg ED Weeks 9-11
Cycle #3
Anavar 40-50mg ED Weeks 1-8
Test Prop 50mg EOD Weeks 1-8
Clomid 50mg ED Weeks 9-11
If bulking, Test Enanthate could be substituted for prop, and 100mg could be injected every 3-4 days...however, this could cause more bloating, and complicate PCT timing.
LIVER PROTECTION
Anavar is a 17 Alpha Alkylated steroid, and is toxic. It has been shown to be less toxic than other orals, and is even used as liver treatment for recovering alcoholics. Still, i would limit my time using it to 8 weeks, 10 at the most.
It would be beneficial to you liver to use several different OTC supplements during, and perhaps after your cycle. A few preventive measures never hurt anyone .
1 - Milk Thistle
The classic liver protectant herb.supposedly works by blocking the entrance of harmful substances to liver cells, and hastening their expulsion. Make sure there is a high standardization of Silymarin
2 - R ALA
A powerful antioxidant
3 - NAC
Supports liver function and production of l-glutathione
4 - Vitamin C and E
Antioxidants
5 - LOADS of water
Helps to flush out your entire system
LIPID PROTECTION
Anavar isnt going to kill your cholesterol levels like some drugs (winny being one of the worst), but it may put your LDL/HDL profiles outside of the normal range. There are a few things that help, but as long as your not using 60+mg daily or running it for more than 10 weeks, i would just use flax...
1 - Flax Oil
Consuming lots of omega fatty acids promotes overall health, as well as helping to keep your lipid profile from becoming too bad.
2 - Policosanol
Used at 20mg daily to keep your HDL (good cholesterol) levels from crashing, and your LDL from becoming too high.
3 - Niacin
Preferably the flush free variety. If you wish, niacin can be used at 1-2g ED for a short period post-cycle to normalize HDL levels. Do not use for more than 7-14 days, as liver toxicity can be an issue when using those dosages of niacin for long periods of tim
Good info!
Nice post PI except there is no evidence Liver Protectors alter the course of drug induced cholestasis.
Do LPs they make ANY difference excluding lining the pockets of supplement companies? NOPE!
Jim
Do LPs they make ANY difference excluding lining the pockets of supplement companies? NOPE!
Jim
joe0035
New Member
Oh Dr. Jim hatin on the supplement companies! [
)] I love me some snake oil!
Doc does have a point though. Id spend a shitload of money on Liv.52, milk thistle and all that other crap. Who knows if it actually works.
Spyder
New Member
This was a while back (not sure if I will be able to find the labs) correct me if I am wrong Dr. Jim but you would be looking at AST and ALT. Well there is a lot more to the story but I will try to make it short I had a hard time realizing that my test gel wasn't working (this had gone on for a while) which put me into depression, etc... and I turned to drinking. Anyway had labs done AST and ALT where high - doctor wanted me to be retested again (same fucking gel was pissed) so another month later with crashed T (this is when the doctor realized that I was not absorbing the gel anymore). I decided to start up LIV 52 (I always use this on and off cycle) again and took it religiously and sure enough both had dropped down into normal range (oh and I was still drinking - I blame the drinking on my low T).
"Cholestasis" literally means static bile or bile flow. What causes it?
Anything which alters the livers ability to metabolize, produce and process bile.
Drugs alcohol, oral contraceptives certain "statin drugs" the list is endless.
Nonetheless there is only ONE intervention proven effective in every reversible case, discontinuing the offending agent, not Liver Aid 2013, HepatoJuice 1000 or LIV52.
Anything which alters the livers ability to metabolize, produce and process bile.
Drugs alcohol, oral contraceptives certain "statin drugs" the list is endless.
Nonetheless there is only ONE intervention proven effective in every reversible case, discontinuing the offending agent, not Liver Aid 2013, HepatoJuice 1000 or LIV52.
@ jim what would you suggest?
Suggest? Sorry PI what is the question?
What would you suggest for live protection?
Ok the answer is SIMPLE really and what is practiced in medicine when hepatotoxic drugs are used.
Limit the dose and the duration of the offending agent and if the circumstances warrant it check hepatic function on a regular basis. If hepatic function declines STOP the drug!
Now you know why they tell you on those "Lipitor" commercials checking LFTS are highly suggested in the first few months of therapy and why they DONT say to take a heaping dose of liver aid BID, lol!
So for Var limit the dose to no more than 40-50 mg (twice the recommended dose) and for no more than 6 weeks (preferably four).
Having said all that it probably doesn't matter because 99% of BB and lifters are young, healthy with intact hepatic reparative capabilities.
Consequently all these "Liver protectors" are nothing more than more "bro bunk" or "snake oil" if you prefer.
So save your money for a post work out protein shake.
Jim
Limit the dose and the duration of the offending agent and if the circumstances warrant it check hepatic function on a regular basis. If hepatic function declines STOP the drug!
Now you know why they tell you on those "Lipitor" commercials checking LFTS are highly suggested in the first few months of therapy and why they DONT say to take a heaping dose of liver aid BID, lol!
So for Var limit the dose to no more than 40-50 mg (twice the recommended dose) and for no more than 6 weeks (preferably four).
Having said all that it probably doesn't matter because 99% of BB and lifters are young, healthy with intact hepatic reparative capabilities.
Consequently all these "Liver protectors" are nothing more than more "bro bunk" or "snake oil" if you prefer.
So save your money for a post work out protein shake.
Jim
Gotcha thanks Jim
