Another Androgel Application Question...

[srch4info]

First let me introduce myself as a new member of the forum and from what I have read so far I am lucky to have found this group of well informed members. OK here is my first post and thanks to everyone in advance for any guidance provided.

My Stats: 46 y/o, 58, 160, 21% BF

Yesterday was my first day on a doctor supervised TRT. I have started on 5G of Androgel once per day for the next 30 days and then more blood work to see where we are. My pre-TRT Quest Labs blood work results are:

Total T= 366 (241-827)
Bioavailable T = 200 (84-402)
Free T = 91 (34-194)
SHBG = 24 (7-50)
DHT = 21 (25-75)
Estradiol = 34 (13-54)
LH = 3.2 (1.5-9.3)
FSH = 1.1 (1.6-8)
Prolactin = 7.4 (2-18)
Cortisol = 21.2 (4-22)
TSH = 1.79 (.4-5.5)
FT3 = 300 (230-420)
FT4 = 2.5 (1.4-3.8)
T3 Uptake = 39 (22-35)
Homocysteine = 8.1 (<11.4)
PSA = .7
IGF-1 = 191 (60-304)
DHEA = 348 (180-1250)


I have many questions but my immediate question is this: I was trying to learn about the best location to apply the Androgel and I read the information about limiting the application area and thereby possibly reducing the DHT and E2 conversion. But when I tried the gel I found that it is actually quite a large amount so when I applied it to my left arm in an area about the size of a soda can, it became a pretty thick layer of gel that sat on top of the skin and dried to a chalky white thick paste on my arm. Did I waste the Androgel by not really rubbing it in well?

Today I didnt want to take any chances so I rubbed it in completely and it covered my total shoulder and arm but dried with no white cake residue at all. Any comments or suggestions for a newbie would be helpful.

 

[squareblockhead]

I've been rubbing half of it on my upper arms and shoulders. The other half I rub on the sides of my stomach or oblique area. Just be sure to spread it evenly. I was putting it on too thick at first and getting areas of white residue when dried. As long as I spread it evenly, there is no residue.

 

[srch4info]

Because I have been such a lazy bum and haven't worked out in way too long my obliques are, well lets just say a little too fat and from what I have read fat and Androgel equal conversion so I have intentionally avoided that location.

 

[pmgamer18]

Because I have been such a lazy bum and haven't worked out in way too long my obliques are, well lets just say a little too fat and from what I have read fat and Androgel equal conversion so I have intentionally avoided that location.

To get you started put one have the dose on your upper arms and shoulders spread it around but don't rub it in too well let it dry from wet but if it turns white you did not spread it out enough. Then do the other side you can spread it down to your collar bone and down the back of your shoulders as far as you can reach. Go right up to your neck. As for waiting 4 weeks to be retested no. Here is what happens your total T is 366 the andorgel will bring it up a good 300 to 350 points higher. In the first week then your brain will see this and stop sending the messages to your testis to make more T your LH and FSH will not be sent because your brain sees the T from the gel. Now you can fall back down below you 366 levels and feel like shit. So if you read the insert that comes with the gel it says to be tested after the first 2 weeks to see if this happens and if you need to do more. Also some men don't do well on gels it does not get though the skin into the blood.

 

[srch4info]

Excellent response and very logical... I even just read the insert and your 100% correct about the 14 day retest. I do have a question though... if you do both left and right arms and shoulders isn't that the opposite of what some of the postings here stated regarding limiting the surface area and receptors? I guess to some extent I am not too concerned because my DHT level is actually very low which is probably one of the reasons I feel so damn lousy now!

 

[pmgamer18]

Excellent response and very logical... I even just read the insert and your 100% correct about the 14 day retest. I do have a question though... if you do both left and right arms and shoulders isn't that the opposite of what some of the postings here stated regarding limiting the surface area and receptors? I guess to some extent I am not too concerned because my DHT level is actually very low which is probably one of the reasons I feel so damn lousy now!

Some men's DHT goes way up on gels and if they are older it can upset there prostate gland and slow down voiding. As for Estradiol gels do convert more of the t going though the skin into Estradiol but most of us men on TRT need to take some thing to keep it down no matter what kind of TRT we do so have this checked.

 

[srch4info]

I will make sure to keep monitoring both and I will now start reading about keeping E2 down since I already have a pretty high E2 level.

Thanks

 

[srch4info]

Phil,

I did today's Androgel application and followed your directions... the gel spread well and was left "wet" to dry instead of rubbing it in like I did yesterday. It dried with no residue at all. Thanks

 

[pmgamer18]

Phil,

I did today's Androgel application and followed your directions... the gel spread well and was left "wet" to dry instead of rubbing it in like I did yesterday. It dried with no residue at all. Thanks

Great keep us posted on how your doing.

