What's the future of PED development?

[Burntoutn3rd]

Do you think we'll ever see another era reminiscent of BALCO labs and Gaspari nutrition Designer Steroids? Obviously the pharma sector is moving towards legitimate selective androgens and such, but do you think we'll ever see a Renaissance of performance enhancing chemistry? The recreational chemical field certainly still sees plenty of novel development.

Crispr is an obvious next step as well, but seems much further off for the average bodybuilder to access for the foreseeable next few years.

I saw someone bring it up during Type-IIx's lecture Saturday, definitely got my brain turning. He seemed to think development is at a final stage, but honestly coming from inside the medical R&D sector in school, it seems like a field ripe for exploration to me. Yes, we have great options, but we can absolutely do more to reduce side effects and improve efficacy with these compounds.

 

[rokkrul3r]

gene editing, edit gene, progressively get bigger over next months without doing anything

when that happens bodybuilding will either die or become a platform rather than a sport

 

[heady muscle]

I would have liked to try Tetrahydrogestrinone, THG, or "The Clear" from when Patrick was brewing it.

 

[buzzingonaas]

gene editing, edit gene, progressively get bigger over next months without doing anything

when that happens bodybuilding will either die or become a platform rather than a sport

what a depressing possibility. All the reward with no work. I guess that leaves more time for career endeavors but the work aspect of physical fitness definitely improves quality of life from a. mental aspect. Something no cocktail of meds and gene expression can give us (at least for the foreseeable future )

 

[bighunanballs]

Dr Mike and Mike Israetel had a nice chat along these lines I just watched. Pretty good

 

[Greenbay68]

I would have liked to try Tetrahydrogestrinone, THG, or "The Clear" from when Patrick was brewing it.

Me too, but like turinabol, it was designed to evade detection, not exactly for its primary effect.

 

[ackmack78]

The clear was crap. It wasn't great at all compared to what was available it was just undetectable

 

[bighunanballs]

View: https://youtu.be/UrzF-rhJtOs?si=mWIbHM2R6eTEE4xM&t=120

 

[BigTomJ]

Do you think we'll ever see another era reminiscent of BALCO labs and Gaspari nutrition Designer Steroids?

Obviously the pharma sector is moving towards legitimate selective androgens and such, but do you think we'll ever see a Renaissance of performance enhancing chemistry? The recreational chemical field certainly still sees plenty of novel development.

no, there isnt any real market for it. What we have currently is going to be about as good as it gets imo.
We already see it for the current catalog of AAS, 90% of them are not FDA approved or have no approved uses, meaning pharma companies make zero dolars form them, and the few that do have FDA approval have extremely niche and limited approval meaning they arent making much money if any, especially with compounding pharmacies being a thing.

Same thing for sarms. They are basically a dead end because there isnt really any marketable medical use for them.

Most of the compounds we use today are 50-60 years old, with basically zero meaningful innovation. And the goal we bodybuilders use these compounds for has always been off label, further cementing our little niche as being basically an area of nonconsideration for pharma and pharma investors.

Crispr is an obvious next step as well, but seems much further off for the average bodybuilder to access for the foreseeable next few years.

Gene editing and crispr stuff is going to be the future, but i dont believe we will see anything publicly available or targeted to our goals anytime in my lifetime.

I saw someone bring it up during Type-IIx's lecture Saturday, definitely got my brain turning. He seemed to think development is at a final stage, but honestly coming from inside the medical R&D sector in school, it seems like a field ripe for exploration to me. Yes, we have great options, but we can absolutely do more to reduce side effects and improve efficacy with these compounds.

I wouldnt hold your breath for any meaningful research or development of performance enhancing drugs for the purpose of performance enhancement

 

[MinimumEffectiveDose]

The primary usage for anabolic steroids is activation of genes to increase desirable protein expression. There are obvious side effects that we want to mitigate. SARMs aim to do this but they are commonly just as non-selective at high doses. So what if instead of taking a drug to change gene expression we can just encode the gene expression, or activate a set of genes, in our chromosomes to selectively increase protein expression??

 

[ackmack78]

no, there isnt any real market for it. What we have currently is going to be about as good as it gets imo.
We already see it for the current catalog of AAS, 90% of them are not FDA approved or have no approved uses, meaning pharma companies make zero dolars form them, and the few that do have FDA approval have extremely niche and limited approval meaning they arent making much money if any, especially with compounding pharmacies being a thing.

Same thing for sarms. They are basically a dead end because there isnt really any marketable medical use for them.

Most of the compounds we use today are 50-60 years old, with basically zero meaningful innovation. And the goal we bodybuilders use these compounds for has always been off label, further cementing our little niche as being basically an area of nonconsideration for pharma and pharma investors.


