I am a fucking mess and I need help.

The_Skeptic

New Member
I am 38 years old and I recently realized that I have a serious condition of Adrenal Fatigue. This shouldnt be surprising considering Ive been on TRT for more than ten years as well as either Adderall or Ritalin for my ADHD.

And Ive been under an extreme amount of stress over the past three years where I lost a job, broke up with a live-in girlfriend, was blacklisted from other jobs in the industry and was forced to move back into mothers house.

I have since moved into my own place and started my own business, but the stress, of course, is still there in just trying to make a living. Ive been self-medicating with my TRT these last two years because I have no insurance and I dont have any confidence in doctors anyway.

The problem is I cant even function most of the time. I wake up in the morning and I have no energy and my brain is so foggy. I work from my computer most of the time and I usually cant get into the work groove until 4 p.m. or so.

I am a chronic insomniac and sometimes I am so tired at having not slept the night before that I cant function during any part of the day. At night, when I feel I am going to get a good nights sleep because I am so tired, I suddenly become wide awake where my heart starts pounding and my mind starts running. So the pattern repeats itself.

I started taking Ambien and that worked at first, but lately Ive developed a tolerance to it. Sometimes I pound a few beers and that makes me feel good for a while. Maybe it has something to do with the increase of testosterone in the brain, as studies have indicated. But that is not a solution. Plus, the next mornings I feel worse than before.

Ive been secondary hypogonadic since before puberty because I suffered a traumatic brain injury as a child. This is also probably why I have ADHD and have always been an insomniac.

Even though I always knew something was wrong with me because I never completed puberty, remaining in Tanners Fourth Stage instead of reaching the final Fifth Stage, doctors always told me I was normal. Not that they ever conducted any blood tests on me.

It wasnt until I was 26 years old and had done some extensive research in the library (the days before internet) that I realized I needed to see an endocrinologist. He took some blood tests and my T level was 293, meaning I had the T level of an old man.

He gave me a prescription of Testosterone and I ended up leaving to Europe for two years, so was never able to do any follow ups. It was around this time that I also got on Ritalin after realizing I had been struggling with ADHD all my life.

For the first few months, I felt like a new man. Actually, for the first time in my life, I felt like a man. My libido was excellent, my mind was sharp and my confidence was high.

And although there were times when I was able to have three orgasms in one night, something I was never able to do before, there were also times when I couldnt get it up.

So this became the pattern for the next ten years. A few years ago I asked my endo why did the T seem so inconsistent. After all, I was under the impression that testosterone was supposed to increase libido, not decrease it.

He recommended I double-up my dosage, meaning I went from 200 mg every two weeks to 200 mg every week. That, of course, only made things worse.

In other words, not one of the four endos I visited during that ten year period knew anything about escalating E2 levels. In fact, it wasnt until I discovered this forum that I learned about E2s effect on the body from T injections.

Since joining this forum in Dec 2005, I started using HCG and Arimidex. But the problems still persist. My libido sucks or even if its good, my erections suck.

I now realize I most likely have hypothyroidism and adrenal fatigue. I did the blood pressure test where you take it laying down, then stand up and take it again immediately and my BP drops instead of increases. This is a sign of hypothyroidism.

Ive also done the temperature tests and my temperature is always more than one degree lower than 98.6, indicating adrenal fatigue. Plus, I feel burnt out all the time. Its been like this for the last two or three years.

Now I am on a quest to remedy my adrenal glands and normalize my thyroid. I started using OTC hydrocortisone cream and it makes me feel better.

Ive since ordered Armour and Cortex, but Ive read that I should probably take the Cortex before the Armour.

Would someone please recommend dosages and strategies to help me overcome this adrenal/thyroid issue?
 
I think that you have the results of these two backwards... IMO

I now realize I most likely have hypothyroidism and adrenal fatigue. I did the blood pressure test where you take it laying down, then stand up and take it again immediately and my BP drops instead of increases. This is a sign of hypothyroidism.

Ive also done the temperature tests and my temperature is always more than one degree lower than 98.6, indicating adrenal fatigue. Plus, I feel burnt out all the time. Its been like this for the last two or three years.

I think that the first one "can" indicate adrenal fatigue (as well as a few other things) while the second one "can" indicate hypothroidism (as well as a couple other things).

