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Here it comes, fuel crisis is going to cascade to other sectors

Hogg

Hogg

New Member
This is exactly what I have been waiting for. There comes a point in time when people say "to hell with it, its too expensive and I'm not doing it".


This trucker has come to the conclusion that it is not worth his time to haul for less profit. The state and fed lose revenue and if more like him band together, their voice will be heard.

The parallel here is the taxpayer in the higher brackets. I'd love to see a republican rally in California wherein we take a one month sabbatical without pay and punish the state and federal government by leaving them without a tax base. The question is, what happens when the majority contributor decides that he will no longer burden the load placed on his shoulders? Then what? We'll see how the lower tax brackets respond when called upon to take up the slack....the reality is, they cant.

Change can only come about when people make a stand (within the confines of the constitution of course). Deciding to sit on the sidelines and not play in the game is one way to make your voice heard.



http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...ieselpricesarebringingsometruckstoastandstill
 
Hogg said:
This is exactly what I have been waiting for. There comes a point in time when people say "to hell with it, its too expensive and I'm not doing it".


This trucker has come to the conclusion that it is not worth his time to haul for less profit. The state and fed lose revenue and if more like him band together, their voice will be heard.

The parallel here is the taxpayer in the higher brackets. I'd love to see a republican rally in California wherein we take a one month sabbatical without pay and punish the state and federal government by leaving them without a tax base. The question is, what happens when the majority contributor decides that he will no longer burden the load placed on his shoulders? Then what? We'll see how the lower tax brackets respond when called upon to take up the slack....the reality is, they cant.

Change can only come about when people make a stand (within the confines of the constitution of course). Deciding to sit on the sidelines and not play in the game is one way to make your voice heard.



http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...ieselpricesarebringingsometruckstoastandstill
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JamesT said:
Great Article Mr Hogg. It is to bad though that we house more billionaires and millionairs than any other state and they are still going to be driven around no matter how hi the gas goes UP...
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Wrong attitude James. Consider the fact that you are the one who is envied by those who make $ 15-20/hr and they feel that you should pay more taxes than they do since you make more. Now retrace your sentiments about those who hold $ 1MM of net worth or more. $ 1MM is really not a lot of money.....starting from scratch, it takes a long time to make the first MM, but thereafter, it stacks up pretty quick. You see.....so really, that is the next plateau for you and when you get there, after busting your ass and paying lots of taxes along the way, someone will look at you and say "No fair, he has more money than I do"....thats not the way it is suppose to be, it is a capitalist society where you should not be treated unfavorably for putting your balls on the plate and making a buck. Thats my real argument. Yes, there are those who could probably care less if gas hits $ 5/gallon, but God bless them for making the jing to be able to pay for it. At their level, the word "HALF" is one of the first ten words in their vocabulary, because the government gets HALF of their taxable earnings. Imagine making $ 1MM a year......if you have no write-offs, you're going to lose $ 500K of it....so you buy things, leveraging yourself out so that you can write off interest...and granted, you own things yet you do not own them, you are simply a cog in a perpetual system....buying a bigger house to have more interest to write off....yet you still have to pay the mortgage....it really is a flawed system. Consider if that $ 1MM in income suddenly evaporated and the market is in a downturn, thereby leaving you covering the gap on your $ 3MM home......imagine buying something that ends up worth $ 300K less than what you bought it for.....these things happen to those who are 'somewhat rich' but not rich enough to be impervious to economic downturns.

Now imagine if that guy who earns $ 1MM decides that he doesnt want to play anymore. Maybe he grabs hold of $ 200K tax free and decides he is going to live in a studio in long beach for $ 900/mth and pursue some type of intellectual or spiritual endeavor and totally drop out of the workforce. He no longer pays taxes or interest. Yes, he is still a part of the system as a result of his rent, groceries, and utilities, but he consumes far less and generates far less revenue for others as when he was leveraged out, making a million a year, and paying taxes. If 300 others like him did the same thing, assuming that he manages to pay only about $ 300K per year in taxes, then the state and fed loses $ 90MM in taxes. If others followed a similar program in affluent states in the country, the number becomes larger and larger.

Now how many blue collar democrats does it take to contribute $ 90MM into the tax system per year? Well, assuming a wage of $ 20/hr single income household and they leave their wives at home and have a shitload of kids so lets figure that they pay roughly.....eh, considering that each kids worth $ 2500 apiece plus they get head of household and they can claim their wife, I'd guess that they pay roughly $ 4,160.00 per year in taxes after their refund. So given the foregoing calculation, it takes 21,634 single income democrats to put as much into the pot as 300 millionaires paying 30% of their total income. Now tell me that is fair. And mind you, as I said earlier, a millionaire is not rich, you cant retire on a million bucks and live 20 years off of it. My parents' friend are always bitching about how they had a million in the bank and cant do much of anything in their retirement.
 
