The FDA makes the case for filtering peptides

[benfrankparkway]

I always reconstituted with the insulin needle at an angle so the water runs down the side of the vial, but those vent needles Ghoul posted look classy.

when i reconstitute I hold vial upside down and inject BAC so it pools up and once all my BAC has left the syringe, I slowly tilt vial for BAC to run down the side and start the reconstituting. It saves me from squirting water into the vial. Don't know if this method would be any more efficient

 

[always_hydrate]

For peptides, any syringe filter that's:

-Sterile (individually packed)
-.2 or .22um
-13mm
-PES (filter membrane)
-Low protein binding

The "best" are filters using the "Supor" membrane like those from Pall or B.Braun.

A very popular, reasonably priced brand is Cobetter, available on their website or via Amazon. Avoid the prefilter type (has an additional .65um filter layer).

You may want some 25mm syringe filters as well. Some "dirty" peptides will completely clog a 13mm filter in less than .5ml of liquid.

As for spikes and particle filters for AAS please see
10ml or 20ml or 30ml vials

Feel free to ask any questions.

I'm sorry if I shouldn't respond to old posts like this but I can't view your profile to DM you. I'm very new to AAS and peptides and just trying to learn as much as I can before I dive in as safety is a top priority for me.

Is there any reason I should avoid the prefilter type? I can't find the cobetter filters without the prefilter. I have some reconstituted vials of BPC-157 and Retatrutide in the fridge, and I've put them in a vacuum sealed black container with desiccant packets for humidity. I want to filter them before use, and I was going to buy some sterile vials from amazon for that purpose. Would I be okay getting some sterile vials off amazon and using the Cobetter filters with the prefilter?

If so, would I draw the entire contents of the glass vial the peptides are currently in (2mL) and use one 33mm filter to move it into the new sterile vial?

This is a bit beyond the scope of your original post but I'm also wondering whether or not the process i'm using to store and inject is good for keeping the peptides potent. Currently I open the vacuum sealed container, take the peptides out, wait for the humidity and condensation to go away, clean the rubber stopper with an alcohol swab and wait for it to dry, draw and inject, and return the peptides to the vacuum sealed container. I do this every 5 days for the Retatrutide and every other day for the BPC-157.

 

[Ghoul]

I'm sorry if I shouldn't respond to old posts like this but I can't view your profile to DM you. I'm very new to AAS and peptides and just trying to learn as much as I can before I dive in as safety is a top priority for me.

Is there any reason I should avoid the prefilter type? I can't find the cobetter filters without the prefilter. I have some reconstituted vials of BPC-157 and Retatrutide in the fridge, and I've put them in a vacuum sealed black container with desiccant packets for humidity. I want to filter them before use, and I was going to buy some sterile vials from amazon for that purpose. Would I be okay getting some sterile vials off amazon and using the Cobetter filters with the prefilter?

If so, would I draw the entire contents of the glass vial the peptides are currently in (2mL) and use one 33mm filter to move it into the new sterile vial?

This is a bit beyond the scope of your original post but I'm also wondering whether or not the process i'm using to store and inject is good for keeping the peptides potent. Currently I open the vacuum sealed container, take the peptides out, wait for the humidity and condensation to go away, clean the rubber stopper with an alcohol swab and wait for it to dry, draw and inject, and return the peptides to the vacuum sealed container. I do this every 5 days for the Retatrutide and every other day for the BPC-157.

It's fine man. 10 year old threads here get resurrected from time to time, lol.

The prefilter isn't terrible, but unnecessary and will cause a very slight loss peptide.

You can find them without prefilter here.

More importantly, 33mm is far too large. The holdup volume, the amount of liquid lost to the filter is .13ml vs .03ml. with a 13mm filter.

Sterile 0.2 μm PES Syringe Filters

Hydrophilic PES syringe filters with single or double-layer membrane. Pore sizes of 0.2μm. Diameter of 13mm/25mm/33mm with Luer lock. Sterile individually packed. Used for sterile filtration of protein solutions, cell culture media, and buffers.

shop.cobetter.com

These vials are certified particulate free, and as particulates are one of the reasons for filtering. the preferred type to inject your filtered solution into:

Buy Ultra Spec Sterile 2ml Clear Sealed Glass Vials at wholesale prices

In order to receive vials in sealed shrink wrap boxes, please order in multiples of 25

www.medical-and-lab-supplies.com

Your process, storing away from light, avoiding humidity buildup, sterilizing top and allowing to dry is textbook, however. there's no need for vacuuming that container. The vials are sealed and the pressure differential may actually compromise the vial seal over time.