IMO, I would get blood checks done for Free T3 and Free T4 thyroid hormone levels and a 24-hour Urinary Free Cortisol test done before I would jump the gun and start self-medicating on a couple wild guesses.

My temperature almost always runs .5 to 1.2 degrees under 98.6 - and my thyroid hormone levels are in excelllent ranges, I have good energy, etc. - and am clearly NOT hypothyroid... nor do I have "adrenal fatigue". Actually I have a slight case of just the opposite, of cortisol in the upper normal ranges... due - the doctors tell me - to the high amounts of stress that I have gone through. BTW, some of the symptoms of that elevated cortisol (upper normal to occasional above normal ranges)? Insomnia, racing thoughts at night, mild anxiety (comes and goes), foggy thinking (at times), fatigue, lack of energy, etc. Interestingly, when my cortisol levels first climbed up into those ranges (over a relatively short time period), I initially felt really good, even euphoric at times - but then it crashed. That euphoric feeling is apparently fairly common with initial stages of higher levels of cortisol (which is what you may be doing by self-medicating and adding more cortisol to what already "might" be a high cortisol problem).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cushing's_disease
(This site is more advanced as relates to Cushing's patients, people with ultra high levels of cortisol... but you get the point if you just scale it back several degrees).

Also, I think that I'd try a regimen of various Adaptogens to rebuild and rejuvenate a flagging thyroid system and // or adrenal system befoer jumping right in with Armour and Cortex, but hey, that just IMO....
 
Sorry to hear about your problems Skeptic. I am in somewhat of a similar situation that T did nothing for me. Your ED/Low libido could definitelly be from hypothryoidism.

Why not go and see Dr Marianco? This stuff is way complex and i truelly believe that you need someone on his level to give proper and true answers for these hormonal conditions.

I am not wasting anymore time trying to deal with this on my own, i am flying out this week to see him, so i can start getting myself back on track.
 
" I did the blood pressure test where you take it laying down, then stand up and take it again immediately and my BP drops instead of increases. This is a sign of hypothyroidism. "
This iscertainly not a difinitive test for anything. There are many cause of postural hypotension.

"Sometimes I pound a few beers and that makes me feel good for a while. Maybe it has something to do with the increase of testosterone in the brain, as studies have indicated. But that is not a solution. "
Could you please post a link or a clue where yu found these studies ? Ive been interested in this for years but have never found a shread of evidence that its true.

I think you need a LOT of blood work. Otherwise youre shooting in the dark Check out the hypothalmus, pituitary, gonads, adrenals, thyroid- the whole thing. Gonna be expensive. I can see thats going to be a problem.
 
The_Skeptic said:
Well even if I have the two backwards, they still equal up to the same. I am a fucking mess and I need help.
Post all (recent) blood tests that you have, value, units, range.
 
He recommended I double-up my dosage, meaning I went from 200 mg every two weeks to 200 mg every week. That, of course, only made things worse.

In other words, not one of the four endos I visited during that ten year period knew anything about escalating E2 levels. In fact, it wasnt until I discovered this forum that I learned about E2s effect on the body from T injections.


It seems obvious that what you are going through is the same as what I went through a number of years ago. I wouldnt worry about hyperthyroidism or Cushings etc, because that should have been diagnosed by now.

Although alot of males who went through the growth hormone program of the 70's and 80's as kids, the fatality rate is extreamly high caused by adrenal failure. One of the main reasons is because the medical industry has forgotten about us and have left us for dead, but not all of us are prepared to accept it and fight on.

Like yourself as a primary sufferer also cause by TBI (elevated FSH), I never reached Tanner Stage 5 either. But I refer to your comments above, because the same thing happened to me with T shots and the elevated E2 with physical effects also.

Obviously there is some connection with prepubertal teticular failure, ADHD, sleep disorders (RLS) and PAIS, and I resolved these issues with Testosterone implants alone. I now finf myself on no other medication while implants resolved these issues.
 
Skeptic my heart goes out to you I after 24 yrs of this crap am finely at 100% I co-mod at the Men's Thyroid at STTM site you need to go there if you have not done so all ready and read this whole site. They were a big help to me in getting my life back on track.
http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/
You can find me here.
http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/community/viewforum.php?f=2
and here.
http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/community/viewforum.php?f=10&sid=d29cad3ed6e8657adecfbab75bf5585b
Everything you have wrong I have but the puberty problem. Your not sleeping because your cortisol levels being low will bring your sugar down at night and your adrenaline up after I started treating my Adrenals and Thyroid this went away.

