Liposomal vitamins

[BOSSBIG]

Anyone ever try making liposomal formulas like vitamin C, glutathione etc? It's a pretty simple process you just need some lecithin and an ultrasonic cleaner. Yes you can just take more of the raw product to get the same absorption but apparently the liposomes can deliver the compound to cells in a way otherwise not possible and they are sustained release.

Also most supplement companies claim their product is "liposomal" when its just mixed with a phospholipid. It's in fact difficult to keep the compound stable in liposomes. With a DIY liposomal done correctly you don't have this problem. Might be interesting to try this with other goodies

 

[BOSSBIG]

Here's an example formula using curcumin:

- Combine 25 grams of lecithin, 20 grams of curcumin with 25 ml of glyerin (or ethanol for better dissolving) and mix with hand held blender
- Let ethanol evaporate if used
- Add 240 ml of distilled water to the lipid-active ingredient solution while continuously stirring. This begins the formation of liposomes.
- (Optional) Add 2.5 grams of beta-sitosterol to the mixture to enhance liposome stability
- (Optional) Homogenize the mixture for 5-10 minutes in a homogenizer
- Sonicate for 10-15 minutes to further decrease liposome size and achieve a homogeneous suspension

 

[qadsan]

Here's an example formula using curcumin:

- Combine 25 grams of lecithin, 20 grams of curcumin with 25 ml of glyerin (or ethanol for better dissolving) and mix with hand held blender
- Let ethanol evaporate if used
- Add 240 ml of distilled water to the lipid-active ingredient solution while continuously stirring. This begins the formation of liposomes.
- (Optional) Add 2.5 grams of beta-sitosterol to the mixture to enhance liposome stability
- (Optional) Homogenize the mixture for 5-10 minutes in a homogenizer
- Sonicate for 10-15 minutes to further decrease liposome size and achieve a homogeneous suspension

Doesn’t adding the ethanol make it an Ethosomal formulation instead of a liposomal formulation, which offers increased bioavailability?

 

[Benf15harp]

I prefer to eat my Curcumin

 

[BOSSBIG]

Doesn’t adding the ethanol make it an Ethosomal formulation instead of a liposomal formulation, which offers increased bioavailability?

I'm not sure. My guess is all of the ethanol will evaporate from the solution. Honestly this is from chatgpt but I looked at several studies on liposomal absorption and they use the same process (with better equipment of course and using better phospholipids like phosphotidylcholine, using real cholesterol etc).

 

[iris]

Doesn’t adding the ethanol make it an Ethosomal formulation instead of a liposomal formulation, which offers increased bioavailability?

Hey!!!!!
So cool to see ya!
Will write you.

I want to Google this; sounds awesome but have no idea what you just wrote means, lol.
Have you ever made anything like this, Q?

thank you OP.
@BOSSBIG
This is super.
Is it really not too complicated to make?
It is so expensive to buy. I never do because some of this stuff where I am is extortionate.
I have seen collagen, vitamin c, vitamin d, iron and other stuff I don't remember, but they were all in liquid form.
Vitamin c was in capsules.

 

[BOSSBIG]

Hey!!!!!
So cool to see ya!
Will write you.

I want to Google this; sounds awesome but have no idea what you just wrote means, lol.
Have you ever made anything like this, Q?

thank you OP.
@BOSSBIG
This is super.
Is it really not too complicated to make?
It is so expensive to buy. I never do because some of this stuff where I am is extortionate.
I have seen collagen, vitamin c, vitamin d, iron and other stuff I don't remember, but they were all in liquid form.
Vitamin c was in capsules.

Yep pretty easy. Check out this video he prepares it and shows it under a microscope:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuZcOMhQehk

 

[iris]

Yep pretty easy. Check out this video he prepares it and shows it under a microscope:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuZcOMhQehk

Thank you!
Just as well. It will keep me company whilst i wait for the gym to empty a bit.
It's flipping 9.30pm....

 

[AlexDavis43]

I prefer to eat my Curcumin

it tastes like dirt and stains everything yellow

 

[BOSSBIG]

In this study they found that the effects of liposomal quercetin were far different than the raw version. Not only do the liposomes allow better absorption but they change the characteristics of how it is metabolized and therefore its effects:

Quercetin Liposomal Nanoformulation for Ischemia and Reperfusion Injury Treatment - PMC

Ischemia and reperfusion injury (IRI) is a common complication caused by inflammation and oxidative stress resulting from liver surgery. Current therapeutic strategies do not present the desirable efficacy, and severe side effects can occur. To ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

"When comparing the dose used in the present study (91 mg per administration for an adult with 70 kg) with the regular oral quercetin intake (37.5 to 600 mg/day), the drug delivery system demonstrated advantages in terms of treatment efficacy. Moreover, in comparison with studies from Atef et al. [47], Ali et al. [48], and Uylaş et al. [49] where free quercetin was used to treat hepatic IRI, the efficacious therapeutic effect of quercetin liposomes was herein observed using a 40 to 280 times lower dose than the free drug. This highlights the advantage of the specific hepatic delivery achieved using long-circulating liposomes, which protects quercetin from early metabolization, degradation, and excretion."

