Janoshik HGH Dimers worth it?

MuscularMD

New Member
I’m planning to send a vial or two from SSA HGH 36 unit promo recently.

Janoshik offers amount and purity for $300 with the option of dimers for an extra $120.

Is dimer testing worth it?

The vendor test came back as 40 IU (overfill) with 96+% purity with 0.05% dimers.

At what % should I be concerned? Anyone use SSA H36?
 
They will cover up to $300 in store credit. If you choose to pay out of pocket for the dimer, that's your decision, depending on whether it's worth it for you based on your financial situation.

@Ghoul recommends always filtering peptides if you're concerned about dimer and aggregates. I'm sure he'll be able to help you out.

1743025198579.webp
 
Still, that's a great question.

But first, How many IU / day do you plan to use, and if you don't mind, how many kits did you get? (roughly 1,5,20)
 
I’m planning to send a vial or two from SSA HGH 36 unit promo recently.

Janoshik offers amount and purity for $300 with the option of dimers for an extra $120.

Is dimer testing worth it?

The vendor test came back as 40 IU (overfill) with 96+% purity with 0.05% dimers.

At what % should I be concerned? Anyone use SSA H36?
its up to you. I havent seen a dimer more than 4%. even then, I dont think anyone truly feels dimers or know what it does.

Would I do it? yes.

Does it really change much in the big picture? Nah.
 
LOL @Spaceman Spiff the "King of Testing for harm reduction" doesn't know what dimer is, what it does, what it's an indicator of.

@MuscularMD

Dimer ("and related proteins") started being tested by UGL users because it's a proxy for manufacturing quality,

Dimer in the simplest terms are 2 peptide molecules attached to each other. HGH dimer is biologically active, but to a lesser degree than monomer.

If you don't know, the heart of chromatography, the first stage of the testing method used, is the separation of different size molecules in a column with pores of varying size. That's how dimer is separated from monomer,

The same separation by size technique used for testing is used for purification after the relatively sloppy process of making peptides.

So when you see 0% Dimer, you know the UGL lab at least performed that chromatographic purification process, which wasn't always the case. Once it started being tested for of course, the UGL labs began competing on that metric and no or low dimer has been common ever since.

It's a little more complicated than that though, as you can see from some ignorant folks pointing to pharma and claiming it's inferior because of its dimer content,

As if Pfizer or Merck aren't capable of producing something as high quality as a Chinese tech at a bench using cheap equipment in a dirty basement lab. I can assure you you'll never find an unsterile vial of Serostim, unlike UGL peptides.

Dimer can form from the addition of certain excipients that are added to ensure stability over the expected shelf life of the vial, and considered a worthwhile tradeoff to prevent the development of large aggregates, which present a risk to safety and waste far more active ingredient than a little Dimer,

So in typical Chinese fashion, you get a vial of UGL rHGH with 0% Dimer, right after reconstitution, which looks great, but compared the "inferior" pharma product 5,10,15 days after reconstitution the pharma product will prove more stable with less aggregate formation.

The other confounding factor is that we have no way of testing for insoluble aggregates, the kind degraded rHGH mostly results in, at least not directly.

First, any aggregates (and other contaminants) larger than .22um are filtered out before analysis, as part of the sample preparation, and secondly, even the small insoluble aggregates that pass the filter get clogged in the chromatography column, so aren't detected. For reference, .22um is about 600 times smaller than the smallest visible particle, so that leaves a lot of potential contaminants excluded from analysis,

That's why researchers, pharma, and the FDA use multiple methods of testing to get a complete picture of "purity".

This means we're only able to measure a small fraction of the impurities in rHGH with the testing we have available.

The testing has value, but it's limited, and perhaps the most important things to keep in mind are

1) If you're not filtering, you're not injecting something with the same 98% purity you see in the test, which is a post filtration measurement. Many people conflate "purity" with "safe snd clean". That's not what it means in this context.

2) The tests tell you nothing about stability, which determines how much aggregation formation there will be post reconstitution, particularly over a longer period like the 18 days you'll be using a vial,
 
Last edited:
LOL @Spaceman Spiff the "King of Testing for harm reduction" doesn't know what dimer is, what it does, what it's an indicator of.

@MuscularMD

Dimer ("and related proteins") started being tested by UGL users because it's a proxy for manufacturing quality,

Dimer in the simplest terms are 2 peptide molecules attached to each other. HGH dimer is biologically active, but to a lesser degree than monomer.