Here is a cut & paste of how I got started treating my Adrenals and Thyroid but if you find your estradiol high you need to treat this first.
It was sent to a Bill
===============================================
Bill sorry to hear you have this problem your cortisol is lower then my first test I was 8. The ACTH Stim test will show if it's you Adrenals or your Pituitary not sending the message ACTH to your Adrenals to make Cortisol. Here is a link to Chris's Explaination of the ACTH test you need to read this I have seen posts where Dr.'s did it wrong. You need to be sure you understand about this test and how to read it.
http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/community/viewtopic.php?t=288.

Most people find out they have low cortisol because they have a low Thyroid Problem one needs cortisol to carry the thyroid hormone from the blood to the cells. If there cortisol is low do to Adrenal Fatigue there is not enough cortisol to do this and as they up there meds they start to feel hyper because the hormone is going to high in the blood and not being carried to the cells. One big cause of Adrenal Fatigue is a low Thyroid the Adrenals work over time to bring up levels of thyroid and become fatigued.

Now we are finding a lot of men with low T had Adrenal Fatigue do to the stress of low T be it from the fatigue of low T or the high Estradiol. But it's dam odd that as men hear about this and are not feeling 100% on TRT that after a blood test there cortisol levels are low.

The first thing I did was to try and figure out what stage of Adrenal Fatigue I was at and it looked like stage 3.
http://www.chronicfatigue.org/Selye large.html

Then I went to this site and printed out a chart for tracking your body's temps. I would take it under my arm before getting out of bed for 10 min.'s if it is under 97.8 you have a thyroid problem my temps that I did were for 4 morning and then I did an avg. it was 95.8.
http://www.drrind.com/tempgraph.asp#directions
Using this to take my temps it is also sold at Wall-Greens and Wal-mart.
http://www.wilsonsthyroidsyndrome.com/Products/Thermometer.htm

Then after I was up for 3 hrs I took my temp every 3 hrs 3 to 4 times a day and did an avg. My avg. was low between 96.8 to 97.6 and each day was up or down this is Adrenal Fatigue.

I then ordered a Saliva Test through this link.
http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info/
From the Canary Club for about $140.00 this is the best way to test cortisol levels and DHEA.

Then I bought the book "Adrenal Fatigue The 21st. Century by Wilson. This book was a big help in understanding this problem but doing what he said to treat it with stuff like this did nothing to my temp chart. It has this in it Pituitary Extract (Freeze-Dried) 120 mg
Adrenal Cortex Extract 33 mg and cortisol but you have no idea how much.
http://www.myvitanet.com/adsolfrac50c.html
Also he said to do B Vit.s.
http://www.myvitanet.com/endfadaenbco.html
Vit. C
http://www.myvitanet.com/supbiocbuf36.html
Everyone with low Cortisol has low DHEA I take this 2 a day.
http://www.myvitanet.com/dhea260capph.html
I take 3 grams of a good brand of Fish OIL. I buy mine at Coscos (spelling) I get the one that is coated so you don't burp it up.
And there is Maca this helps keep your Adrenal hormones leveled. I was off this for 30 days and just went back on it I feel better on this. I do 1/2 tsp 2 x's a day. This is the best price and product on he web.
http://www.macaweb.com/view.cfm/hurl/pid=1033/Maca-Powerreg--454g1-lbs-Raw-Maca-Powder

I dropped the Adrenal cortex
http://www.myvitanet.com/adsolfrac50c.html
It did nothing.

I got some Isocort and started on it it is made from sheep adrenal's and wow the first pill made me feel good you need to start this slow. I did 4 pills = 10mgs. of cortisol first thing in the morning with food and 2 pills = 5mgs. of cortisol at noon and dinner. This changed my chart my temps come up to 98.4 to 99 but still up and down if your avg. is up or down from day to day more then .2 tenths your cortisol is still to low. I followed this to get started.
http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info/how-to-treat
My Dr. would not give me Hydrocortisone said it's not safe to use. So I got this book by Dr. Jefferies "Safe Uses of Cortisol"
http://members.aol.com/jefferiesw/
http://www.ccthomas.com/details.cfm?P_ISBN=039807500X
Showed this to my Dr. and he blew it off and pissed me off.
I got up to 120mgs of Armour and could not do more my charting even showed my Adrenals were not right to go higher. So I switched to HC and stated with 10mgs. in the morning wow in less then a week my temps were a straight line across at 98.6 first time in 8 months of charting things were looking good and I was feeling better. So if you need to treat your Adrenals the best place for help is Val. at this link.
http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/community/viewforum.php?f=5
Most of the people posting there are Thyroid and Adrenal Fatigue but she helps for Adrenals only too. Do get your thyroid checked have the TSH, Free T4 and Free T3 checked and post them to her.

