question for all the Christians

[joe shmoe]

i work with 2 born again christians. i dont mind working with them because they dont "preach" to me all day long. we do get into some discussions, but then its dropped. they arent trying to "save" me. one thing that sticks in my mind is they told me the "body is a temple"...therefore they dont smoke, take drugs. they have a glass of wine or a drink every now and again, but nothing to excess. because they treat their body like the proverbial temple. testosterone...yes, naturally occuring hormone. EQ/tren isnt. test will shut you down...thereby "damaging/hurting the temple". and yes, you are damaging it because we need things like hCG and clomid to bring our bodies/temples back to normal.

now, the original point of my question was to figure out how you guys justify using AAS to yourselves. again, not judging anyone or flaming anyone. i'm just curious. i dont buy into the argument that there are some stupid laws. while i whole heartedly agree....i dont buy that in this instance. having a marlboro and a 6 pack of bud light isnt illegal...but the guys i know dont do it. holding true to their belief about the body/temple thing.

and please....PLEASE, lets not turn this into a political thing. there have been enough threads about politics. lets stick to the topic at hand please.

have a nice day

 

[TheTruth]

I am not the most educated on this subject, but isn't it true that all of our sins are forgiven the day we ask Christ to come in to our lives? I mean we are supposed to admit we are sinners and didn't Jesus sacrifice himself for our sins so we would no longer have to make sacrifices? So aren't we forgiven of all our sins by asking Jesus to come into our lives? It is understood that humans are and always will be sinners. Adam and Eve knew they were doing something wrong and they did it anyway. Not making excuses, I thought that is how it worked for Christians. It doesn't matter what the sin is that you do, you are forgiven and once you ask jesus to come into your life and accept him as your lord all your sins are forgiven and you are always saved.

 

[oldtimer]

My two cents...

Having some knowledge about Christianity, it is my understanding that there are levels, God accepts and favors the pure white, but he also accepts the grey. A person could become grey to a certain level, before he is considered part of the darker half and go to hell.

For me, i don't do AAS. I even turned the avatars display feature off so i don't see naked women in my screen .

-OT

 

[Hogg]

lalalalallalaaaaa

 

[Chip Bronson]

i'm not christian but i couldn't hold out any longer. damn!!! no smoking, no drinking, no pre-marital sex, no aas, no naked women avatars? what fucking god would want his people to live such humdrum lives? really, what are we to do for fun? play fucking bingo and sing gospel songs?

and this bullshit about people being sinners and then being saved by jesus because they ask him into their lives, wft is that? then i guess it's ok to go off and be fucked up person and when you done being a fuck-up, just ask jesus into your life. then when you feel like going off again, you just go off and then ask him into your life again, etc. am i the only one who sees the absurdity in this?

sorry if i've offended anyone with my rantings but some of these posts are just bullshit.

 

[Bob Smith]

Chip, this isnt a thread about why we believe or trying to prove anything to agnostics/atheists. So if you dont have anything to add to our discussion, please stay out.

First off, people have mentioned happiness numerous times. I dont recall ever reading that God promises happiness on earth. Usually the Bible speaks of trials and troubles on earth, not of parties and happiness and whatnot. Happiness is fleeting.

Joy, on the other hand, is totally different. Joy is the understanding that no matter what happens on earth, we can trust in the Lord and that once we die, we will be united with God. A few years back a friend of my ex's had MS. She had to use a wheelchair most of the time, had a great deal of trouble walking short distances (had huge calves though, I was jealous), but had an amazing air about her. None of us would ever want to be in her position. But she had true joy. She didnt complain about her MS or whine all the time, she simply took it as her position in life and made the very best of it. She was a sweetheart and always had a smile on her face. Despite her troubles, she knew that it was only a matter of time before something much better came along. That alone gave her peace.

 

[jarz]

I have to agree with Chip regarding TheTruth's comments on bad bahavior being forgiven over and over. I think that is a total cop out and an excuse to misbehave. Jesus may have died for our sins, however, I dont think that means go ahead and do what you feel. You still have to abide by God's rules.

I also dont think the Lord intened us to abuse his wonderful gifts to the extreme. Everything in moderation.

The Lord created this planet, animals, plants and us. Now, if the Lord created the plants, for example, opium plant, for us to use in easing legit pain and we abuse it for recreation purposes, I do not think the Lord will be happy about that.
However, I do strongly believe he created that plant for a legit reason and when it is used in that fashion, he is pleased. He is merciful after all.

If you were to eat a bull testicle ( knock yourself out!) and you were to gain strength beyond your norm, is that bad? I dont think so. But if you eat them all the time, to excess, that's bad.
God didnt intend for us to use anything to excess.

God didnt intend for us to eat to excess either. That is self destructive, but have they made that illegal?

We as a collective dont know how to do anything in moderation. We have to go to the extreme, be the biggest and the best. I dont think that pleases the Lord either.

I had to learn the hard way, by abusing AAS. I developed permenant health problems. Yes, AAS are self destructive if abused. I believe if we hadnt started abusing AAS, they might still be legal.

 

[TheTruth]

Agree or not that is OK. That is what this thread is about. Many will call that a cop out, but I believe the fact remains that as Christians all our sins are forgiven. So next time you sin you are forgiven. We shouldn't think we are all going to hell because we shoot roids. We may not have the rewards others may have once we get to heaven, but we will still be there if we are believers.

Are you saying that is not TheTruth?

 

[jarz]

Bob, do you recall anything about King David dancing? He rejoiced by dancing. This made him happy as it did the Lord, but it was frowned upon by others?
You make it sound as though we are not allowed to embrace happiness. I do not think the Lord intended us to be distraught at all times in this world, or he would not have provided things that bring us joy.

You also make a distinction between joy and happiness.