Hogg said:
Wrong attitude James. Consider the fact that you are the one who is envied by those who make $ 15-20/hr and they feel that you should pay more taxes than they do since you make more. Now retrace your sentiments about those who hold $ 1MM of net worth or more. $ 1MM is really not a lot of money.....starting from scratch, it takes a long time to make the first MM, but thereafter, it stacks up pretty quick. You see.....so really, that is the next plateau for you and when you get there, after busting your ass and paying lots of taxes along the way, someone will look at you and say "No fair, he has more money than I do"....thats not the way it is suppose to be, it is a capitalist society where you should not be treated unfavorably for putting your balls on the plate and making a buck. Thats my real argument. Yes, there are those who could probably care less if gas hits $ 5/gallon, but God bless them for making the jing to be able to pay for it. At their level, the word "HALF" is one of the first ten words in their vocabulary, because the government gets HALF of their taxable earnings. Imagine making $ 1MM a year......if you have no write-offs, you're going to lose $ 500K of it....so you buy things, leveraging yourself out so that you can write off interest...and granted, you own things yet you do not own them, you are simply a cog in a perpetual system....buying a bigger house to have more interest to write off....yet you still have to pay the mortgage....it really is a flawed system. Consider if that $ 1MM in income suddenly evaporated and the market is in a downturn, thereby leaving you covering the gap on your $ 3MM home......imagine buying something that ends up worth $ 300K less than what you bought it for.....these things happen to those who are 'somewhat rich' but not rich enough to be impervious to economic downturns.

Now imagine if that guy who earns $ 1MM decides that he doesnt want to play anymore. Maybe he grabs hold of $ 200K tax free and decides he is going to live in a studio in long beach for $ 900/mth and pursue some type of intellectual or spiritual endeavor and totally drop out of the workforce. He no longer pays taxes or interest. Yes, he is still a part of the system as a result of his rent, groceries, and utilities, but he consumes far less and generates far less revenue for others as when he was leveraged out, making a million a year, and paying taxes. If 300 others like him did the same thing, assuming that he manages to pay only about $ 300K per year in taxes, then the state and fed loses $ 90MM in taxes. If others followed a similar program in affluent states in the country, the number becomes larger and larger.

Now how many blue collar democrats does it take to contribute $ 90MM into the tax system per year? Well, assuming a wage of $ 20/hr single income household and they leave their wives at home and have a shitload of kids so lets figure that they pay roughly.....eh, considering that each kids worth $ 2500 apiece plus they get head of household and they can claim their wife, I'd guess that they pay roughly $ 4,160.00 per year in taxes after their refund. So given the foregoing calculation, it takes 21,634 single income democrats to put as much into the pot as 300 millionaires paying 30% of their total income. Now tell me that is fair. And mind you, as I said earlier, a millionaire is not rich, you cant retire on a million bucks and live 20 years off of it. My parents' friend are always bitching about how they had a million in the bank and cant do much of anything in their retirement.
Click to expand...



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Yeah, James everyone has there own opinions and you gotta respect that.
I disagree with Hogg but would not make those type of comments because I still respect his 'opinion'.
It's just a discussion board. :)
 
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I can't help but point out that the general section rarely has anything to do with steroids. If that's what you care about, then the AAS section might be the appropriate viewing venue.
 
JamesT said:
Its just so funny, every fucking relpy has got to be speech coming out of your mouth. Sometimes I think you forget this a steroid board and who really gives a flying fuck about your mumbo jumbo....Well your a mod, I guess with nothing better to do, so to each his own....James
Click to expand...

Didnt take long for you to show your true colors eh James?
 
I agree. Somewhere along the line there was a breakdown in his upbringing in regards to respect and tactfulness. Its too bad, as you have a lot to offer people my/his age.
 
but you are prabably to busy for a low class person like me. BTW I am being honest when I say that.

the only reason that you're low class is because you think you are. as far as having a tuff life...get over it brother. time to move on. we've all had our fair share of misfortune in one way or another. pull yourself up by your boot straps and get going...going on with your life that is. maybe you just need a good ol' fashioned ass whoopin'!! it might knock some sense into ya boy...because it seems like you've got your head up your ass.

if you dont like your life...change it!

BTW...i'm a HS drop-out. no college, just a GED. my parents moved us over to this great country when i was 2. so you'll get no sympathy here my friend.

consider this tuff love.

have a nice day
 
Taxation is a difficult problem. If a progressive tax is unfair (which almost by definition it is) then what other tax method should the government use?

Flat taxes wouldnt raise enough revenue, at least with government spending this high.

A National Sales Tax (at the moment) is unconsitutional. There would have to be an amendment added to the Constitution, which is very difficult.

Taxation, in my opinion, really wouldnt be an issue if people would stop demanding so much of government. The more the goverment provides, the higher the cost of government will be. And considering the government has grown under both Republican (at 2%) and Democratic (at 3%) administrations, I dont see government getting smaller anytime soon.

P.S. Hogg, I would love to see a tax strike. But only in my dreams...
 
I am all for a flat tax with no deductions. 15% across the board. That is roughly what people pay now as a % of AGI anyway, once deductions are taken into account.
 
I dont think that lower-income families are willing to pay the same percentage as upper-income families. Could you imagine the uproar of "discrimination" and "politicians only help the rich?" It would be insane.

Look at taxation today. Bush wants to give a tax cut to those who pay 50%, and lower income people still yell "unfair." And you think they will let them only be taxed 15%?

This is a difficult problem, no?
 
Difficult for sure, as poor people have a bad perception. If they only realized that they basically get a free ride when it comes to tazes and social services. The rich pay for damn near everything.

This ends up being another progressive system, but how bout 15% for those making 100k+ and 12% for those under $100k?
 
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