The_Skeptic said:
I am 38 years old and I recently realized that I have a serious condition of Adrenal Fatigue. This shouldnt be surprising considering Ive been on TRT for more than ten years as well as either Adderall or Ritalin for my ADHD.

And Ive been under an extreme amount of stress over the past three years where I lost a job, broke up with a live-in girlfriend, was blacklisted from other jobs in the industry and was forced to move back into mothers house.

I have since moved into my own place and started my own business, but the stress, of course, is still there in just trying to make a living. Ive been self-medicating with my TRT these last two years because I have no insurance and I dont have any confidence in doctors anyway.

The problem is I cant even function most of the time. I wake up in the morning and I have no energy and my brain is so foggy. I work from my computer most of the time and I usually cant get into the work groove until 4 p.m. or so.

I am a chronic insomniac and sometimes I am so tired at having not slept the night before that I cant function during any part of the day. At night, when I feel I am going to get a good nights sleep because I am so tired, I suddenly become wide awake where my heart starts pounding and my mind starts running. So the pattern repeats itself.

I started taking Ambien and that worked at first, but lately Ive developed a tolerance to it. Sometimes I pound a few beers and that makes me feel good for a while. Maybe it has something to do with the increase of testosterone in the brain, as studies have indicated. But that is not a solution. Plus, the next mornings I feel worse than before.

Ive been secondary hypogonadic since before puberty because I suffered a traumatic brain injury as a child. This is also probably why I have ADHD and have always been an insomniac.

Even though I always knew something was wrong with me because I never completed puberty, remaining in Tanners Fourth Stage instead of reaching the final Fifth Stage, doctors always told me I was normal. Not that they ever conducted any blood tests on me.

It wasnt until I was 26 years old and had done some extensive research in the library (the days before internet) that I realized I needed to see an endocrinologist. He took some blood tests and my T level was 293, meaning I had the T level of an old man.

He gave me a prescription of Testosterone and I ended up leaving to Europe for two years, so was never able to do any follow ups. It was around this time that I also got on Ritalin after realizing I had been struggling with ADHD all my life.

For the first few months, I felt like a new man. Actually, for the first time in my life, I felt like a man. My libido was excellent, my mind was sharp and my confidence was high.

And although there were times when I was able to have three orgasms in one night, something I was never able to do before, there were also times when I couldnt get it up.

So this became the pattern for the next ten years. A few years ago I asked my endo why did the T seem so inconsistent. After all, I was under the impression that testosterone was supposed to increase libido, not decrease it.

He recommended I double-up my dosage, meaning I went from 200 mg every two weeks to 200 mg every week. That, of course, only made things worse.

In other words, not one of the four endos I visited during that ten year period knew anything about escalating E2 levels. In fact, it wasnt until I discovered this forum that I learned about E2s effect on the body from T injections.

Since joining this forum in Dec 2005, I started using HCG and Arimidex. But the problems still persist. My libido sucks or even if its good, my erections suck.

I now realize I most likely have hypothyroidism and adrenal fatigue. I did the blood pressure test where you take it laying down, then stand up and take it again immediately and my BP drops instead of increases. This is a sign of hypothyroidism.

Ive also done the temperature tests and my temperature is always more than one degree lower than 98.6, indicating adrenal fatigue. Plus, I feel burnt out all the time. Its been like this for the last two or three years.

Now I am on a quest to remedy my adrenal glands and normalize my thyroid. I started using OTC hydrocortisone cream and it makes me feel better.

Ive since ordered Armour and Cortex, but Ive read that I should probably take the Cortex before the Armour.

Would someone please recommend dosages and strategies to help me overcome this adrenal/thyroid issue?
 
I am out of here on this one... This type of self-medicating on what one is guessing at... and even worse on what someone else's symptoms are (Phil, IMO you should start worrying about getting sued for someone getting hurt by your constantly telling them how just alike their symptoms are to what you went through and then recommending specific treatments that duplicate your own... because when you publish them in the manner that you do, you're inferring a recommendation - and begging for a lawsuit IMHO).

