Injectable L-carnitine vs oral solution

[Thegreek]

There has been a lot of hype around injectable L-carnitine. Even a friend of mine was buying some shit online and pinning it. He came to me and was telling me all about it and asked if I could make it for him. So I did. 500mg/ml Came out perfect. Crystal clear no pip. I gave him what he wanted and got curious myself so I started pinning it too. The jury is still out for me. The point of this thread is after I made it I had this epiphany and wanted some of you to chime in. Why pin it when you can take it orally. I’m not talking about the crystalline form. Most of us by now should know that the bio availability of any oral supplements is shit compared to its liquid form. After making this as an injectable why not save the pin and just drink it. Shouldn’t the bio availability be almost as high or as high as the injectable. It’s 100 percent into solution and should be absorbed into the blood stream very quickly since it’s completely dissolved. Any thoughts on this.

 

[Cashton]

There has been a lot of hype around injectable L-carnitine. Even a friend of mine was buying some shit online and pinning it. He came to me and was telling me all about it and asked if I could make it for him. So I did. 500mg/ml Came out perfect. Crystal clear no pip. I gave him what he wanted and got curious myself so I started pinning it too. The jury is still out for me. The point of this thread is after I made it I had this epiphany and wanted some of you to chime in. Why pin it when you can take it orally. I’m not talking about the crystalline form. Most of us by now should know that the bio availability of any oral supplements is shit compared to its liquid form. After making this as an injectable why not save the pin and just drink it. Shouldn’t the bio availability be almost as high or as high as the injectable. It’s 100 percent into solution and should be absorbed into the blood stream very quickly since it’s completely dissolved. Any thoughts on this.

What? No.. I’m confused as you answered your own question in your ramblings.

 

[MouthfulOfClouds]

Bioavailability of oral L Carnitine is terrible and oral L car metabolises into TMAO and is cancirogenic, only way to prevent this is consumption of cold garlic as far as I've heard as it prevents TMAO metabolisation. IM pins are a far safer solution and way more tolerable than oral.

 

[Thegreek]

What? No.. I’m confused as you answered your own question in your ramblings.

First don’t come into my post and talk shit about me rambling. It’s my post. Be respectful. Second. I didn’t answer shit because I’m making an assumption and wanted to hear from some of the other guys on here whose opinion I value. Yours is not one of them. Third if I am right then why the fuck is everyone pinning it. Seems pretty fucking stupid to pin upwards of 6ml a day so maybe I am missing something. Do you have answer. Clearly not. Now either bring something of value or go the fuck away.

 

[Thegreek]

Bioavailability of oral L Carnitine is terrible and oral L car metabolises into TMAO and is cancirogenic, only way to prevent this is consumption of cold garlic as far as I've heard as it prevents TMAO metabolisation. IM pins are a far safer solution and way more tolerable than oral.

I understand that but shouldn’t the absorption into the bloodstream through the intestines be the same since it is in a solution. What’s the difference between the IM inj and entering the bloodstream vs the liquid being absorbed into the bloodstream through the intestines.

 

[Cashton]

most of us by now should know that the bio availability of any oral supplements is shit compared to its liquid form. After making this as an injectable why not save the pin and just drink it. Shouldn’t the bio availability be almost as high or as high as the injectable. It’s 100 percent into solution and should be absorbed into the blood stream very quickly since it’s completely dissolved

Since you want to be a cocksucker and respond ignorantly and disrespectfully to my comment which wasn’t meant to be disrespectful in any way, I’ll point out where your dumb ass answered your own question.

Secondly, I don’t understand why you brewed it when you don’t even understand why you should be using inj. Version.

edit: after you last comment your complete ignorance leaves me to believe you didn’t make shit at all, and now I’m wondering why you made this post with the big long lie story?

 

[Thegreek]

Since you want to be a cocksucker and respond ignorantly and disrespectfully to my comment which wasn’t meant to be disrespectful in any way, I’ll point out where your dumb ass answered your own question.

Secondly, I don’t understand why you brewed it when you don’t even understand why you should be using inj. Version.

edit: after you last comment your complete ignorance leaves me to believe you didn’t make shit at all, and now I’m wondering why you made this post with the big long lie story?

Again you came into my post saying I’m rambling. I assure you I have plenty of experience brewing and did in fact make this. So enlighten me then. Tell me how the absorption will be different between the two.

 

[Thegreek]

Crystal clear 500mg/ml

 

[Chemical Jesus]

Nothing relevant to add but I'm defo thinking of brewing up a 500mg/ml batch. Sadly nobody where I am sells anything higher than 200mg/ml. I have 0 brewing experience so I'm sure it will be a clusterfuck

 

[MouthfulOfClouds]

I understand that but shouldn’t the absorption into the bloodstream through the intestines be the same since it is in a solution. What’s the difference between the IM inj and entering the bloodstream vs the liquid being absorbed into the bloodstream through the intestines.