 

[iris]

In this study they found that the effects of liposomal quercetin were not comparable to the raw version. Not only do the liposomes allow better absorption but they change the characteristics of how the compound is delivered and therefore its effects:

Quercetin Liposomal Nanoformulation for Ischemia and Reperfusion Injury Treatment - PMC

Ischemia and reperfusion injury (IRI) is a common complication caused by inflammation and oxidative stress resulting from liver surgery. Current therapeutic strategies do not present the desirable efficacy, and severe side effects can occur. To ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

"When comparing the dose used in the present study (91 mg per administration for an adult with 70 kg) with the regular oral quercetin intake (37.5 to 600 mg/day), the drug delivery system demonstrated advantages in terms of treatment efficacy. Moreover, in comparison with studies from Atef et al. [47], Ali et al. [48], and Uylaş et al. [49] where free quercetin was used to treat hepatic IRI, the efficacious therapeutic effect of quercetin liposomes was herein observed using a 40 to 280 times lower dose than the free drug. This highlights the advantage of the specific hepatic delivery achieved using long-circulating liposomes, which protects quercetin from early metabolization, degradation, and excretion."

The raws are quite expensive.
Do you take it as a supp?
It's supposed to be really good.

 

[BOSSBIG]

The raws are quite expensive.
Do you take it as a supp?
It's supposed to be really good.

You can get 100 grams for around $20 from bulksupplements
I've avoided colds and flus a lot better taking quercetin and NAC.

 

[iris]

You can get 100 grams for around $20 from bulksupplements
I've avoided colds and flus a lot better taking quercetin and NAC.

I don't remember the quantity it was, but I thought I saw it on the qsc price list and it was very expensive.
Maybe I am confusing it with something else.
Or maybe Tracy is taking the mickey, lol.
I am not in the States, but I can look for it here.

What do you think about doing this with carnitine?
Everyone injects it because of bioavailability.
Could this make a difference?
I know that orally one would have to take a lot more than IM, though.
Thank you so much for the reply.

 

[BOSSBIG]

I don't remember the quantity it was, but I thought I saw it on the qsc price list and it was very expensive.
Maybe I am confusing it with something else.
Or maybe Tracy is taking the mickey, lol.
I am not in the States, but I can look for it here.

What do you think about doing this with carnitine?
Everyone injects it because of bioavailability.
Could this make a difference?
I know that orally one would have to take a lot more than IM, though.
Thank you so much for the reply.

QSC prices for bulk powders like quercetin are not worth the trouble of importing you can get all that for cheap domestic.
There's liposomal carnitine products out there I'm sure it helps but I don't know if you have the same problem of increased TMAO as with carnitine supplements

 

[iris]

QSC prices for bulk powders like quercetin are not worth the trouble of importing you can get all that for cheap domestic.
There's liposomal carnitine products out there I'm sure it helps but I don't know if you have the same problem of increased TMAO as with carnitine supplements

Just a quick look about lyposomal carnitine and this is what the abstracts say:

"The pharmacokinetics and organ distribution of 3H-L-carnitine (CAS 541-15-1) were investigated in rats following direct intravenous administration of the drug substance and administration of the drug encapsulated in liposomes, respectively. The retention in the blood system of carnitine in liposomes, was significantly higher, namely up to 300% as compared to the standard administration. The half-life of distribution t1/2 alpha to 0.68 h (+154%), the terminal half-life t1/2 beta to 7.94 h (+140%), whereas the total clearance decreased by 400% as compared with the standard carnitine administration. Carnitine, in the novel dosage form, accumulated to a higher extent in the liver (156%) and spleen (336%), while the concentration in lung (52%), heart (55%) and muscle tissue (54%) decreased markedly relative to the standard. The novel dosage form is stable in vitro (t1/2 4 degree C = 187 days) as well as in vivo and, thus, may be successfully used in the therapy of carnitine deficiency, for instance in patients with renal failure or liver disease".

"L-Carnitine has attracted much more attention especially in the treatment of crucial diseases such as diabetes, regional slimming, and obesity because of its metabolic activities. However, because of its short half-life, low bioavailability, and inability to be stored in the body, frequent dosing is required. In this study, L-carnitine-loaded liposome (lipo-carnitine) and PLGA nanoparticle (nano-carnitine) formulations were prepared and characterized. For lipo-carnitine and nano-carnitine formulations, particle size values were 97.88 ± 2.96 nm and 250.90 ± 6.15 nm; polydispersity index values were 0.35 ± 0.01 and 0.22 ± 0.03; zeta potential values were 6.36 ± 0.54 mV and - 32.80 ± 2.26 mV; and encapsulation efficiency percentage values were 14.26 ± 3.52% and 21.93 ± 4.17%, respectively. Comparative in vitro release studies of novel formulations and solution of L-carnitine revealed that L-carnitine released 90% of its content at the end of 1st hour. On the other hand, lipo-carnitine and nano-carnitine formulations maintained a controlled-release profile for 12 h. The in vitro efficacy of the formulations on cardiac fibroblasts (CFs) was evaluated by metabolomic studies and pathway analysis. Besides the prolonged release, lipo-carnitine/nano-carnitine formulations were also found to be effective on amino acid, carbohydrate, and lipid metabolisms. As a result, innovative nano-formulations were successfully developed as an alternative to conventional preparations which are available on the market".

There is so much conflicting info about it and about it increasing TMAO.
I have taken 3gr a day orally for a while, during covid, but I was doing lots of cardio too. And taking allicin which, I have just learnt, negates the effects of tmao increase.
Doing the right things just by pot luck, lol.

Anyway, thank you for this.
I would love to try making some of this, at some point.
The quercetin one is a brilliant idea.