This is just crazy. This guy needs a complete work up (I notice he never did respond as to whether he's actually had his cortisol checked at all - much less proeprly checked).

Respond as you will, but I'm done with this thread!

My guess is that this guy is going to end up worse off than he already has been at this rate.
 
First thing I have been reading his posts for a dam long time and if you read my reply all I talk about is testing. I am undre a Dr.'s care I don't do self medicating.
Here is what his said.
"Ive since ordered Armour and Cortex, but Ive read that I should probably take the Cortex before the Armour.

Would someone please recommend dosages and strategies to help me overcome this adrenal/thyroid issue?" I think you need to re read my post and the links in it. And I am not telling him how to treat him self just telling him how I did this with the help of my Dr. and the stie STTM.
HandyAndy said:
I am out of here on this one... This type of self-medicating on what one is guessing at... and even worse on what someone else's symptoms are (Phil, IMO you should start worrying about getting sued for someone getting hurt by your constantly telling them how just alike their symptoms are to what you went through and then recommending specific treatments that duplicate your own... because when you publish them in the manner that you do, you're inferring a recommendation - and begging for a lawsuit IMHO).

This is just crazy. This guy needs a complete work up (I notice he never did respond as to whether he's actually had his cortisol checked at all - much less proeprly checked).

Respond as you will, but I'm done with this thread!

My guess is that this guy is going to end up worse off than he already has been at this rate.
 
HandyAndy said:
I am out of here on this one... This type of self-medicating on what one is guessing at... and even worse on what someone else's symptoms are (Phil, IMO you should start worrying about getting sued for someone getting hurt by your constantly telling them how just alike their symptoms are to what you went through and then recommending specific treatments that duplicate your own... because when you publish them in the manner that you do, you're inferring a recommendation - and begging for a lawsuit IMHO).

This is just crazy. This guy needs a complete work up (I notice he never did respond as to whether he's actually had his cortisol checked at all - much less proeprly checked).

Respond as you will, but I'm done with this thread!

My guess is that this guy is going to end up worse off than he already has been at this rate.
Low testosterone and or thyroid make some people behave like psychos.
No ofence to sick people.
Thank you Phil for staying around.
I am not a doctor.
 
Last edited:
Megazoid,

I sent Marianco an email last week inquiring about me flying out there, but he has not written back yet.

Jansz,

I've never had any extensive thyroid blood tests done and have some basic hormone tests over the years.

In January 1995 at the age of 26, right before I got on TRT:[

Testosterone was 236 (225-900)

Prolactin was 4.6 ng/ml (0.1-18.1)

FSH was 4 IU/ml (0.5-20)

LH was 2.5 IU/ml (0.5-18)

TSH was .90 IU/ml (0.0-5.0)

In November 1996, after more than 18 months on TRT:[

Testosterone 26 nmol/L (8.7-33)

Prolactin 186 mU/1 (70-413)

FSH 0.1 U/1 (1.0-11.0)

LH .6 U/1 (1.0-6.0)

In January 1999, basic blood test revealed that my TSH was 1.11 (.4-4.6)

In July 1999, they did an MRI to determine if I had a pituitary tumor.

The report states "the MRI of your pituitary gland reveals a normal size but some variations in density in different paths of the gland. This could be consistent with the history of meningitis and the lack of adequate sex hormones."

Blood tests they did that day revealed that my Testosterone was 237 (400-1080), free testosterone 10.3 (18-39)

TSH was 1.53 (.36-4)

Report said that "cortisol is normal at 21.4 mcg/dl".

The report concludes by stating "this is consistent with the lack of adequate hypothalamic-pituitary function and the need for testosterone for the rest of your life."

In December 2000, a basic blood test (did not check for testosterone or estrogen) my TSH was 1.42 (.35-5.5)

In January 2007, I went to a local clinic to try and get some extensive bloodwork, but they failed to test my thyroid or cortisol levels.

My testosterone was 6.29 (1.75-7.81 ng/mL)
DHT was 305 (160-660)
E2 was 17 L (20-75) I am not sure if these ranges refer only to women.

ZKT

The effects of alcohol increasing testosterone in the brain has been discussed here before from a lab study.

https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/134240985

I agree with you that I need a whole bunch of lab work, but it's expensive.


