MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
Trizepatide tips / tricks
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Ghoul
Well-known Member
The effect of GLP is extraordinarily profound, and the impact on weight is only the tip of the iceberg.
only the
Metamucil isn't really medicinal. It's a natural plant fiber that's more of a dietary supplement, providing the "bulk" we lack in our calorie dense foods.
I have laxative meds just in case, but metamucil is intended to be used every day to improve overall health, including the prevention of GI irregularities, and it works really well at keeping your gut healthy.
I brought up Movicol because I used Metamucil before and didn't feel that it did much of anything, unlike my experience with Movicol (even at a lower dose).
SubparMarioBro
New Member
I’ve been taking Reta for 3 months now, TRT for 2-1/2, and I added in CJC-1295 and Ipamorelin a month ago.
On my bathroom scale (for which I do have a proper baseline) I’ve dropped from 350.4 lbs to 287.5 lbs this morning (-62.9 lbs, -18%) My DEXA scans are a bit wilder. I was dumb and got my first DEXA scan a week after I started Reta so I don’t quite have a proper baseline. But the results I have are pretty good.
Per my DEXA scans (the “baseline” is a week after I started Reta)
Total Weight: 330.8 -> 282.9 (-47.9 lbs, -14.5%)
Fat Tissue: 153.9 -> 87.8 (-66.1 lbs, -43%)
Lean Tissue: 168.4 -> 186.6 (+18.2 lbs, +10.8%)
Body Fat: 46.5% -> 31.0% (-15.5, -33%)
Visceral Fat 7.1 -> 2.8 (-4.3 lbs, -61%)
I’m sure there’s some water weight added on since I added the trt/cjc/ipa/creatine, but I’m still very happy with those numbers.
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mikeh1998
New Member
I have a friend taking Tirz, he has been fat since childhood and he's 26 now. He had 1 year from age 18-19 where calorie counting kicked in and he was able to lose weight and become a healthy BMI but he bounced back and has stayed obese since. He's mobile and has a physical job so not bedridden levels obesity.
We train at the gym together too and he's putting on muscle and strength. He also got CPAP a couple months ago and I looked at his sleep data from the app and it was an amazing and rapid improvement. He started blood pressure meds too from his doctor, he doesn't monitor BP regularly but his BP improved a lot compared to last visit (I don't have exact numbers).
He tried Sema before for about a month but it had absolutely no effect even at the high end dose.
So far on Tirz he has tried 2.5 mg for 4 weeks and 5.0 mg for 2 weeks, but also still it seems like there's no effect. On the other hand for me 5.0 mg is noticeable. The only thing he has reported on Tirz is that he has less of an appetite for fried foods but the effect is pretty mild. No change in weight or appearance for him aside from being a little more muscular in the arms, shoulders and traps.
Anyone have any advice about how to deal with this seeming nonresponse issue other than just up the dose to 7.5-10.0 mg?
I am hopeful that just upping the dose will have an effect. But I expected by now that he would "feel" something and have less of a double chin.
We train at the gym together too and he's putting on muscle and strength. He also got CPAP a couple months ago and I looked at his sleep data from the app and it was an amazing and rapid improvement. He started blood pressure meds too from his doctor, he doesn't monitor BP regularly but his BP improved a lot compared to last visit (I don't have exact numbers).
He tried Sema before for about a month but it had absolutely no effect even at the high end dose.
So far on Tirz he has tried 2.5 mg for 4 weeks and 5.0 mg for 2 weeks, but also still it seems like there's no effect. On the other hand for me 5.0 mg is noticeable. The only thing he has reported on Tirz is that he has less of an appetite for fried foods but the effect is pretty mild. No change in weight or appearance for him aside from being a little more muscular in the arms, shoulders and traps.
Anyone have any advice about how to deal with this seeming nonresponse issue other than just up the dose to 7.5-10.0 mg?
I am hopeful that just upping the dose will have an effect. But I expected by now that he would "feel" something and have less of a double chin.