Feel free to hit me up with any questions.

 

[always_hydrate]

It's fine man. 10 year old threads here get resurrected from time to time, lol.

The prefilter isn't terrible, but unnecessary and will cause a very slight loss peptide.

You can find them without prefilter here.

More importantly, 33mm is far too large. The holdup volume, the amount of liquid lost to the filter is .13ml vs .03ml. with a 13mm filter.

Sterile 0.2 μm PES Syringe Filters

Hydrophilic PES syringe filters with single or double-layer membrane. Pore sizes of 0.2μm. Diameter of 13mm/25mm/33mm with Luer lock. Sterile individually packed. Used for sterile filtration of protein solutions, cell culture media, and buffers.

shop.cobetter.com

These vials are certified particulate free, and as particulates are one of the reasons for filtering. the preferred type to inject your filtered solution into:

Buy Ultra Spec Sterile 2ml Clear Sealed Glass Vials at wholesale prices

In order to receive vials in sealed shrink wrap boxes, please order in multiples of 25

www.medical-and-lab-supplies.com

Your process, storing away from light, avoiding humidity buildup, sterilizing top and allowing to dry is textbook, however. there's no need for vacuuming that container. The vials are sealed and the pressure differential may actually compromise the vial seal over time.

Feel free to hit me up with any questions.

Thank you! I placed an order for those filters and the vials you linked me. I've heard that peptides like TB-500 are more sensitive to oxidizing. How would you deal with that, or am I misinformed? I saw some condensation when I reconstituted my Retatrutide for the first time today and it didn't go away even after being at room temp for ~30 minutes. I ended up just putting it back in the fridge at that point anyway after wrapping the vial in aluminum foil.

 

[Ghoul]

Thank you! I placed an order for those filters and the vials you linked me. I've heard that peptides like TB-500 are more sensitive to oxidizing. How would you deal with that, or am I misinformed? I saw some condensation when I reconstituted my Retatrutide for the first time today and it didn't go away even after being at room temp for ~30 minutes. I ended up just putting it back in the fridge at that point anyway after wrapping the vial in aluminum foil.

If the vial has vacuum when you reconstitute oxidation isn't a concern.

Once reconstituted oxidation isn't a concern. You can't do anything from the outside of a sealed vial to reduce oxidation of the lyophilized peptide.

Don't get overly concerned about condensation. You just want to avoid piercing the stopper with bacteria laden condensate sitting on top introducing it into the vial.

 

[always_hydrate]

If the vial has vacuum when you reconstitute oxidation isn't a concern.

Once reconstituted oxidation isn't a concern. You can't do anything from the outside of a sealed vial to reduce oxidation of the lyophilized peptide.

Don't get overly concerned about condensation. You just want to avoid piercing the stopper with bacteria laden condensate sitting on top introducing it into the vial.

So I store my lyophilized peptides in the fridge, take them out and let them warm for a sec before adding bac water, filter into new sterile vial, wait for that solution to hit room temp if theres any condensation (if the lyophilized powder wasn't actually at room temp when I added the bac water), draw and inject, return to fridge newly reconstituted and filtered in the new vial?

How long can I expect lyophilized peptides to last in the fridge if the seal is good and assuming good quality, and what about when it's been reconstituted? I know it varies for different peptides but I would appreciate some insight into retatrutide, BPC-157, and TB-500 specifically if you have any. I'm a bit wary of buying in bulk but I also don't want to go without my shit for a long time in case theres a supply issue.

 

[Ghoul]

So I store my lyophilized peptides in the fridge, take them out and let them warm for a sec before adding bac water, filter into new sterile vial, wait for that solution to hit room temp if theres any condensation (if the lyophilized powder wasn't actually at room temp when I added the bac water), draw and inject, return to fridge newly reconstituted and filtered in the new vial?

How long can I expect lyophilized peptides to last in the fridge if the seal is good and assuming good quality, and what about when it's been reconstituted? I know it varies for different peptides but I would appreciate some insight into retatrutide, BPC-157, and TB-500 specifically if you have any. I'm a bit wary of buying in bulk but I also don't want to go without my shit for a long time in case theres a supply issue.

