Cowboy's Switch the Darkside

[Btcowboy]

I’ve done both and I believe they each have a place. Lower frequency higher intensity is great before a meet. Higher frequency lower intensity is great for technical improvement and more consistent approach. Alternating is not a bad approach

For what appears to be a simple style of lifting it really isnt... From afar its just 3 lifts how hard can it be... but it is. Setting up frequency, volume, intensity, different blocks, then add in accessories and hypertrophy and working on weaknesses it can get quite complex.

 

[Perrin Aybara]

I’ve done both and I believe they each have a place. Lower frequency higher intensity is great before a meet. Higher frequency lower intensity is great for technical improvement and more consistent approach. Alternating is not a bad approach

Yes, I agree before a meet. I can't handle higher intensity very long or I get injured or start regressing on strength. I use it sparingly most of the year.

 

[Btcowboy]

Yes, I agree before a meet. I can't handle higher intensity very long or I get injured or start regressing on strength. I use it sparingly most of the year.

So looking for your opinions... I am a newbie to PL so I can get away with more. Using a 531 approach inverted though to 3/5/531 at percentages of TM with TM being 90% of 1RM. On the single at the end if I am not feeling it stop there, however if it felt good and got more in me either keep going up for singles or pick say 105 or 110% of TM and look at a rep pr. Would you guys think a good approach to be able to keep adding weight to the bar and keep fairly safe from injury

 

[Perrin Aybara]

I'm advanced enough I believe I need a good amount of volume to progress and strong enough that my higher intensity sets are extremely taxing. So for me doing the higher intensity stuff both prevents me from getting enough volume and taxes my body and CNS too much to recover from.

Theory time: This is why I think just "going hard" isn't enough for most people to progress past a certain point with strength. You guys in the gym that go hard and work up to max effort sets and they never get past a certain point. It works at first because you're getting more volume just adding weight, so they keep doing it. But past a certain point it's not enough volume to keep progressing. This is counterintuitive to most people to do less weight for more volume. This was my experience at least. I believed the typical beliefs of going hard and it was hard to accept it wasn't working for me.

Of course there are some people with great genetics that can reach very high levels just going hard. It's because of their genetics they're basically still progressing like a beginner or maybe intermediate lifter even though they might be putting up elite numbers. They don't have a need for more complex programming.

 

[Perrin Aybara]

So looking for your opinions... I am a newbie to PL so I can get away with more. Using a 531 approach inverted though to 3/5/531 at percentages of TM with TM being 90% of 1RM. On the single at the end if I am not feeling it stop there, however if it felt good and got more in me either keep going up for singles or pick say 105 or 110% of TM and look at a rep pr. Would you guys think a good approach to be able to keep adding weight to the bar and keep fairly safe from injury

I really don't think max effort singles are a good idea in training. It's not adding much volume, which is what you need to progress, it's high injury risk, and generally not great form which reinforces bad movement patterns. Just my opinion. Multiple singles at 90-95% maybe, but even that I'm not a fan of. If you're set on singles that's how I would recommend it though.

I think if working up to max doubles or triples you could add more doubles or triples if you felt like you needed to do more weight or the same weight to get extra volume. Obviously you'd want to progress as long as possible on the least volume necessary.

 

[Btcowboy]

I really don't think max effort singles are a good idea in training. It's not adding much volume, which is what you need to progress, it's high injury risk, and generally not great form which reinforces bad movement patterns. Just my opinion. Multiple singles at 90-95% maybe, but even that I'm not a fan of. If you're set on singles that's how I would recommend it though.

I think if working up to max doubles or triples you could add more doubles or triples if you felt like you needed to do more weight or the same weight to get extra volume. Obviously you'd want to progress as long as possible on the least volume necessary.

I need to let that sink in lol..... I only have the singles there as its how the program is, and really doing single at 100% TM is pretty light for single based on my numbers. Taking my deadlift as an example my TM is 410 and we know I already pulled 455 easy. So I am thinking after reading your last post instead of a single at 410 pull triples and do a couple more sets? This is the part I mess up and maybe it's my 1rm is higher than I think....

 

[Perrin Aybara]

I need to let that sink in lol..... I only have the singles there as its how the program is, and really doing single at 100% TM is pretty light for single based on my numbers. Taking my deadlift as an example my TM is 410 and we know I already pulled 455 easy. So I am thinking after reading your last post instead of a single at 410 pull triples and do a couple more sets? This is the part I mess up and maybe it's my 1rm is higher than I think....

Shouldn't it be an AMRAP? It's been awhile since I did 5/3/1 and the one I did didn't have any singles programmed. It was 3+ sets the first week, 5 the next, and 1+ the last. Plus sets being AMRAPS.

 

[Btcowboy]

Shouldn't it be an AMRAP? It's been awhile since I did 5/3/1 and the one I did didn't have any singles programmed. It was 3+ sets the first week, 5 the next, and 1+ the last. Plus sets being AMRAPS.

There are so many versions out there it is mind boggling.