Ghoul
Well-known Member
Weight loss efficacy is determined by, to oversimply the mechanism, two primary factors.
How low his endogenous production of GLP is, and the density of receptors he has, which is largely determined by genetics. Appetite suppression is hypothesized to be determined by the overall proportion of receptors agonized, so a large variation in response is not unusual, and males typically require higher levels than females, all other factors being equal.
TLDR, just increase the dose. He will almost certainly begin to respond at 7.5mg or 10mg at the most.
You should check on how he's reconstituting, administering, and storing the compound. It's very unusual to feel no appetite suppression on 2.4mg sema. Almost unheard of.
Garbage BAC can destroy peptides. What's the reconstitution ratio? In other words. what's the volume he's injecting?
Ghoul
Well-known Member
It's not critical, other than not within an hour before or after oral medication, since it can interfere with absorbtion. Most importantly is to get it every day consistently. It really helps offset the slowed digestive motility and keep things moving.
Be patient, it takes a few days for your body to adjust to the higher fiber intake, but ultimately, you'll won't want to go without it.
mikeh1998
New Member
We only use Pfizer bacteriostatic water that I got from a real med supply store in Canada. We use slin pins also sourced from a real med supply store.
Reconstitution is done by me, I am careful to follow all techniques to keep things as sterile as possible and I have experience from blasting roids on how to use needles and clean the rubber stopper and so on. I gently roll the vial in my hands (for max 5 minutes) after adding bacteriostatic water until it looks perfectly clear.
He administers the injection using a the same 1/2" slin pins as me. I taught him how to inject and he got it on the first try with ease. (I didn't do the injection for him, I just verbally gave him the instructions and he did everything right. Point is he's not afraid of needles and is not clumsy)
As for storage, I was ignorant and told him it was OK to leave it (the Semaglutide vial he used) at room temperature inside a closed box because that is what I did as well. I know you're not supposed to do this because it degrades the peptide, but I have used a Semaglutide vial 2 months after reconstituting that was sitting in my desktop drawer and it was still as effective as when it was fresh.
For the Tirzepatide vials I have told him to refrigerate it in a box placed at the bottom of the fridge. I have been refrigerating my supply too.
Old vial of Semaglutide: 5 mg + 2 mL water. The most he dosed was 2.0 mg, which is 0.8 mL. It was sourced from a reliable domestic source. I accidentally injected 2.0 mg from this batch by being a dumbass and it caused me to throw up several times 12 hours later.
Old vial of Tirzepatide: 10 mg + 2 mL water. He dosed 2.5 mg 4 times from this vial, 0.5 mL each time. It was sourced from a reliable domestic source.
Current vial of Tirzepatide: 30 mg + 3 mL water. He dosed 5.0 mg 2 times from this vial, 0.5 mL each time. This was sourced from a Chinese seller with HPLC testing. The same batch had an effect on me.
His stats are 5'7" 220 lb by the way (BMI 34.5). I am 5'9" 183 lb (BMI 27.0).
I appreciate your help in troubleshooting this by the way.
What type of protein do you find yourself most commonly consuming (red meat, chicken etc.) ? Did you drop your carbs down significantly ?
Ghoul
Well-known Member
Then it's purely a function of dose. Unfortunately, besides the varying level of sensitivity, for some the initial "gentle" reduction of appetite Tirz provides isn't sufficient to overcome their habitual overconsumption of energy, and they need the brute force of the physical effects that make overeating physically miserable. Just up the dose, If at 2 weeks of 7.5 it's not starting to have a real impact, up the next to 10. Again after two weeks if not enough 12.5. There is a difference in relative effectiveness of UGL vs pharma in my experience, in addition to the built in safety margin when the 15mg max dose was established by Eli, so a ceiling of up to 25mg is safe in my opinion.