The difference between IM and oral would be oral creates TMAO during ingestion of L car. TMAO is cancerogenic hence why IM is preferred.

Also, the oral bioavailability of supplemented creatine is about 14-18%, 54-87% if it's through a meal, (fish, red meat, etc) So the effective dosage of pinning is 500mg. You'd have to consume between 2800mg to 3500mg to have the same effect as pinning than through oral. We can rule out the possibility of getting it through meals as L car is more used towards a cutting cycle, thus relying in meals involves adding a caloric surplus.

Kinetics, pharmacokinetics, and regulation of L-carnitine and acetyl-L-carnitine metabolism - PubMed

In mammals, the carnitine pool consists of nonesterified L-carnitine and many acylcarnitine esters. Of these esters, acetyl-L-carnitine is quantitatively and functionally the most significant. Carnitine homeostasis is maintained by absorption from diet, a modest rate of synthesis, and efficient...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Trimethylamine-N-oxide as One Hypothetical Link for the Relationship between Intestinal Microbiota and Cancer - Where We Are and Where Shall We Go?

Previous epidemiological studies had provided evidence for a link between the microbial dysbiosis and cancer, particularly colorectal cancer (CRC), yet the molecular basis of this link remains elusive. Recently, the association between plasma levels of ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[138casanova]

Nothing relevant to add but I'm defo thinking of brewing up a 500mg/ml batch. Sadly nobody where I am sells anything higher than 200mg/ml. I have 0 brewing experience so I'm sure it will be a clusterfuck

You live in the states?

 

[Chemical Jesus]

@138casanova UK mate

 

[Eman]

What’s the difference between the IM inj and entering the bloodstream vs the liquid being absorbed into the bloodstream through the intestines.

Absorbed via intestines is how it would be absorbed if you drank in a glass of water or as a pill. It's absorbed more efficiently as an IM or SQ injection.

Also, you definitely don't need to inject 6ml a day.. especially if you brewed it at 500mg/ml. 1ml is enough.

 

[Thegreek]

The difference between IM and oral would be oral creates TMAO during ingestion of L car. TMAO is cancerogenic hence why IM is preferred.

Also, the oral bioavailability of supplemented creatine is about 14-18%, 54-87% if it's through a meal, (fish, red meat, etc) So the effective dosage of pinning is 500mg. You'd have to consume between 2800mg to 3500mg to have the same effect as pinning than through oral. We can rule out the possibility of getting it through meals as L car is more used towards a cutting cycle, thus relying in meals involves adding a caloric surplus.

Kinetics, pharmacokinetics, and regulation of L-carnitine and acetyl-L-carnitine metabolism - PubMed

In mammals, the carnitine pool consists of nonesterified L-carnitine and many acylcarnitine esters. Of these esters, acetyl-L-carnitine is quantitatively and functionally the most significant. Carnitine homeostasis is maintained by absorption from diet, a modest rate of synthesis, and efficient...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Trimethylamine-N-oxide as One Hypothetical Link for the Relationship between Intestinal Microbiota and Cancer - Where We Are and Where Shall We Go?

Previous epidemiological studies had provided evidence for a link between the microbial dysbiosis and cancer, particularly colorectal cancer (CRC), yet the molecular basis of this link remains elusive. Recently, the association between plasma levels of ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I appreciate the info. That’s the reason why I posted in the first place to have a logical and informative conversation. From my perspective the fact that it went into a complete dissolved solution led me to wonder why not just take it orally. If it was in a pill or powder form then to me I can see how the bio availability would be minimal.

 

[Thegreek]

Absorbed via intestines is how it would be absorbed if you drank in a glass of water or as a pill. It's absorbed more efficiently as an IM or SQ injection.

Also, you definitely don't need to inject 6ml a day.. especially if you brewed it at 500mg/ml. 1ml is enough.

Yes I understand that but my original question was not based on the pill or powder form in a glass of water where it either has to break down or dissolve in the glass or stomach. Which it probably wouldn’t do completely. I’ve already done that and it’s 100 percent dissolved so wouldn’t that make it almost as bio available as an IM injection. @MouthfulOfClouds is making a point that it’s potentially harmful taken orally. That’s a different but valid point but my question was more on the absorption of it. Shouldn’t it be very close to being the same. I don’t think you need 3000mg a day either but there are people doing that. I for one wouldn’t want to inject 6ml of water.