The PL version has it set like this 2 phases.
1st phase
3x3, 3x5, 531 each with a single after the 3 at TM
2nd phase
3x3, 3x5, 531 each with an amrap after the 3 at TM.

 

[Btcowboy]

I guess to mention the single is only once everyone 3 weeks but as I mentioned seems light so instead of a single on it could make it the amrap set. Of course the owner of gym spotted me on bench a week or so back and told him amrap set it was just over my TM. He asked what number I was shooting for told him more than 1. He said amraps are 8 or more.... so I managed 2 I think and then he had me drop 40lbs off it and do another amrap and got 12 of them... so either he didnt understand PL amraps or I am way off lol

 

[Worf]

So looking for your opinions... I am a newbie to PL so I can get away with more. Using a 531 approach inverted though to 3/5/531 at percentages of TM with TM being 90% of 1RM. On the single at the end if I am not feeling it stop there, however if it felt good and got more in me either keep going up for singles or pick say 105 or 110% of TM and look at a rep pr. Would you guys think a good approach to be able to keep adding weight to the bar and keep fairly safe from injury

I think that’s a decent approach for the time being. I wouldn’t think that you could continue with doing 105% of your max every 3-4 weeks indefinitely. After you numbers go up you’ll have to save that for every 8-12 weeks.

 

[Worf]

The training max thing throws me off, not really a fan of using that. It’s supposed to be what 90% of a true. I can hit that for a triple. Not sure about basing my training off a false number like that.

 

[Btcowboy]

The training max thing throws me off, not really a fan of using that. It’s supposed to be what 90% of a true. I can hit that for a triple. Not sure about basing my training off a false number like that.

Exactly adding to my confusion

 

[Perrin Aybara]

It's to keep you from missing reps in training. Even on your worst days you should be able to work with those percentages. A downfall of percentages is you're stuck using whatever the program calls for even on bad days, the training max is kind of protection against that.

 

[Btcowboy]

Following a program makes it easy to get started but when seeing more advanced peoples programs gets really confusing as far as how to set up theirs. I wanna do this right and not miss out on anything lol

 

[Perrin Aybara]

Different stages require different programming though.

Beginner in a nutshell means you progress workout to workout, so programming is simple and linear. A little volume and add weight each time. Basically your training cycles are day to day. There's no weak points yet, so just get stronger.

Intermediate in a nutshell means you progress on a weekly basis. So during the span of a week you get your necessary volume, recover, and then demonstrate what you've gained. Still nothing too complex yet.

Advanced in a nutshell means you take weeks to progress. You need to manipulate your volume, frequency, and intensity just right. Your training cycles take weeks to accumulate volume, recover from it, and demonstrate your progress. Training obviously gets more complex and progress takes longer over time.

 

[Btcowboy]

So if I am actually understanding this properly. This should work and allow me to firefighter train as well.

Percentages are of training max 90% of 1RM
Week 1 5x3, 70/75/80/85/90%'s
Week 2 5x5, 55/60/65/70/75%'s
Week 3 1x5 80%, 1x3 90%, 1xamrap 100%

No singles and only pushing for rep prs

 

[Worf]

You’ll have to test it out for yourself but I think you should be ok if you’re not over doing the accessories

 

[Btcowboy]

You’ll have to test it out for yourself but I think you should be ok if you’re not over doing the accessories

Thanks, I dont think I am overdoing accessories.
Monday DL and Bi/Tri
Wednesday Bench and Delts
Friday Squat and Hor pull, vert pull, traps
I am pretty good at making the decision to do or to skip accessories if I am wiped out or not.

EDIT all trial and error and see what works and what doesnt.

 

[Blange89]

Understood. I'm the same except I only like full body and don't like splitting even to upper and lower. Feels incomplete.

Same here

 

[NovaFlex]

It’s weird how different things work for different people. Or even just different lifts respond to different stimulus.. I tried Bro splits and PPL and they didn’t do much for me. Then when I started with more intense training, I saw big changes. Then switching to benching more frequently it got even better. Eventually doing upper / lower and more seeing massive results. BUT my Bench responds to more direct intensity / frequency, whereas I feel my DL has grown more by training my weak points, rather than the actual lift.

I've just tried a lot of things and it's what's worked best for me. From once every eight day splits, to PPL six days a week, to typical five day bro splits, to upper lower, to full body 3x and 4x. For me squatting frequency is best 2x, bench 3-4x, deadlift 2x, and muscle groups 2-4x a week works best. More volume and frequency works better for me than intensity. Of course everyone's results will be different and it's part of the journey figuring it out.

I've just tried a lot of things and it's what's worked best for me. From once every eight day splits, to PPL six days a week, to typical five day bro splits, to upper lower, to full body 3x and 4x. For me squatting frequency is best 2x, bench 3-4x, deadlift 2x, and muscle groups 2-4x a week works best. More volume and frequency works better for me than intensity. Of course everyone's results will be different and it's part of the journey figuring it out.