Once you find the dose it begins having an effect, and weight starts to drop, he needs to be sensitive to a weakening in appetite reduction and titrate up again at the next dose,
Hopefully he'll hit goal weight and establish a maintenance dose before maxing out at 25mg.
mikeh1998
New Member
You're spot on with the "habitual overconsumption of energy". He's my only fat friend and so sometimes I forget what it's like to become that heavy. Hanging out with other fat people makes them forget what a normal meal is like and they start developing fat guy habits like sitting down weirdly and being unaware that your pants are sliding down your waistline revealing your bare ass. Plus having Tim Hortons wrappers and Burger King receipts everywhere in your car.
I was sitting down with him at a bar once and we're all having some drinks and chatting. I wasn't hungry but wanted some protein so I just had a fish and chips and split it 50/50 with someone. This fucking guy ate 2 entire plates of rice, beans, potatoes and a bunch of other shit, I couldn't believe it (while on 5.0 mg Tirz!). Like $40 worth of food ordered on a whim.
I'm not poor or anorexic but when I'm at a restaurant I'm always worried about not being able to finish the dish and spending too much on food I won't eat. This guy just does not have those thoughts, eating has no consequences and only upsides in his mind. I hope that the delayed gastric emptying from GLP-1's will help him develop the "oh shit I'm full"/"that's too much food" instinct.
Not even saying this in a "hehe fat people dumb" way, I empathize with them because being overweight fucking sucks. He has a literal lifetime of bad habits (not his fault) to overcome so I hope GLP-1's work out for him. He's not a lazy dude either the guy pesters me to train with him at least twice a week even if it's right after his shift hauling lumber.
bigforyouben
Member
When I started Tirz I just took fiber gummies, which probably helped. But Metamucil has given me the best sh*ts of my life.
Ghoul
Well-known Member
It's a multifaceted problem. First, there's little doubt there's an epidemic of dysregulated metabolism. "Naturally" thin people often don't appreciate they're not exhibiting extraordinary self control, even if they make "wise" choices to avoid an unhealthy snack, for instance. They simply don't have a drive to eat far beyond their requirements. We all know people who struggle to gain weight, and that it becomes physically impossible for them to eat more than a certain amount without experiencing, not coincidentally, similar effects to GLPs, ie, acid reflux, nausea, and psychological aversion to food. Wild animals don't need to learn how to calorie count even in an abundance of available food, they just eat as required, and stop when their regulatory systems determine it's time to stop.
Of course individual choice and a degree of self control come into play, particularly when choosing which foods to eat, but overall hunger and food intake are regulated by systems no less powerful than those that motivate heroin or nicotine addicts.
However, this is made worse when the emotional and physical pain of being obese is assuaged by food, providing psychological and an actual opiate like relief of suffering, albeit brief. It's a vicious cycle.
So while most overweight and mildly obese people jump on the opportunity of "food noise" being silenced to consciously do what they've always wanted to, eat less and lose weight, some very obese people will just eat despite that, and even overcome some of the milder "punishment" effects of glps.
For them; the "carrot" of relief from incessant appetite isn't enough, because now food has become codeine they use to manage the suffering of being that fat.
So they need the other effects. The stick, the effects that kick in for those with a properly functioning metabolic system. The "If I eat another bite I'll puke response.".
The good news is once they go through this, accept it as what's necessary to "retrain" them, and start to lose weight, it becomes easier and easier as the physical and emotional pain starts to ease. Then, seeing some hope, a lot become extremely enthusiastic about gritting healthy, and the vicious cycle is replaced by a virtuous one.
Luckily, he has an external motivator to help him along, and perhaps prevent him from quitting after the inevitable "I was so nauseated I thought I would die" experience when the dose finally asserts itself over his psychological desire to overeat as comfort, despite having relief from a strong appetite.
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DonLigero
Member
Even before starting on Tirz, I limited my carbs to < 50g per day on most days. I found that anything over that while on it, I would get reflux. The one time I actually ate some high sugar (2 X Reeces cups), I got the dreaded sulphur burps.
