The Passion of The Christ

[garyzilla]

I walked into the movie theater never having read a review or a plot and thus had no idea what to expect. The combination of gore, the dolby sound system cranked up, and Ms Hogg balling her eyes out had me in a rather melancholy state within the first hour.

If you did not know the plot of the movie, than I see how you can be a little upset with the movie.

 

[Hogg]

His ressurection was the final blow to satin and was neccessary.

Far from it, the final blow to satan will be as discussed in the revelation. There is a constant spiritual battle going on right now.....there will be no closure until the rapture.

 

[Mark Kerr]

Personally Hogg, I dont think Gibson should have "softened" the movie because of what some extremist redneck might do. I think it is just that sort of thinking that is hurting America in general. Just because you make a film or product that 1% of America might abuse, doesnt mean you should have to change it to be "PC." That is the same mentality that outlawed steroids and now want to outlaw guns. Of course, that doesnt stop us from getting steroids and wont stop a criminal from getting a gun.

I also prefer movies that show Christ as a teacher and Savior, but I read beforehand that this is about the last 12 hours, so I knew what to expect. I could see how that could throw a curve to someone.

Personally, I consider myself an educated man regarding religion, but it seems you and I have a different goal. If I had a time machine, I would go back to the time of Christ and observe his entire life, from birth to death. I wouldnt just stop following him when it became "too violent or gory" for my taste. I want to know as much as I can about Christ, and I am not afraid to see what really happened to him.

[MK]

P.S. Rod, disbelief in God in no more sophisticated than belief in God. If you think you have some sort of "intellectual power" that others dont have to see through myth, then you seem to have an advantage over Kierkegaard, Lewis, and even Einstein. Belief is not about intelligence, it is about faith.

 

[Hogg]

I agree with Stevemac and will add that to say that Jesus' Resurrection made His death moot, is really missing the point. His death replaced the libations and such that Jews presented to God for the cleansing of their sins. By accepting Jesus as your Lord and Savior, your sins are forgiven.

His Resurrection proves what Jesus said, that He would rise in 3 days, and shows people that there is and will be life after death. Accept Jesus as your Lord and Savior and have eternal life in Heaven or do not accept Him and have eternal life in Hell. Also, His Resurrection is symbolic of accepting Him as Lord and Savior and "being born-again."

without Christ, no one other than the jews would go to heaven.....even God's chosen people, the jews, continued to sin, they turned their back on God time and time again, yet he still loved them as his children. When Christ came it changed things quite a bit. No longer did you have to be one of God's chosen people to be saved. Rather, anyone who believes that Christ died on the cross to redeem them for their sins will have eternal life....you see, and yet the jews essentially denounce Christ, they remain in the old testament and thus discount Christ and the gospels which make up the new testament.....they still follow what is know as 'the law'.....which they have never been able to follow for thousands of years.

The study of the belief systems of the various religions is interesting. There are millions of people from different walks of life, all aligned with different beliefs, and all of them seek salvation. Some deny Christ, others believe in Christ yet discount the scope of his role on earth.....it is really fascinating to listen to those with different beliefs and to understand why they believe that they are going to heaven and everyone else is going to hell....or essentiallyl to become dust and nothing more when you die......I wonder how some of these folks came to their conclusions.......as there are very few unequivocal answers.......yet whenever you stare up into the sky or pick a rock up off the ground.....or watch a child playing with a puppy, you see God's work firsthand.....even those who trace man back to the Cambrian fish have trouble explaining where the first spec of matter or energy came from......big bang or not, whatever, at the center of it all is an omnipotent being, a chief engineer of all things, the creator, the architect, the father of existence.....I guess I'm more concerned about those who do not believe in God rather than about those who believe but have a tweaked ideology......at least they are smart enough to realize that God exists .....those who do not acknowledge God are essentially blind to the facts around them......kinda makes you wonder about a person who thinks this all just happened by chance.

 

[garyzilla]

without Christ, no one other than the jews would go to heaven.....even God's chosen people, the jews, continued to sin, they turned their back on God time and time again, yet he still loved them as his children. When Christ came it changed things quite a bit. No longer did you have to be one of God's chosen people to be saved. Rather, anyone who believes that Christ died on the cross to redeem them for their sins will have eternal life....you see, and yet the jews essentially denounce Christ, they remain in the old testament and thus discount Christ and the gospels which make up the new testament.....they still follow what is know as 'the law'.....which they have never been able to follow for thousands of years.