It's impossible to say. As a rule of thumb, a six month's worth in the refrigerator should be ok, as few peptides. kept out of light, in vacuuum vials. would suffer significant degradation under those conditions.

Over that amount of time, freezing, in a non defrosting freezer, would be preferable.

 

[always_hydrate]

It's impossible to say. As a rule of thumb, a six month's worth in the refrigerator should be ok, as few peptides. kept out of light, in vacuuum vials. would suffer significant degradation under those conditions.

Over that amount of time, freezing, in a non defrosting freezer, would be preferable.

After reading your post about peptide dilution (~0.5mL per dose) and minimizing weekly injections to avoid immune responses:

1. Could you explain why these practices help prevent immune responses?
2. Storage questions:
   • I currently store all peptides (lyophilized and reconstituted) in a black container in my fridge with desiccant packs
   • For frequently used peptides like BPC-157 (every other day), is it better to:a) Remove them more often for dosing despite temperature fluctuations affecting all stored peptidesb) Group injections to minimize fridge opening, potentially sacrificing optimal timing
3. Injection temperature:
   • Do you wait for peptides to reach room temperature before injecting
   • Or do you inject immediately after removal from refrigeration to minimize temperature fluctuation time

Thank you for your insights.

 

[OldGHGuy]

Many of these vials are vacuum sealed, in which case the vacuum basically sucks in the BAC water relatively quickly. Perhaps you could try to slow it down by grabbing the plunger but I've never done that.

Some of the vacuums are amazingly strong. For that reason, I always release the pressure first by poking a pin (not attached to a barrel) thru the stopper first

 

[Ghoul]

I use these pressure equalizing side flow reconstitution needles.

It releases vacuum, then as you inject the BAC, which comes out of a port on the side so doesn't hit the lyophilized puck directly, it releases pressure allowing a full 3ml to be put in the vial without back pressure stopping it.

Never gotten a single bubble or foam since using these.

 

[Ateam2023]

when i reconstitute I hold vial upside down and inject BAC so it pools up and once all my BAC has left the syringe, I slowly tilt vial for BAC to run down the side and start the reconstituting. It saves me from squirting water into the vial. Don't know if this method would be any more efficient

I do something similar, i hold mine at a 90* angle and let the vacuum pull the water down the side , never any problems of foaming etc,,

 

[Sera]

It's fine man. 10 year old threads here get resurrected from time to time, lol.

The prefilter isn't terrible, but unnecessary and will cause a very slight loss peptide.

You can find them without prefilter here.

More importantly, 33mm is far too large. The holdup volume, the amount of liquid lost to the filter is .13ml vs .03ml. with a 13mm filter.

Sterile 0.2 μm PES Syringe Filters

Hydrophilic PES syringe filters with single or double-layer membrane. Pore sizes of 0.2μm. Diameter of 13mm/25mm/33mm with Luer lock. Sterile individually packed. Used for sterile filtration of protein solutions, cell culture media, and buffers.

shop.cobetter.com

These vials are certified particulate free, and as particulates are one of the reasons for filtering. the preferred type to inject your filtered solution into:

Buy Ultra Spec Sterile 2ml Clear Sealed Glass Vials at wholesale prices

In order to receive vials in sealed shrink wrap boxes, please order in multiples of 25

www.medical-and-lab-supplies.com

Your process, storing away from light, avoiding humidity buildup, sterilizing top and allowing to dry is textbook, however. there's no need for vacuuming that container. The vials are sealed and the pressure differential may actually compromise the vial seal over time.

Feel free to hit me up with any questions.

Might want to rinse these filters first given that they aren’t guaranteed to be particulate free.

 

[Ateam2023]

Might want to rinse these filters first given that they aren’t guaranteed to be particulate free.

And where did you get that " they aren't particulant free"? Curious??

 

[Sera]

And where did you get that " they aren't particulant free"? Curious??

Well they don’t state anywhere that they are particulate free. They might be. I’d personally pass a little water for injection/ bac water through them first and discard it just to be safe. These aren’t certified for medical use after all.

 

[Ghoul]

Well they don’t state anywhere that they are particulate free. They might be. I’d personally pass a little water for injection/ bac water through them first and discard it just to be safe. These aren’t certified for medical use after all.

I use filters with the Supor PES membrane (Pall, Braun, and others) which specify they're shed-free, and for use in pharma compounding, IV, bolus, and even interocular (eye) injection filtration.

