Question about DIM and I3C... Swale?

[Your Endo]

After reading this thread I am a little confused >>

https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/134234451

How is DIM and indole-3-carbinol supposed to effect E1, E2, and E3 levels? Does it lower E2 or does it just affect the 2-hydroxyestrone to 16-alpha-hydroxyestrone ratio? I just know that its often talked about as an anti-estrogen, but does it actually lower estrogen?

And one more thing I noticed Swale mentioned the use of TMG when using DIM. Why? Thanks.

 

[DavidZ]

How is DIM and indole-3-carbinol supposed to effect E1, E2, and E3 levels? Does it lower E2 or does it just affect the 2-hydroxyestrone to 16-alpha-hydroxyestrone ratio?

Diindolylmethane (DIM) is a naturally occurring substance found primarily in cruciferous vegetables (e.g., cabbage, broccoli, cauliflower, Brussels sprouts, etc.) that helps the P450 system in the liver digest/metabolize Estradiol (E2) into more benign/healthy estrogens (2-hydroxy's). DIM is not very bioavailable when taken orally; however, Indolplex is a proprietary formulation that significantly increases DIM's oral bioavailability.

I just know that its often talked about as an anti-estrogen, but does it actually lower estrogen?

E2 is by far the most powerful Estrogen. Since E2 is the dominant Estrogen, it is often referred to in the literature simply as Estrogen. Since DIM helps the body eliminate E2, it's often called an anti-estrogen. In actuality, DIM probably increases total estrogen, but by shifting the mix from E2 to the 2-hydroxy's. The net result is an increase in total Estrogens, but a significant decrease in the "estrogenic effect."

And one more thing I noticed Swale mentioned the use of TMG when using DIM. Why? Thanks.

I'll defer to Swale on that question.

 

[cpeil2]

TMG functions as a methyl donor by giving up a methyl to become DMG. The hope is that methylation potentiates 2-OH and attenuates 4-OH.

 

[Your Endo]

TMG functions as a methyl donor by giving up a methyl to become DMG. The hope is that methylation potentiates 2-OH and attenuates 4-OH.

Sorry, what is 4-OH and 2-OH? Thanks.

 

[cpeil2]

4-hydroxyestrone and 2-hyrdoxyestrone. 4-OH is the bad stuff and 2-OH is the good stuff.

 

[SWALE]

Bump for some good, basic advice.

 

[peewee327]

where can one purchase TMG?

 

[androjello]

TMG= Betaine
You can buy it for a good price in bulk at bulknutrition

 

[DavidZ]

TMG= Betaine

What dosage should it be taken in?

Aside from the various health benefits I've read about, are there any positve clinical response(s) that I should expect?