deca versus equipoise

[CooSee]

Hey folks,

does anyone have some educated thoughts on Deca vs. Equipoise as a substance to compliment testosterone during a cycle? Goal is to build mass.
I'd like to keep T no higher than around 600mg/week (where I have it now). I've added 200mg per week of Deca because I'd like to get to about 800-1000mg per week cycle. Also thinking of adding Masteron at 200-300mg per week for weeks 8-16.
Although Deca (not NPP) nice on the joints and gives me an immediate strength increase and fullness, it always seems to decrease my mood, energy, and makes sex drive way worse. That's even taking about 1.5mg of caber per week.
I've never run Equipoise before.
So, who's run both along with Test and has opinions? Anyone like the idea of a 600mg test, + 300mg equipoise, + 300mg masteron cycle? Other opinions on a better mass-building cycle?
I'm 5'10" 195 and about 10-12% BF, been lifting for 17 years and have done many test, primo, and deca cycles. But never tried equipoise or masteron.

 

[Mac11wildcat]

Deca v EQ seems to be a one or the other argument for folks.

first things first; did you throw caber at the deca cycle without doing bloodwork? Probably not the best idea.

mg/mg deca will probably do more, but eq mg/mg is probably less side effects inducing. If you think deca fucked with you, try EQ. If you haven’t found a two compound cycle that you liked why add another? Find the two compound cycle that agrees with you, train hard and eat for your goal, and step to a 3rd compound when that’s run it’s course.

 

[Eman]

EQ isn't a potent muscle builder, even at very high doses. Compared to deca, it's apples to oranges. It'll help you train harder and give you a little extra anabolic response but nothing compared to deca.

Not sure how to help you on the bad deca sides. I feel fantastic on it. Crashed my estrogen on my first cycle of it and I assume prolactin levels became non existent because it eliminated my refractory period. I could orgasm multiple times. I felt terrible aside from that, but still.. Wish I could do that on the daily.

 

[WriteWinger]

I’ve run that cycle a few times. Me personally I keep Test e/c at a 1:1 ratio with EQ and have run it up to 750mg per week. I keep Deca (or NPP) 20% lower 600mg per week...just my jam, your mileage may vary. I have very little sides with this cycle and can put on size if I don’t stray from my diet; typical cycle is 16 weeks, with an oral thrown in somewhere along the way.

Can I ask why the Mast on a bulk? Suppression of estrogen perhaps?

 

[CooSee]

Deca v EQ seems to be a one or the other argument for folks.

first things first; did you throw caber at the deca cycle without doing bloodwork? Probably not the best idea.

mg/mg deca will probably do more, but eq mg/mg is probably less side effects inducing. If you think deca fucked with you, try EQ. If you haven’t found a two compound cycle that you liked why add another? Find the two compound cycle that agrees with you, train hard and eat for your goal, and step to a 3rd compound when that’s run it’s course.

I like these thoughts. That's correct, I didn't check for prolactin before adding the caber. I've just used Deca enough over the years to know that as soon as it hits about 1 week after the first shot, it really impacts libido, and makes it far more difficult to climax than normal (I'm married, so it's all relative, but still). I do check bloods on a lot of areas, but just haven't pulled that one. I actually haven't been able to find out if EQ will increase prolactin (isn't that the most common thing that Deca does that impacts libido and energy?), do you know if EQ impacts Prolactin ?
If not, maybe I'll try it along with the T and like you said, see if I can find a two compound cycle that I like, before adding masteron. I also need to get better on tracking estradiol levels - I know mine goes high (e.g. was 117 pg/ml the day after a 400mg injection of T in April) - but I've never been able to figure out if it's okay for it to go that high since it's just going high in proportion to the T also being more than 2x the ref. range max. Like, is it a ratio, or is there an absolute figure one should try to achieve for Estradiol and if so, what is it? I am aware that if that's "out of whack", it could impact libido. But I have definitely done a good amount of T 400-600mg with no major impacts to sex drive, only taking about .5mg of arimidex every time I feel any sensitivity in the right breast

 

[CooSee]

EQ isn't a potent muscle builder, even at very high doses. Compared to deca, it's apples to oranges. It'll help you train harder and give you a little extra anabolic response but nothing compared to deca.