Cryptochid


How much do the pellets cost you? If I buy some insurance, is there a chance they will cover it? Did the pellets ever help you reach Tanner's Fifth Stage?

Pgamer,

I appreciate your constant support and wealth of information. I think I will try the Canary Club saliva test.


HandyAndy


Since joining this forum in Dec 2005, Phil's advice has helped me more than the five different endocrinologists I have visited over the last ten years.

Although I ended up self-medicating because of circumstances in my life that left me with no insurance, I also felt that I was getting nowhere with my condition by depending on endocrinologists.

In 2005, I visited an endo and asked for a prescription for HCG and was refused. That was the last straw for me. I ended up finding other sources for HCG that don't require a prescription and from there, I haven't looked back.

I will get some tests done, but I have no doubt that I have Adrenal Fatigue and hypothyroidism. I've learned how to listen to my body.

If I would have relied on doctors, I would have never visited an endo in the first place back in 1995 because all the doctors prior to that told me I was completely normal when I knew damn well I was far from normal.

Hell, it was Phil who told me that escalating E2 levels were contributing to my crashing libido. You would think one of the five endos I visited over the last ten years would have been able to inform me of that little detail.
 
Skeptic, I've emailed Marianco a fair amount in the past month or so (maybe 2/3 times just to ask small quesitions) and i haven't recieved anything back either. I remember he told me he was working on a book though, so i expect he's allot more busy than unsual. The best thing todo is call his office. His website is Definitive Psychiatry (www.definitivepsychiatry.com), which contains the phone numbers, etc.

I definitelly feel with that TSH over 1, hypo could be possible (espically since it was more apparent with the E2 rise. Did you ever try HCG while on TRT, how did you feel?
 
The_Skeptic said:
Megazoid,

I sent Marianco an email last week inquiring about me flying out there, but he has not written back yet.

Jansz,

I've never had any extensive thyroid blood tests done and have some basic hormone tests over the years.

In January 1995 at the age of 26, right before I got on TRT:[

Testosterone was 236 (225-900)

Prolactin was 4.6 ng/ml (0.1-18.1)

FSH was 4 IU/ml (0.5-20)

LH was 2.5 IU/ml (0.5-18)

TSH was .90 IU/ml (0.0-5.0)

In November 1996, after more than 18 months on TRT:[

Testosterone 26 nmol/L (8.7-33)

Prolactin 186 mU/1 (70-413)

FSH 0.1 U/1 (1.0-11.0)

LH .6 U/1 (1.0-6.0)

In January 1999, basic blood test revealed that my TSH was 1.11 (.4-4.6)

In July 1999, they did an MRI to determine if I had a pituitary tumor.

The report states "the MRI of your pituitary gland reveals a normal size but some variations in density in different paths of the gland. This could be consistent with the history of meningitis and the lack of adequate sex hormones."

Blood tests they did that day revealed that my Testosterone was 237 (400-1080), free testosterone 10.3 (18-39)

TSH was 1.53 (.36-4)

Report said that "cortisol is normal at 21.4 mcg/dl".

The report concludes by stating "this is consistent with the lack of adequate hypothalamic-pituitary function and the need for testosterone for the rest of your life."

In December 2000, a basic blood test (did not check for testosterone or estrogen) my TSH was 1.42 (.35-5.5)

In January 2007, I went to a local clinic to try and get some extensive bloodwork, but they failed to test my thyroid or cortisol levels.

My testosterone was 6.29 (1.75-7.81 ng/mL)
DHT was 305 (160-660)
E2 was 17 L (20-75) I am not sure if these ranges refer only to women.

ZKT

The effects of alcohol increasing testosterone in the brain has been discussed here before from a lab study.

https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/134240985

I agree with you that I need a whole bunch of lab work, but it's expensive.


Cryptochid


How much do the pellets cost you? If I buy some insurance, is there a chance they will cover it? Did the pellets ever help you reach Tanner's Fifth Stage?

Pgamer,

I appreciate your constant support and wealth of information. I think I will try the Canary Club saliva test.


HandyAndy


Since joining this forum in Dec 2005, Phil's advice has helped me more than the five different endocrinologists I have visited over the last ten years.

Although I ended up self-medicating because of circumstances in my life that left me with no insurance, I also felt that I was getting nowhere with my condition by depending on endocrinologists.