 

[Eman]

Yes I understand that but my original question was not based on the pill or powder form in a glass of water where it either has to break down or dissolve in the glass or stomach. Which it probably wouldn’t do completely. I’ve already done that and it’s 100 percent dissolved so wouldn’t that make it almost as bio available as an IM injection. @MouthfulOfClouds is making a point that it’s potentially harmful taken orally. That’s a different but valid point but my question was more on the absorption of it. Shouldn’t it be very close to being the same. I don’t think you need 3000mg a day either but there are people doing that. I for one wouldn’t want to inject 6ml of water.

No, it makes no difference that you dissolved it. Just because you dissolve testosterone raws in oil doesn't mean you can then drink the oil and expect a similar result to injecting it.

I don't know why anyone would inject that much either... Most preparations are closer to the 200mg/ml range, so that does require more volume if you follow a dosing recommendation like you'd find from synthetek or PM. But, they're the ones selling it.. So it makes sense that they'd suggest taking a lot of it.

 

[MouthfulOfClouds]

Yes I understand that but my original question was not based on the pill or powder form in a glass of water where it either has to break down or dissolve in the glass or stomach. Which it probably wouldn’t do completely. I’ve already done that and it’s 100 percent dissolved so wouldn’t that make it almost as bio available as an IM injection. @MouthfulOfClouds is making a point that it’s potentially harmful taken orally. That’s a different but valid point but my question was more on the absorption of it. Shouldn’t it be very close to being the same. I don’t think you need 3000mg a day either but there are people doing that. I for one wouldn’t want to inject 6ml of water.

Ah pardon, I seem to have misunderstood the question then. From what I've researched it seems like it's due to the fact that transportation of L car from the gut into your stream is actually a fairly slow process, the studies say that "Thus, as circulating L-carnitine concentration increases (as after high-dose intravenous or oral administration of L-carnitine), efficiency of reabsorption decreases and clearance increases,". There is only so much L car that your gut can transport into circulation before your body start blocking off reabsorption and at some point it will clear much faster than your body transport into circulation.

Skipping the gut and just putting the L car straight into circulation you would circumvent the issue of having your own body blocking absorption of it.

Kinetics, Pharmacokinetics, and Regulation of l-Carnitine and Acetyl-l-carnitine Metabolism

Download Citation | Kinetics, Pharmacokinetics, and Regulation of l-Carnitine and Acetyl-l-carnitine Metabolism | In mammals, the carnitine pool consists of nonesterified L-carnitine and many acylcarnitine esters. Of these esters, acetyl-L-carnitine is... | Find, read and cite all the research...

www.researchgate.net

 

[M. Tugboat]

Can someone recommend me a g2g source for creatine?

 

[Thegreek]

No, it makes no difference that you dissolved it. Just because you dissolve testosterone raws in oil doesn't mean you can then drink the oil and expect a similar result to injecting it.

I don't know why anyone would inject that much either... Most preparations are closer to the 200mg/ml range, so that does require more volume if you follow a dosing recommendation like you'd find from synthetek or PM. But, they're the ones selling it.. So it makes sense that they'd suggest taking a lot of it.

No, it makes no difference that you dissolved it. Just because you dissolve testosterone raws in oil doesn't mean you can then drink the oil and expect a similar result to injecting it.

I don't know why anyone would inject that much either... Most preparations are closer to the 200mg/ml range, so that does require more volume if you follow a dosing recommendation like you'd find from synthetek or PM. But, they're the ones selling it.. So it makes sense that they'd suggest taking a lot of it.

Well technically there is an oral form of testosterone approved by the FDA so lol. I agree though I wouldn’t drink my test cyp. I agree about the dosing though. I made it as a request.

 

[Thegreek]

Ah pardon, I seem to have misunderstood the question then. From what I've researched it seems like it's due to the fact that transportation of L car from the gut into your stream is actually a fairly slow process, the studies say that "Thus, as circulating L-carnitine concentration increases (as after high-dose intravenous or oral administration of L-carnitine), efficiency of reabsorption decreases and clearance increases,". There is only so much L car that your gut can transport into circulation before your body start blocking off reabsorption and at some point it will clear much faster than your body transport into circulation.

Skipping the gut and just putting the L car straight into circulation you would circumvent the issue of having your own body blocking absorption of it.

Kinetics, Pharmacokinetics, and Regulation of l-Carnitine and Acetyl-l-carnitine Metabolism

Download Citation | Kinetics, Pharmacokinetics, and Regulation of l-Carnitine and Acetyl-l-carnitine Metabolism | In mammals, the carnitine pool consists of nonesterified L-carnitine and many acylcarnitine esters. Of these esters, acetyl-L-carnitine is... | Find, read and cite all the research...

www.researchgate.net

Thank you man. That’s what I was looking for. Much appreciated.