Webster's definition of Joy: a state of happiness or felicity
Webster's definition of Happiness: 1) a pleasurable or satisfying experience 2) a state of well-being and contentment 3) good fortune

Perhaps your friend was content in knowing her time on this earth was short? Her pain would soon pass?

Perhaps the Lord intended for us to experience trials and tribulations in order to fully appreciate Heaven. For how can one know the true pleasure of warm sunshine without first having experienced a cold rainstorm?

 

[Bob Smith]

Jarz, I disagree with your assertion that AAS might still be legal if people didnt "abuse" them. They werent made illegal because people "abused" them. A simple check on history in the late 80s/early 90s will show you the actual push to make them a Sch. III drug.

Hogg, I think you misread what Joe wrote. He clearly said that test will shut you down.

 

[jarz]

Agree or not that is OK. That is what this thread is about. Many will call that a cop out, but I believe the fact remains that as Christians all our sins are forgiven. So next time you sin you are forgiven. We shouldn't think we are all going to hell because we shoot roids. We may not have the rewards others may have once we get to heaven, but we will still be there if we are believers.

Are you saying that is not TheTruth?

How can you justify bad behavior over and over if you truly believe in the Lord and what he says is right? If you continue to disobey Him, then you must not truly believe in Him. Just a thought.

 

[jarz]

Jarz, I disagree with your assertion that AAS might still be legal if people didnt "abuse" them. They werent made illegal because people "abused" them. A simple check on history in the late 80s/early 90s will show you the actual push to make them a Sch. III drug.

Hogg, I think you misread what Joe wrote. He clearly said that test will shut you down.

And the actual "PUSH" to make them Schedule III was for what reason if not abuse?

 

[Bob Smith]

TheTruth, just because all our sins are forgiven doesnt give us the right to go out and purposely sin over and over again.

Jarz, I dont care what Webster says about joy. The Bible has a different definition for it, which is the one I was referring to. I wasnt saying that happiness is a bad thing or should be avoided.

 

[TheTruth]

I am a sinner and so are you that is how. I am a believer. I didn't make the rules. i just tell you the way I see it. I know it is a bad decision to juice and so are all the other sins bad decisions. Are you saying i am going to hell because i sin?

jarz for my sake I am glad jesus is judging me and not you.

 

[Bob Smith]

And the actual "PUSH" to make them Schedule III was for what reason if not abuse?

Sports. Plain and simple.

 

[Chip Bronson]

bob, how is my commentary any less apropos than sensational's, old timer's, the truth's? i'm not trying to prove anything to agnostics or atheists. why single me out? don't single me out because i don't believe in your fairy tales. what i'm saying is thought provoking and can lead to good debate. you're trying to shut me up is just stiffling this debate. is that a good way to learn? or are you not interested in learning because you know everything?

i'm jsut trying to show the absurdity behind trying to live your life in accordance with several thousand year old laws aka the bible. laws, if they are to work efectively, require some sort of plasticity so that they may be ammended to suit the changing times. yes there is right and there is wrong but there is also a lot of grey area and plasticity will allow for ammending the law as is seen fit by the people. so, you see, i am adding to your discussion and, imo, much more so than the bros i've mentioned above.

so, please, get off your high horse and get off my back...

Chip, this isnt a thread about why we believe or trying to prove anything to agnostics/atheists. So if you dont have anything to add to our discussion, please stay out.

First off, people have mentioned happiness numerous times. I dont recall ever reading that God promises happiness on earth. Usually the Bible speaks of trials and troubles on earth, not of parties and happiness and whatnot. Happiness is fleeting.

Joy, on the other hand, is totally different. Joy is the understanding that no matter what happens on earth, we can trust in the Lord and that once we die, we will be united with God. A few years back a friend of my ex's had MS. She had to use a wheelchair most of the time, had a great deal of trouble walking short distances (had huge calves though, I was jealous), but had an amazing air about her. None of us would ever want to be in her position. But she had true joy. She didnt complain about her MS or whine all the time, she simply took it as her position in life and made the very best of it. She was a sweetheart and always had a smile on her face. Despite her troubles, she knew that it was only a matter of time before something much better came along. That alone gave her peace.

 

[jarz]

Sports. Plain and simple.

I have a little something you might be interested in.

http://www.thesportjournal.org/2002Journal/Vol5-No3/anabolic-steroids.asp

Adolecent and Pre-Adolecent steroid usage. I believe that would be considered abuse.

 

[Hogg]

Jarz, I disagree with your assertion that AAS might still be legal if people didnt "abuse" them. They werent made illegal because people "abused" them. A simple check on history in the late 80s/early 90s will show you the actual push to make them a Sch. III drug.

Hogg, I think you misread what Joe wrote. He clearly said that test will shut you down.

Edit - looks like you are right bob, the cached copy on the palm shows that the statement was in there.

Still, what is the significance of "EQ/tren isnt" in that statement?

 

[jarz]

I am a sinner and so are you that is how. I am a believer. I didn't make the rules. i just tell you the way I see it. I know it is a bad decision to juice and so are all the other sins bad decisions. Are you saying i am going to hell because i sin?

jarz for my sake I am glad jesus is judging me and not you.

Im not saying you will go to hell. What I am saying is if you know its wrong yet you continue to do it, do you think you will go unscathed? You will have to answer for you indiscretions. I am not trying to judge you, merely point out a flaw in your thought process. No offense intended.

 

[Bob Smith]

Ill read that when I actually have some time to sift through it. But that was also from 2002, long after the initial Steroid Control Act was put in place.

Pretty much every medical establishment/organization was against the scheduling of AAS. It was the NCAA, IOC, and similar that was behind the Control Act of 1990. That decision had nothing to do with health reasons. Besides that, AAS doesnt even match the requirements to be Sch. III.