The study of the belief systems of the various religions is interesting. There are millions of people from different walks of life, all aligned with different beliefs, and all of them seek salvation. Some deny Christ, others believe in Christ yet discount the scope of his role on earth.....it is really fascinating to listen to those with different beliefs and to understand why they believe that they are going to heaven and everyone else is going to hell....or essentiallyl to become dust and nothing more when you die......I wonder how some of these folks came to their conclusions.......as there are very few unequivocal answers.......yet whenever you stare up into the sky or pick a rock up off the ground.....or watch a child playing with a puppy, you see God's work firsthand.....even those who trace man back to the Cambrian fish have trouble explaining where the first spec of matter or energy came from......big bang or not, whatever, at the center of it all is an omnipotent being, a chief engineer of all things, the creator, the architect, the father of existence.....I guess I'm more concerned about those who do not believe in God rather than about those who believe but have a tweaked ideology......at least they are smart enough to realize that God exists .....those who do not acknowledge God are essentially blind to the facts around them......kinda makes you wonder about a person who thinks this all just happened by chance.

Excellent post Hogg, but Ruth and Rahab where not Jews but still I believe are in heaven.

 

[Hogg]

Personally Hogg, I dont think Gibson should have "softened" the movie because of what some extremist redneck might do. I think it is just that sort of thinking that is hurting America in general. Just because you make a film or product that 1% of America might abuse, doesnt mean you should have to change it to be "PC." That is the same mentality that outlawed steroids and now want to outlaw guns. Of course, that doesnt stop us from getting steroids and wont stop a criminal from getting a gun.

I also prefer movies that show Christ as a teacher and Savior, but I read beforehand that this is about the last 12 hours, so I knew what to expect. I could see how that could throw a curve to someone.

Personally, I consider myself an educated man regarding religion, but it seems you and I have a different goal. If I had a time machine, I would go back to the time of Christ and observe his entire life, from birth to death. I wouldnt just stop following him when it became "too violent or gory" for my taste. I want to know as much as I can about Christ, and I am not afraid to see what really happened to him.

[MK]

P.S. Rod, disbelief in God in no more sophisticated than belief in God. If you think you have some sort of "intellectual power" that others dont have to see through myth, then you seem to have an advantage over Kierkegaard, Lewis, and even Einstein. Belief is not about intelligence, it is about faith.

I'm sorry counsel but where did you read that I felt Gibson should have softened the movie for sake of preventiing acts of transgression by some moron who used the movie as an excuse?? I simply postulated that an intellectually-challenged soul may transgress against others as a result of this movie.

With respect to your second argument, I'm not a fan of hollywood, and I've read what Christ suffered firsthand as I have read the bible. I did not need a Hollywood-contrived representation of the brutality that Christ suffered to understand the suffering that he went through......quite frankly, Hollywood is not reality, reality would have been, as you say, being there. Special effects and dolby sound are not what I consider reality. bearing witness would have been reality however, we would have had to have lived many years ago to have experienced Christ's suffering.

The movie offered little to me in my spiritual journey.....perhaps you found that it served some type of purpose in yours.

 

[Hogg]

Excellent post Hogg, but Ruth and Rahab where not Jews but still I believe are in heaven.

Sounds like I might need to begin pass #4 from cover to cover. My recent readings have been outside of the Bible yet nonetheless related to my quest for enlightenment.

 

[Rod]

"I wonder how some of these folks came to their conclusions.......as there are very few unequivocal answers.......yet whenever you stare up into the sky or pick a rock up off the ground.....or watch a child playing with a puppy, you see God's work firsthand.....even those who trace man back to the Cambrian fish have trouble explaining where the first spec of matter or energy came from......big bang or not, whatever, at the center of it all is an omnipotent being, a chief engineer of all things, the creator, the architect, the father of existence.....I guess I'm more concerned about those who do not believe in God rather than about those who believe but have a tweaked ideology......at least they are smart enough to realize that God exists .....those who do not acknowledge God are essentially blind to the facts around them......kinda makes you wonder about a person who thinks this all just happened by chance."

Hogg you raise some good points. I wish that I wasn't drunk at 4:30pm on a Sunday afternoon. I may have been able to contribute to the dialouge. But as I am there is no chance. God please forgive me.