In 2005, I visited an endo and asked for a prescription for HCG and was refused. That was the last straw for me. I ended up finding other sources for HCG that don't require a prescription and from there, I haven't looked back.

I will get some tests done, but I have no doubt that I have Adrenal Fatigue and hypothyroidism. I've learned how to listen to my body.

If I would have relied on doctors, I would have never visited an endo in the first place back in 1995 because all the doctors prior to that told me I was completely normal when I knew damn well I was far from normal.

Hell, it was Phil who told me that escalating E2 levels were contributing to my crashing libido. You would think one of the five endos I visited over the last ten years would have been able to inform me of that little detail.
Clarify your goals, make a point to:
Test FreeT3 and use enough Armour Thyroid to keep it in (0-20%) of top range.
Test BioAvailable testosterone and use enough Tcypionate to keep it (0-20%) of top range.
Use HCG if you want to keep tests, not realy important, may come back to this latter
Test BioAvailable Estrogen keep it (0-20%) of top range. (I think you will have to raise it)

Do T shots often, E3D, E2D
Pellets are expensive plus you may end up with larger variations in the blood T levels except they will be slow in coming.

When you keep above in check, it will be that much easier to get a handle on the rest of your remaining problems.
These are only 3 numbers, you can keep them lined up.
 
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Cryptochid


How much do the pellets cost you? If I buy some insurance, is there a chance they will cover it? Did the pellets ever help you reach Tanner's Fifth Stage?


Unlike you guys in the USA, here in Oz, we dont need insurance as its covered by our National Health Scheme (medicare). It did bring me to Tanner Stage 5
 
Vforcer2 said:
Hi Crypto,

I was not aware of this. Is there research to back that up?
I have talked to alot of me on pellets I even tried them as for E2 and pellets. Most of the men never had E2 tested one guy at the H2 group pushs pellets and every 4 months flys to see a Dr. to get them put in. Yet he has bad ED and to get it up for sex he gives him self a shot in his penis to get it hard. I have told this guy to get his E2 tested he maybe very high and this could be why he has ED. No such luck and the price of pellets in the U.S. for treatment of low T is off the charts and not covered my any health plains.

I know of men on pellets doing dam good but also have high E2 and take Arimidex to keep it down. So this is not true we are all not the same Dr. Shippen use to feel pellets were the best treatment for TRT but his book is old he now treats him self with shots subq every 3 days he says this is the best for keeping E2 down. As for going to stage 7 any kind of T treatment would do this if your body is able.
 
With a low e2 this could cause thyroid to push really hard and over time this could wear out the adrenals ending up in adrenal imbalnace slowing the t4 to t3 conversion The best thing to do is to start out on small amounts of cortef may be 5 mgs a day for few days then add in another 5 mgs and just feel it out. Before going on adrenal support first of all you need to check salavia test. With low estrogen on can also suppect possible to have low igf- as well and this will also hamper the t4 to t3 conversion. You need gh for t4 to t3 conversion and you need t3 to make gh so its a vicious cycle. Having a low e2 can cause low serotonin and increase norephepherine in the begining stages over time ti can which also puts more strain on the adrenals leading to depression. Identifying the adrenals would be first prioriity and then possible addressing the neurochemistry would be secondary. This scenrio has been repertitive of people keeping body fat too low for too long dricving there estrogen into the ground (common with crash dieting and contrest prep w or wo steroids use). Low estrogen also causes fat to deposit in liver and also begins to affect the lipid profile by elevated cholesterol, rigyceriedes, ect leading into metabolic syndrome which many amreicans have and do not relize it.. Low estrogen can also lead to undermethylation of the liver and open us up to various cancers pregenetically disposed to and as well cause backing up in liver detoxification pathways and end up swimming in own metabolic waste..
 
I read about it in a journal paper and as my E2 went to 250 on sustanon, I thought it was worth a go.
Pellets brought the T to the correct level and E2 is now down to 85. No problems with ED anymore, but I suppose more information and research needs to happen with this, given I sustained Primary damage at the age of 10 (raised FSH) and oxandrolone induced atrophy at the age of 12 (to kick me into puberty)

I have trie all the treatment regeims available, and pellets are the one that works for me. Remember every one is different, damaged at a different age, Primary or secondary etc etc etc.

It took me 2 years to get the right treatment and when its found things are good
 
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