Gene editing and crispr stuff is going to be the future, but i dont believe we will see anything publicly available or targeted to our goals anytime in my lifetime.


I wouldnt hold your breath for any meaningful research or development of performance enhancing drugs for the purpose of performance enhancement

Pretty much agree with everything you said but if they can make sarms that actually work I think those will take off for people with wasting diseases, cancer, hiv, etc. The problem is none of the sarms developed so far actually ended up being selective enough in efficacious doses for sick patients. And then when you take them at a bodybuilding dose they're not selective at all and flat out dont work to build muscle as well as traditional AAS.

 

[BigTomJ]

Pretty much agree with everything you said but if they can make sarms that actually work I think those will take off for people with wasting diseases, cancer, hiv, etc. The problem is none of the sarms developed so far actually ended up being selective enough in efficacious doses for sick patients. And then when you take them at a bodybuilding dose they're not selective at all and flat out dont work to build muscle as well as traditional AAS.

until they create a SARM that doesnt interfere with the HPGA feedback and cause suppression and doesnt negatively impact the livers or kidneys i dont think we will ever see one come anywhere close to a marketable FDA approval.

maybe someday, but i dont see that day being any time soon

 

[jJjburton]

View: https://youtu.be/1acWg-c5Buo?feature=shared

 

[BloatLord]

Patrick Arnold has a new product coming out that’s probably going to be a game-changer and the next big thing in GLP. It’s called "azelaprag," and it’s been shown to help you lose a lot of weight without losing much muscle. I think it’s going to be huge in the next few years.

Besides that, gene editing/therapy theres a technology i've been reading about called "CRISPR". Seems to enhance muscle growth and reduce recovery needed. Without steroids of course.

Also, I believe with every dad over 35+ getting on HRT/TRT there will be much safer options coming out.

New Trial Will Test Whether Weight Loss Drugs Can Work Without Shedding Muscle Mass

The diabetes drug Mounjaro—which is sometimes used to lose weight—will be tested alongside an experimental muscle loss treatment, a combination one executive said could “promote healthier weight loss.”

www.forbes.com

 

[heady muscle]

The clear was crap. It wasn't great at all compared to what was available it was just undetectable

And you know this how?

 

[AlexDavis43]

Gene editing and crispr stuff is going to be the future, but i dont believe we will see anything publicly available or targeted to our goals anytime in my lifetime.

I swear they're doing something like this at Oxygen Gym.

Guys are making more gains there in 5 years than anyone else is in 10 years. It can't be just more testosterone.

The speed of gainz without balding & skin disorders.

 

[BigTomJ]

I swear they're doing something like this at Oxygen Gym.

Guys are making more gains there in 5 years than anyone else is in 10 years. It can't be just more testosterone.

The speed of gainz without balding & skin disorders.

I don't think oxygen has any real secret sauce.
I think it's just they take away the athletes entire lives to make every single second 100% focused on bodybuilding while hammering the AAS, GH, slin, and probably silly doses of igf.

I think Regan had some comments about how militant and regimented oxygen ran their programs after he left.

 

[patriotmuscle1]

no, there isnt any real market for it. What we have currently is going to be about as good as it gets imo.
We already see it for the current catalog of AAS, 90% of them are not FDA approved or have no approved uses, meaning pharma companies make zero dolars form them, and the few that do have FDA approval have extremely niche and limited approval meaning they arent making much money if any, especially with compounding pharmacies being a thing.

Same thing for sarms. They are basically a dead end because there isnt really any marketable medical use for them.

Most of the compounds we use today are 50-60 years old, with basically zero meaningful innovation. And the goal we bodybuilders use these compounds for has always been off label, further cementing our little niche as being basically an area of nonconsideration for pharma and pharma investors.


Gene editing and crispr stuff is going to be the future, but i dont believe we will see anything publicly available or targeted to our goals anytime in my lifetime.


I wouldnt hold your breath for any meaningful research or development of performance enhancing drugs for the purpose of performance enhancement

I agree the market isn't strong enough. They really don't want us healthy and strong. We may revolt lol..
All seriousness the only application I can think would be for soldiers,defense industry. I'm sure there's soke stuff they do that we don't know about.

 

[ackmack78]

And you know this how?

Well the balco documentary discussed it. I don't have a supporting link to post but that's been the general consensus when it's discussed. I mean if it's so great I feel like current non drug tested athletes would be using it or talking about it I stead of still using all this stuff developed from the 30s to 70s

 

[explodingHeart]

I just want a drug that gives me the gains/benefits of training near/to failure while not having to do that.