I workout within an hour of waking and as soon as I am done I hit a double whey scoop protein shake with FF Fairlife. That gets me started with 50-60g of protein. At least one protein bar mid-afternoon and I try to get at least 50g protein with lunch and supper. Most often chicken. At least once a week I will sub in lean pork and 2X per week beef. My goal is 200g protein per day and I probably average about 180g per day.
I am 6'3. SW was 438lbs and currently 270lbs. Last 3dfitscan measured 218lbs fat free mass.
Honestly often when I was at 15mg weekly tirz, I had to force down a protein shake in the evening just to get close to my protein goals. The only real side effect that I did not like was from 50-100 lbs down, my hair started thinning significantly. That's when I really started making protein the highest priority. That stopped the thinning, and I am anxiously awaiting the hope that some starts coming back. At 55 years old, I am not too concerned with the hairline, but would like to preserve as much of the gray as possible.
Ghoul
Well-known Member
Even before starting on Tirz, I limited my carbs to < 50g per day on most days. I found that anything over that while on it, I would get reflux. The one time I actually ate some high sugar (2 X Reeces cups), I got the dreaded sulphur burps.
I workout within an hour of waking and as soon as I am done I hit a double whey scoop protein shake with FF Fairlife. That gets me started with 50-60g of protein. At least one protein bar mid-afternoon and I try to get at least 50g protein with lunch and supper. Most often chicken. At least once a week I will sub in lean pork and 2X per week beef. My goal is 200g protein per day and I probably average about 180g per day.
I am 6'3. SW was 438lbs and currently 270lbs. Last 3dfitscan measured 218lbs fat free mass.
Honestly often when I was at 15mg weekly tirz, I had to force down a protein shake in the evening just to get close to my protein goals. The only real side effect that I did not like was from 50-100 lbs down, my hair started thinning significantly. That's when I really started making protein the highest priority. That stopped the thinning, and I am anxiously awaiting the hope that some starts coming back. At 55 years old, I am not too concerned with the hairline, but would like to preserve as much of the gray as possible.
Oral minoxidil. Safe, ancient blood pressure drug. Hair regrowth amount is literally called an "infant dose".
Ghoul
Well-known Member
Big Pharma should hire you for an ad lol.
Incredible work man, an amazing transformation!
OldGHGuy
Well-known Member
All this GLP-1 talk has me ready to try Tirz. Some questions @Ghoul :
1) Any important considerations on timing of the weekly dose - AM or PM, fasted, etc (besides avoiding the Metamucil)? I use GH 5/2 pinned before bed. Avoidance of TRT pins?
2) I've read about every 5th or 6th day pins due to half life. Thoughts?
3) Daily Metamucil timing. I would prefer evening/nightime to evoke emptying first thing in the morning but not sure if this will jive with evening GH pin. Bolus book from @Type-IIx on the way so this may change everything but...thoughts?
My plan is to use minimim dose to get other advantages besides appetite reduction (I'm already fairly disciplined on diet). Just looking to get rid of stubborn fat and retain muscle.
1) Any important considerations on timing of the weekly dose - AM or PM, fasted, etc (besides avoiding the Metamucil)? I use GH 5/2 pinned before bed. Avoidance of TRT pins?
2) I've read about every 5th or 6th day pins due to half life. Thoughts?
3) Daily Metamucil timing. I would prefer evening/nightime to evoke emptying first thing in the morning but not sure if this will jive with evening GH pin. Bolus book from @Type-IIx on the way so this may change everything but...thoughts?
My plan is to use minimim dose to get other advantages besides appetite reduction (I'm already fairly disciplined on diet). Just looking to get rid of stubborn fat and retain muscle.
Ghoul
Well-known Member
Is appetite suppression completely unnecessary, perhaps even a negative so should be minimized, or would some level be welcome despite being able to keep your diet on point? In other words, is there any "exertion" required to your diet efforts, giving room for some welcome relief, freeing up "willpower bandwidth" for other things, or would an impaired appetite to any degree be a problem, as it might be with someone who has to consciously eat a sufficient amount of calories or risk losing too much weight?
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