 

[srch4info]

Phil,

I thought I would take a moment to provide an update to you and also ask a few further questions.

I am now on day 27 of the Androgel TRT. Unfortunately due to vacation and travel conflcits between my Dr and myself we could not get the blood work done in the two week period as you suggested but I am getting the tests this week.

I am DEFINITELY feeling much better. My focus and ability to work through issues has been noticibly improved and my emotional roller coaster is slowing down These were major issues for me since I have some intense personal and business issues going on in my life now and as we all know the hormone imbalance has been wreaking havoc on my ability to deal and cope.

I am not feeling like Superman nor am I waking up with pile driving erections and I am sure I can feel better in both departments so I am looking forward to my next bloodwork to see what is going on in my body and further tweak my TRT.

I am genetically lucky as I still have a rather full head of thick hair and to date I see only a few more hairs than usual in the shower but I will add some Nizoral and Spironolactone to my routine and maybe some Azelaic Acid and then see what happens.

I now have my application down to a science: I wake up, take a shower and I use a body scrub similar to a luffa sponge to clean my application sites: shoulders neck and back. Not sure if this actually makes any difference but it just makes sense to me to keep the dead skin off those locations.

I apply the entire foil packet to my left shoulder, bicept and back spreading it to a thin wet coating over the entire area right up to my neck line. The packet actually covers the area with no need for me to use my other arm. Being extremely anal I also cut the foil pack open and then rub it on my other shoulder so I have used the entire contents of the packet.

Questions:

My gel is a script that I had from last year and I just noticed that the packets are dated with an expiration of 7/05... is this still good? Is the product bad in anyway? Potency, etc?

This may sound like a stupid question but here goes anyway... I read that the alcohol in the gel is the carier that transfers the T to your body, yet 90% of the T stays on your skin. So I was wondering what would happen if you rubbed alcohol on the location say 12 hours later after it had dried... would you absorb any more?

I was just at the pool and had to put some suntan lotion on and was wondering if rubbing the application site with lotion would have any negative effect on the absortion etc? I was so concerned and usnsure that I actually didn't put any lotion on my damn arm

 

[pmgamer18]

I would say it is still good.
No don't mess with the Androgel to try to get more.
You can get wet or go swimming 4 hrs after putting on the gel and it will still work. It is not some thing I would do everyday for life. You can put on suntan lotion 4 hrs after and not have a problem just be sure you wash it off before you next application. I have in the winter only showered every other day and put the gel on over the last days gels my levels stayed good.

 

[srch4info]

GymJim,

I am sure I used to be able to do that but for some reason I have no edit button or function at all so I can't seem to figure out how to delete them.

Here's an EDIT Ironically right after I wrote this response their was an edit button for this particular post only... so hence this edit

 

[srch4info]

Thanks Phil,

I was getting nervous and it's good to know the potency is still OK because I have another full month of the expired packets and it would be a waste to discard them.

 

[srch4info]

Phil,

I thought you may find it interesting to note that just as you stated in the early days of this thread... I am definitely noticing a decline in the good feelings I was having and I am really feeling pretty crappy again.

It's easy for me to recognize certain changes due to my work and personal issues... in particular focus, mental clarity, ability to cope and the feeling of being overwhelmed. Just as you noted, early into the TRT all of these had improved but right now I am struggling to deal with my issues and get ahead. I also noticed over the last few days that I am once again much more emotional than I have been and I seem to be tired.

I am having some timing issues getting my blood work done and that is making me anxious because I really want to get on track again. I will keep you informed.

 

[pmgamer18]

Phil,

I thought you may find it interesting to note that just as you stated in the early days of this thread... I am definitely noticing a decline in the good feelings I was having and I am really feeling pretty crappy again.

It's easy for me to recognize certain changes due to my work and personal issues... in particular focus, mental clarity, ability to cope and the feeling of being overwhelmed. Just as you noted, early into the TRT all of these had improved but right now I am struggling to deal with my issues and get ahead. I also noticed over the last few days that I am once again much more emotional than I have been and I seem to be tired.

I am having some timing issues getting my blood work done and that is making me anxious because I really want to get on track again. I will keep you informed.

At leased you know what is happening so you konw why and you know it is not dangerous but distressing. Tell your Dr. what we know and up the dose to hell with the test seen this happen to many times.

 

[srch4info]

Phil,

I just made a new thread with my lab results because I have some really major concerns:
https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/134241442
I am hoping that you, Headdoc, Marianco, Larry and Dr Scally could all assist with some comments...thanks