If you don't know, the heart of chromatography, the first stage of the testing method used, is the separation of different size molecules in a column with pores of varying size. That's how dimer is separated from monomer,

The same separation by size technique used for testing is used for purification after the relatively sloppy process of making peptides.

So when you see 0% Dimer, you know the UGL lab at least performed that chromatographic purification process, which wasn't always the case. Once it started being tested for of course, the UGL labs began competing on that metric and no or low dimer has been common ever since.

It's a little more complicated than that though, as you can see from some ignorant folks pointing to pharma and claiming it's inferior because of its dimer content,

As if Pfizer or Merck aren't capable of producing something as high quality as a Chinese tech at a bench using cheap equipment in a dirty basement lab. I can assure you you'll never find an unsterile vial of Serostim, unlike UGL peptides.

Dimer can form from the addition of certain excipients that are added to ensure stability over the expected shelf life of the vial, and considered a worthwhile tradeoff to prevent the development of large aggregates, which present a risk to safety and waste far more active ingredient than a little Dimer,

So in typical Chinese fashion, you get a vial of UGL rHGH with 0% Dimer, right after reconstitution, which looks great, but compared the "inferior" pharma product 5,10,15 days after reconstitution the pharma product will prove more stable with less aggregate formation.

The other confounding factor is that we have no way of testing for insoluble aggregates, the kind degraded rHGH mostly results in, at least not directly.

First, any aggregates (and other contaminants) larger than .22um are filtered out before analysis, as part of the sample preparation, and secondly, even the small insoluble aggregates that pass the filter get clogged in the chromatography column, so aren't detected. For reference, .22um is about 600 times smaller than the smallest visible particle, so that leaves a lot of potential contaminants excluded from analysis,

That's why researchers, pharma, and the FDA use multiple methods of testing to get a complete picture of "purity".

This means we're only able to measure a small fraction of the impurities in rHGH with the testing we have available.

The testing has value, but it's limited, and perhaps the most important things to keep in mind are

1) If you're not filtering, you're not injecting something with the same 98% purity you see in the test, which is a post filtration measurement. Many people conflate "purity" with "safe snd clean". That's not what it means in this context.

2) The tests tell you nothing about stability, which determines how much aggregation formation there will be post reconstitution, particularly over a longer period like the 18 days you'll be using a vial,
Find me dimer that is not up to standards retard
 
1) If you're not filtering, you're not injecting something with the same 98% purity you see in the test, which is a post filtration measurement. Many people conflate "purity" with "safe snd clean". That's not what it means in this context.

2) The tests tell you nothing about stability, which determines how much aggregation formation there will be post reconstitution, particularly over a longer period like the 18 days you'll be using a vial,
Wow. Thanks for the in-depth lesson. Super appreciate it. Mmm. Makes me think I’m going to need to filter.
 
qqqqqqq
LOL @Spaceman Spiff the "King of Testing for harm reduction" doesn't know what dimer is, what it does, what it's an indicator of.

@MuscularMD

Dimer ("and related proteins") started being tested by UGL users because it's a proxy for manufacturing quality,

Dimer in the simplest terms are 2 peptide molecules attached to each other. HGH dimer is biologically active, but to a lesser degree than monomer.

If you don't know, the heart of chromatography, the first stage of the testing method used, is the separation of different size molecules in a column with pores of varying size. That's how dimer is separated from monomer,

The same separation by size technique used for testing is used for purification after the relatively sloppy process of making peptides.

So when you see 0% Dimer, you know the UGL lab at least performed that chromatographic purification process, which wasn't always the case. Once it started being tested for of course, the UGL labs began competing on that metric and no or low dimer has been common ever since.

It's a little more complicated than that though, as you can see from some ignorant folks pointing to pharma and claiming it's inferior because of its dimer content,

As if Pfizer or Merck aren't capable of producing something as high quality as a Chinese tech at a bench using cheap equipment in a dirty basement lab. I can assure you you'll never find an unsterile vial of Serostim, unlike UGL peptides.

Dimer can form from the addition of certain excipients that are added to ensure stability over the expected shelf life of the vial, and considered a worthwhile tradeoff to prevent the development of large aggregates, which present a risk to safety and waste far more active ingredient than a little Dimer,

So in typical Chinese fashion, you get a vial of UGL rHGH with 0% Dimer, right after reconstitution, which looks great, but compared the "inferior" pharma product 5,10,15 days after reconstitution the pharma product will prove more stable with less aggregate formation.

The other confounding factor is that we have no way of testing for insoluble aggregates, the kind degraded rHGH mostly results in, at least not directly.