Since shedding particles would also foul samples for chromatography analysis (likely the most common use for these filters) one would assume the large brands that supply labs don't have this issue, like Pall, Tisch, Cobetter.

The no name Amazon and Alibaba filters might not be as good quality though.

Nothing wrong with pre-wetting filters though. Although peptide loss to adhesion is usually very low with PES, pre wetting probably lowers it more and avoids increasing the peptide concentration since some water remains behind while the peptide passes through when absorbed by the dry filter.

 

[RandGuy]

Any thoughts about daily vs. every-other-day injections (as for anti-aging effects in elderly), or immunogenicity risk in elderly vs. young subjects?

 

[Ghoul]

Any thoughts about daily vs. every-other-day injections (as for anti-aging effects in elderly), or immunogenicity risk in elderly vs. young subjects?

It's dependent on the specific peptide/protein drug.

However, all other things being equal, generally, more frequent injections ("exposure events") and LOWER doses are associated with stronger immunogenic reactions.

 

[RandGuy]

However, all other things being equal, generally, more frequent injections ("exposure events") and LOWER doses are associated with stronger immunogenic reactions.

Thx. So that sounds like a wash (fewer injections but more peptide each - am dealing with HGH).

When Jano reports a % purity and dimer, what do you take from that wrt possible immunogenic content? I assume higher purity, lower dimer is indicative of _likely_ lower immunogenicity, but do you have a sense of how to judge the value of that relative to the value of filtering? For example, should one be concerned at all about 96% vs. 98% purity, or 1% dimer vs. undetectable. Do those numbers really matter much relative to the protection one gets from filtering?

 

[Ghoul]

Thx. So that sounds like a wash (fewer injections but more peptide each - am dealing with HGH).

When Jano reports a % purity and dimer, what do you take from that wrt possible immunogenic content? I assume higher purity, lower dimer is indicative of _likely_ lower immunogenicity, but do you have a sense of how to judge the value of that relative to the value of filtering? For example, should one be concerned at all about 96% vs. 98% purity, or 1% dimer vs. undetectable. Do those numbers really matter much relative to the protection one gets from filtering?

First, and this is very important.

All rHGH (and every other peptide) purity tests are conducted AFTER being filtered with a .22um PES filter.

"Impurities" larger than .22um, and there are likely many in that UGL produced vial, are left out of the purity calculation.

Whether it's aggregates or glass particles from a cheap vial, they're removed before the analysis.

An analogy would be filtering your home water first, then having it analyzed for contamination.

So if you love the result of a Jano test, you need to FILTER it first to know you're injecting the same product the test represents. Otherwise, you're getting what the test showed+the contaminants caught by the filter.

(this is not a limitation specific to Jano's testing, who is the most credible of all the labs UGL peptide users use, but all of them, since they all rely on HPLC as the sole method for testing).

Pharma, the FDA, and researchers use multiple of testing peptides to detect all impurities, since they all have "blind spots".

In my opinion, the Jano results give you an idea of production quality. If there's 0% dimer "and related proteins", and very high purity, whoever produced that rHGH went thorough the labor intensive purification steps after making a batch.

Unfortunately besides missing any impurities removed by the .22um filter, which are going to be the most immunogenic, the testing also doesn't reveal anything about stability. Even if you tested using multiple methods, and found a low level of impurities shortly after reconstitution, 2 or 7 or 15 days later there could be 100x more contamination from aggregation because the UGL formulation, unlike pharma, didn't include the necessary ingredients to ensure the proper PH is maintained.

The TLDR is this. There are so many variables outside of our control, if and until comprehensive testing becomes available, the best course of action is to choose a product with the best purity/dimer result you can find, in the smallest dose vials practical so they're used up in a short amount of time after reconstitution, and then filter to minimize whatever level of contamination is present.

 

[RandGuy]

Thx for reviewing those key pts.

Small point: Technically, since (I assume) Jano is basing purity relative to the initial vial sample mass, he doesn't really "miss" any impurities (purity = HGH found / sample mass). We just can't say much about the nature of all those impurities based on the dimer content, although lower dimer would hopefully have some relation to immunogenicity, and good lab practice... So his results do reflect what you're injecting - he just isn't telling us much about what's in there other than the HGH and "dimers" making it thru 0.2 µm filter.