 

[Rod]

"P.S. Rod, disbelief in God in no more sophisticated than belief in God. If you think you have some sort of "intellectual power" that others dont have to see through myth, then you seem to have an advantage over Kierkegaard, Lewis, and even Einstein. Belief is not about intelligence, it is about faith"

Mark I was being sarcastic. Contrasting interpretations "hell-bound heathen" vs "a sophisticated realist".

 

[Mark Kerr]

I apologize Hogg, but I thought you were implying that Gibson should have softened the movie...I guess I was wrong. I general, when someone says a movie is "too violent," then they are implying that they would have prefered the director make it less violent...

Technically, I never said that you said Gibson should soften the movie, but I did imply it, so I hope we arent playing games here...because adults dont engage in the "implication game." (Except Bill Clinton)

I really didnt help my spiritual journey, I just found the Passions more captivating than the Bible, probably because text (as a medium in general) is a less powerful than film...

[MK]

 

[Mark Kerr]

Sorry Rod. I didnt catch it. My mistake...



[MK]

 

[Hogg]

I apologize Hogg, but I thought you were implying that Gibson should have softened the movie...I guess I was wrong. I general, when someone says a movie is "too violent," then they are implying that they would have prefered the director make it less violent...

Technically, I never said that you said Gibson should soften the movie, but I did imply it, so I hope we arent playing games here...because adults dont engage in the "implication game." (Except Bill Clinton)

I really didnt help my spiritual journey, I just found the Passions more captivating than the Bible, probably because text (as a medium in general) is a less powerful than film...

[MK]

No offense taken MK.

 

[stevemac]

well, satan already knows he is defeated, now his goal is take take as much souls with him to hell as he can beffore his time, for satan and his demons inhabit earth as of now, not hell. remember when Jesus came across Legion, "we know you son of god, what have you to do with us before our time" this meaning the the second coming of christ.

Far from it, the final blow to satan will be as discussed in the revelation. There is a constant spiritual battle going on right now.....there will be no closure until the rapture.

 

[Peace Division]

I just wanna say, that there have been some solid posts on this thread, and that I've definitely learned from them. And the book, "The Purpose Driven Life" is definitely a good read and recommended for anyone.

 

[garyzilla]

I'm sorry counsel but where did you read that I felt Gibson should have softened the movie for sake of preventiing acts of transgression by some moron who used the movie as an excuse?? I simply postulated that an intellectually-challenged soul may transgress against others as a result of this movie.

With respect to your second argument, I'm not a fan of hollywood, and I've read what Christ suffered firsthand as I have read the bible. I did not need a Hollywood-contrived representation of the brutality that Christ suffered to understand the suffering that he went through......quite frankly, Hollywood is not reality, reality would have been, as you say, being there. Special effects and dolby sound are not what I consider reality. bearing witness would have been reality however, we would have had to have lived many years ago to have experienced Christ's suffering.

The movie offered little to me in my spiritual journey.....perhaps you found that it served some type of purpose in yours.

You guys really impress me. I wish I could sit down face to face with you guys and just kick back and have a good conversation with you all!

 

[armsports]

Yeah Peace, that is an excellent book. Read it twice actually. Very easy to comprehend and applicable to everyday life.

 

[garyzilla]

I just wanna say, that there have been some solid posts on this thread, and that I've definitely learned from them. And the book, "The Purpose Driven Life" is definitely a good read and recommended for anyone.

I agreee Peace! I have really enjoyed "The Purpose Driven Church" as well!

 

[Hogg]

You guys really impress me. I wish I could sit down face to face with you guys and just kick back and have a good conversation with you all!

It is really nice to be able to have intellectual discussions with some of the guys on the board. Meso's membership come from all walks of life and I have developed a number of friendships from this board that I value very highly. Mind you, some go beyond the electronic world, I have met a few people from meso face to face.

 

[motoxman]

good movie

Just went tonight and saw the movie.....Holy hell people can be sadistic....Very impressive show....Really makes you think about life.The suffering he went through is unimaginable.....my god

motoxman

 

[Bob Smith]

Hogg believe it or not, I am in agreement with you. I feel the same way about pastors and churches that are big bussiness and only want to get rich. My fear is that there are people you think just like you and I, and will never set foot in a church because they feel all churches are the same. By the way, there is a church in Orange County that I know is not like the others. It is called Saddleback Community Church, and the pastor is Rick Warren.

I have much of the same arguements as Hogg and Gary. I have heard many wonderful things about Saddleback Church and how Rick Warren administers his church.