Stack eca

[Aiden7]

Hello guys !
Im looking for some feeds back about ECAA.
Also i would like to know a good source to get some because there is any on basicstero or roidsmania.
I would prefer a product with the mix already prepare.

A big thank you to all of you who will get the times to answer.

Have a good day

 

[CaptainJericho]

I used to use Ephedrine tabs for a while, but based on my anecdotal personal experience + seeing a few other people's experience with it, for a natural trainee, it is better saved for competition or things like that, than used for regular long-term training. It amps up the nervous system so much, that I feel it is too "catabolic". Perhaps I am not using the 100% technically correct terminology, but you get my point. Natural trainees walk a fine line between net protein breakdown and net protein synthesis, and ephedrine and similar stimulants can be the straw that broke the camel's back, i.e. pushing a trainee into net protein breakdown, or simply net zero gains.
That's just my personal take on it. YMMV

 

[CaptainJericho]

I can't edit my previous post, so just to add the obvious, maybe Ephedrine, and similarly an ECA stack might make more sense for enhanced trainees for obvious reasons (same reasons why AAS can help hold lean mass, and in some cases increase it, even during a cut, while that is almost impossible for a natural trainee, except in the case of a total novice who can reap the benefits of being unadapted to strength/hypertrophy/resistance training.
But even for someone using AAS, is ECA needed to cut? To me, diet would be a better way to go about this.

 

[wildfuchs]

I can't edit my previous post, so just to add the obvious, maybe Ephedrine, and similarly an ECA stack might make more sense for enhanced trainees for obvious reasons (same reasons why AAS can help hold lean mass, and in some cases increase it, even during a cut, while that is almost impossible for a natural trainee, except in the case of a total novice who can reap the benefits of being unadapted to strength/hypertrophy/resistance training.
But even for someone using AAS, is ECA needed to cut? To me, diet would be a better way to go about this.

You sound really confused, or lost in abyss of broscience :/ ECA increases your metabolism, satiety and CNS, which all help maintain/increase your caloric deficit and keep strength up while in that deficit. Is it necessary? No, nothing is absolutely necessary, but it's very helpful.

These compounds are not catabolic (and really few are if you research it properly - T3 comes to mind but not much else).

There have been several studies, most notably that army one where they put soldiers on a steep caloric deficit, had them running lots and sleeping little as soldiers do, and there was no loss of muscle mass until single digit bodyfat levels. The fears of nattys and gearheads alike about muscle loss on a diet are irrational and based on confusing muscle glycogen+water with actual tissue.

I know you feel this burning desire to tell us your 'feels' and 'take on it' but recognize such experience reports are worthless if not from a position of authority or backed up in any other way. Just don't post.

 

[CaptainJericho]

You sound really confused, or lost in abyss of broscience :/ ECA increases your metabolism, satiety and CNS, which all help maintain/increase your caloric deficit and keep strength up while in that deficit. Is it necessary? No, nothing is absolutely necessary, but it's very helpful.

These compounds are not catabolic (and really few are if you research it properly - T3 comes to mind but not much else).

There have been several studies, most notably that army one where they put soldiers on a steep caloric deficit, had them running lots and sleeping little as soldiers do, and there was no loss of muscle mass until single digit bodyfat levels. The fears of nattys and gearheads alike about muscle loss on a diet are irrational and based on confusing muscle glycogen+water with actual tissue.

I know you feel this burning desire to tell us your 'feels' and 'take on it' but recognize such experience reports are worthless if not from a position of authority or backed up in any other way. Just don't post.

Interesting. Can you post a link to this study?
I'm not saying you're wrong - I genuinely want to see this.
Btw I'm far from the only one saying this is my take on stimulants this as far as natties go. There are far more experienced and respected people than I who see it the same way, including some who have coached hundreds if not thousands of athletes, competitors, etc.
I might not be using entirely correct terminology, mind you. The CNS stimulation you correctly mention also might have indirect effects that make catabolism more likely.

 

[wildfuchs]

Interesting. Can you post a link to this study?
I'm not saying you're wrong - I genuinely want to see this.
Btw I'm far from the only one saying this is my take on stimulants this as far as natties go. There are far more experienced and respected people than I who see it the same way, including some who have coached hundreds if not thousands of athletes, competitors, etc.
I might not be using entirely correct terminology, mind you. The CNS stimulation you correctly mention also might have indirect effects that make catabolism more likely.

I'm honestly too lazy to pull up that study currently. Your claim to authority only works if you name these people (since plenty of coaches are successful while being idiots/broscientists, rarely is their success rooted in a relevant scientific degree). And CNS stimulation may have x effect but that guess is as good as 'god may exist'.

It's about minimizing broscience and wild guesses and producing verifiable, measurable data, otherwise this won't lead anywhere at all.

 

[Eman]

But even for someone using AAS, is ECA needed to cut? To me, diet would be a better way to go about this.

Um, yeah... You're still going to need to diet if you want to lose fat on ECA. ECA is only going to help make the diet more effective, if you take it without dieting you will notice absolutely nothing. As a matter of fact, you probably won't notice much of anything when when you are taking it on a diet. We're talking about a maybe 5% increase in metabolic rate...

As far as it being catabolic, it isn't and is documented as having lean mass preserving attributes. With that said, those kind of studies aren't really done on natural bodybuilders and that's a pretty extreme range of the spectrum so it's hard to know if that tracks with them... I don't know why a natural bodybuilder would take a fat burner like ephedrine in the first place though, it's against the rules.