First, any aggregates (and other contaminants) larger than .22um are filtered out before analysis, as part of the sample preparation, and secondly, even the small insoluble aggregates that pass the filter get clogged in the chromatography column, so aren't detected. For reference, .22um is about 600 times smaller than the smallest visible particle, so that leaves a lot of potential contaminants excluded from analysis,

That's why researchers, pharma, and the FDA use multiple methods of testing to get a complete picture of "purity".

This means we're only able to measure a small fraction of the impurities in rHGH with the testing we have available.

The testing has value, but it's limited, and perhaps the most important things to keep in mind are

1) If you're not filtering, you're not injecting something with the same 98% purity you see in the test, which is a post filtration measurement. Many people conflate "purity" with "safe snd clean". That's not what it means in this context.

2) The tests tell you nothing about stability, which determines how much aggregation formation there will be post reconstitution, particularly over a longer period like the 18 days you'll be using a vial,
Jano disagree with you:
Screenshot 2025-03-29 115219.webp


So from the degradation test done on HGH we can see how many aggregates (dimer) increase we have overtime.
Spoiler alert:
Data gives us an increase of dimer of non significant value, I mean something like 0.XX% at BEST
 
qqqqqqq

Jano disagree with you:
View attachment 323087


So from the degradation test done on HGH we can see how many aggregates (dimer) increase we have overtime.
Spoiler alert:
Data gives us an increase of dimer of non significant value, I mean something like 0.XX% at BEST
Wait a second...

It's almost as if an unqualified person shouldn't be confidently making things up without testing them and calling it harm reduction.
 
qqqqqqq

Jano disagree with you:
View attachment 323087


So from the degradation test done on HGH we can see how many aggregates (dimer) increase we have overtime.
Spoiler alert:
Data gives us an increase of dimer of non significant value, I mean something like 0.XX% at BEST
It’s the chromatography that separates out the LMW (dimers, trimers, etc) aggregates from the monomer (native form). Ghoul only stated that filtering removes aggregates larger than .22um. Those could be visible or invisible to the naked eye, soluble or insoluble.

As Ghoul stated, SEC is used as a purification step. One of the reasons it may not have been used by UGL is that it also results in some percentage lost of monomer, the desired product. Pharma and well-optimized setups, 5-20% loss, and less optimized, 20-30% loss. But purity after SEC is 98-99%.

Regardless, filtering only removes aggregates larger than the pore diameter of the filter, and dimers, trimers, etc are far smaller than that. But some large molecular weight aggregates form after purification for various reasons, and the idea is that filtering is a preventative measure against any of the more dangerous high molecular weight aggregates that are larger than the filter pore size.
 
It’s the chromatography that separates out the LMW (dimers, trimers, etc) aggregates from the monomer (native form). Ghoul only stated that filtering removes aggregates larger than .22um. Those could be visible or invisible to the naked eye, soluble or insoluble.

As Ghoul stated, SEC is used as a purification step. One of the reasons it may not have been used by UGL is that it also results in some percentage lost of monomer, the desired product. Pharma and well-optimized setups, 5-20% loss, and less optimized, 20-30% loss. But purity after SEC is 98-99%.

Regardless, filtering only removes aggregates larger than the pore diameter of the filter, and dimers, trimers, etc are far smaller than that. But some large molecular weight aggregates form after purification for various reasons, and the idea is that filtering is a preventative measure against any of the more dangerous high molecular weight aggregates that are larger than the filter pore size.

That we have no proof that are there :)
 
It’s the chromatography that separates out the LMW (dimers, trimers, etc) aggregates from the monomer (native form). Ghoul only stated that filtering removes aggregates larger than .22um. Those could be visible or invisible to the naked eye, soluble or insoluble.

As Ghoul stated, SEC is used as a purification step. One of the reasons it may not have been used by UGL is that it also results in some percentage lost of monomer, the desired product. Pharma and well-optimized setups, 5-20% loss, and less optimized, 20-30% loss. But purity after SEC is 98-99%.

Regardless, filtering only removes aggregates larger than the pore diameter of the filter, and dimers, trimers, etc are far smaller than that. But some large molecular weight aggregates form after purification for various reasons, and the idea is that filtering is a preventative measure against any of the more dangerous high molecular weight aggregates that are larger than the filter pore size.
You see like a smart guy, interesting read.

To the best of my knowledge...This community has yet to see evidence of any product they're using containing these larger aggregates.

Just lazy attempts to tie loosely related data to the idea for "credibility" and "harm reduction"

Begining to wonder if the unwillingness to test these ideas is due to a fear of being wrong?
 
Back
Top