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Readalots Enhanced Testing

narta said:
In order to skew hplc you need to empty half a vial and refill it. In order to contaminate it you need one drop.

Know the difference.

You are not naive, just pathologically fixated on your crusade.

I am done with the whole circle jerk.

Adios and happy new year
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If You Say So Wow GIF by Identity


Happy Holidays and Happy New Year.
 
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readalot said:
**Visible particulates.
No source should have these "floaters" in their finished oil. Make sure you ask them their SOP to ensure these particulates don't make it into the vial (vial, not vile). Unacceptable. Maybe they need the education.
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Floater-free UGL is the ideal we should be aiming for. BUT we need to be realistic here.

With the possible exception of small homebrew-cum-mini-UGL’s selling a few dozen vials a week at most, I highly doubt any UGL does any vial inspections for visible floaters. Sure many have claimed to do so over the years, but it would take far too long for them to do in reality.

I’m going to go against the grain here & say a single instance of a floater being reported for a popular source isn’t something to argue for a lynching - all UGL’s have them over time. Given the consensus that most of these floaters are fibres from filters, with them either having detached during filtering, or possibly even been left over / loose from the filter’s manufacture, then given the time constraints of visually inspecting each & every vial, there really isn’t much (if anything) a UGL can do to stop this happening occasionally.

Key point here being occasionally. When it’s happening more than once in a blue moon, then yeah, set fire to their thread because they’re clearly doing something wrong - be it using low quality filters, applying too much vacuum, not following good procedures (for non-filter fibres) etc.

What I’m saying is we need to be realistic in our standards & expectations. If anyone wants 100% guaranteed floater free gear all the time, then stick to pharma amps (which are available from several vendors on Meso) & accept you’ll be limited to just test & maybe deca.
 
Zebedee said:
Floater-free UGL is the ideal we should be aiming for. BUT we need to be realistic here.

With the possible exception of small homebrew-cum-mini-UGL’s selling a few dozen vials a week at most, I highly doubt any UGL does any vial inspections for visible floaters. Sure many have claimed to do so over the years, but it would take far too long for them to do in reality.

I’m going to go against the grain here & say a single instance of a floater being reported for a popular source isn’t something to argue for a lynching - all UGL’s have them over time. Given the consensus that most of these floaters are fibres from filters, with them either having detached during filtering, or possibly even been left over / loose from the filter’s manufacture, then given the time constraints of visually inspecting each & every vial, there really isn’t much (if anything) a UGL can do to stop this happening occasionally.

Key point here being occasionally. When it’s happening more than once in a blue moon, then yeah, set fire to their thread because they’re clearly doing something wrong - be it using low quality filters, applying too much vacuum, not following good procedures (for non-filter fibres) etc.

What I’m saying is we need to be realistic in our standards & expectations. If anyone wants 100% guaranteed floater free gear all the time, then stick to pharma amps (which are available from several vendors on Meso) & accept you’ll be limited to just test & maybe deca.
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Why is it unrealistic to expect them to take the two seconds to look at the vial before throwing it in a shipping bag? As every single vial is hand shipped. IIRC the recent floaters have been easily spotted, its not like they are microscopic.

I dont think expecting floater free gear is unrealistic, it should be the minimum.
 
RekTest said:
Why is it unrealistic to expect them to take the two seconds to look at the vial before throwing it in a shipping bag? As every single vial is hand shipped. IIRC the recent floaters have been easily spotted, its not like they are microscopic.

I dont think expecting floater free gear is unrealistic, it should be the minimum.
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Because imagine the volume of stuff some of these labs produce.

He said it at the beginning.

I think what he was referring to here

Zebedee said:
single instance of a floater being reported for a popular source isn’t something to argue for a lynching - all UGL’s have them over time. Given the consensus that most of these floaters are fibres
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Is what happened with GA recently.

What has been going on for years with Qsc was a different thing.
He named no names but I shall.

He using the word "realistic" which was also spoken about for some testing scenarios, one of which has been taken off the list (you and I learnt about this the other day).

So I agree with you in the "want".
But like Zebedee says how does that work in reality?

You say it is feasible for anyone to check before putting them in the envelope, when a few of them (GA included) haven't even yet bothered to sort out and finalise decent packaging.

Also, Zebedee, what are you saying to people who end up getting oils containing floaters?

You replied to me on another thread that that should not happen, at all.
But I know you were referring to Qsc, in that instance.

Do you say just filter it, mate?
 
Spaceman Spiff said:
If a UGL has 1/3000 vials with a floater that is impressive and I would say that this acceptable.

People should inspect their vials on exit and on obtaining it.
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So it is wrong to think (like Zebdee is saying) that each vial cannot be inspected, regardless of numbers, it is not an unrealistic expectation.

Of course, when one receives it they have all the time in the world to inspect what they were sent.
It is mad to think that there are people who do not.
 
iris said:
So it is wrong to think (like Zebdee is saying) that each vial cannot be inspected, regardless of numbers, it is not an unrealistic expectation.

Of course, when one receives it they have all the time in the world to inspect what they were sent.
It is mad to think that there are people who do not.
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Every vial should have an attempt to be inspected for quality control.

It's reasonable that no one is perfect.

Go for the place that scores 99.5%+ on quality control right?
 
RekTest said:
Why is it unrealistic to expect them to take the two seconds to look at the vial before throwing it in a shipping bag? As every single vial is hand shipped. IIRC the recent floaters have been easily spotted, its not like they are microscopic.

I dont think expecting floater free gear is unrealistic, it should be the minimum.
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The recent ones perhaps, but in the past there’s been numerous cases where members have posted pics of floaters & said it took them several mins of looking closely to spot them.
 
Zebedee said:
The recent ones perhaps, but in the past there’s been numerous cases where members have posted pics of floaters & said it took them several mins of looking closely to spot them.
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So you could perhaps say the recent ones are getting worse?
Maybe because were letting them slack off (the source…)
 
RekTest said:
Accepting any flaoters is just moving the goal posts further back, for the source and letting them get away with more and more.
Sources should be held to Q&C.
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No I don’t think it is. Eg Stan’s been in business here for several years & had a couple of floaters. If you search through his thread, you’ll see I tried to highlight one when it was being ignored & fanbois jumped in to defend him - so no, i don’t have a history of letting sources off the hook. But his customers accepting that he has the very occasional floater hasn’t encouraged him to “get away with more & more”, because it’s a very rare event.

Don’t assume every lab / source is like Tracy.

I’m being practical & realistic here - you cannot hold UGL to pharma standards - it’s a contradiction in terms!

If you want guaranteed floater free gear, buy pharma.
 
Zebedee said:
The recent ones perhaps, but in the past there’s been numerous cases where members have posted pics of floaters & said it took them several mins of looking closely to spot them.
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In the two vials I got from marcus with floaters it still sometimes takes me a minute to find it even though I know its there. But I'm not using a black light. I should pick one up and see if it helps.
 
RekTest said:
So you could perhaps say the recent ones are getting worse?
Maybe because were letting them slack off (the source…)
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Yes, worse than some previous ones obviously.

As for letting sources off the hook - well the irony here is that Stan totally avoided vetting when he first arrived, thanks to his friendship with prominent members & he’s refused point blank to prove he has X, Y or Z kit (eg flow hood, autoclave etc. The only other source I can think of that’s ever bypassed vetting was CatCafe USA.

But yeah, at the same time standards have slipped & this was absolutely tied to the arrival of QSC & cheap Chinese oils - no question whatsoever about that. But it’s also tied in to the influx of newer members, many of whom are never going to get on board with holding sources to account.
 
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