Not sure how to help you on the bad deca sides. I feel fantastic on it. Crashed my estrogen on my first cycle of it and I assume prolactin levels became non existent because it eliminated my refractory period. I could orgasm multiple times. I felt terrible aside from that, but still.. Wish I could do that on the daily.

That's insane! Jealous. That's the exact opposite effect that Deca has on me. Maybe I just need to do bloods and throw more caber at it. So would you say deca is the main complimentary to Test, and there isn't a better alt. for bulking? I've always been lean (5'10" 140lbs when I started lifting), so I'm just looking to get to the 200+ range for once

 

[CooSee]

I’ve run that cycle a few times. Me personally I keep Test e/c at a 1:1 ratio with EQ and have run it up to 750mg per week. I keep Deca (or NPP) 20% lower 600mg per week...just my jam, your mileage may vary. I have very little sides with this cycle and can put on size if I don’t stray from my diet; typical cycle is 16 weeks, with an oral thrown in somewhere along the way.

Can I ask why the Mast on a bulk? Suppression of estrogen perhaps?

That's good to hear. 700+700 must feel amazing. Right now I'm 650T with 200mg deca (added the deca after 3 weeks on just the T). The Deca immediately makes me more tired, and makes it way more difficult to climax. Do you take caber or arimdex as a rule on that dosage, or just as-needed, or not at all?
And yes, the Mast I was thinking would be great as estrogen reducing - since on my 650T right now I'm having to take a mg of arimidex here and there every time I feel my right breast get sensitive

 

[Test_Subject]

Can I ask why the Mast on a bulk? Suppression of estrogen perhaps?

Mast is life.

There isn’t a cycle out there that can’t be made better by adding a bit of masteron, IMO.

To answer your question, OP, deca is the superior mass builder, but EQ isn’t as bad for side effects. If you tolerate nandrolone well, deca is the clear winner. If not, EQ is a decently close approximation.

 

[Eman]

That's insane! Jealous. That's the exact opposite effect that Deca has on me. Maybe I just need to do bloods and throw more caber at it. So would you say deca is the main complimentary to Test, and there isn't a better alt. for bulking? I've always been lean (5'10" 140lbs when I started lifting), so I'm just looking to get to the 200+ range for once

Definitely don't take anymore caber. Drop it entirely, use a moderate AI and get bloods. Using caber without bloods is not the way to go... It's tremendously rare to need caber at all.

And yes, I personally don't think there's a much better compound to go with test than nandrolone. Even tren, I don't consider a great compound for bulking. EQ isn't a bad choice at all though, I like it... It's just not going to build tissue the way deca will.

 

[CooSee]

That's good to hear. 700+700 must feel amazing. Right now I'm 650T with 200mg deca (added the deca after 3 weeks on just the T). The Deca immediately makes me more tired, and makes it way more difficult to climax. Do you take caber or arimdex as a rule on that dosage, or just as-needed, or not at al

Mast is life.

There isn’t a cycle out there that can’t be made better by adding a bit of masteron, IMO.

To answer your question, OP, deca is the superior mass builder, but EQ isn’t as bad for side effects. If you tolerate nandrolone well, deca is the clear winner. If not, EQ is a decently close approximation.

That's good to hear. I do have mast and eq on order, so will just have to try them separately. For EQ, do you know if it's likely to impact prolactin at all? I believe that is the main culprit for Deca for me/anyone who feels the sides, since it's tiredness and difficulty climaxing that gets me immediately. Or maybe I'm better off actually doing blood work to check prolactin, and if it's high, taking enough caber to keep it in range, as the better solution before downgrading to EQ for my mass goals.

 

[Test_Subject]

That's good to hear. I do have mast and eq on order, so will just have to try them separately. For EQ, do you know if it's likely to impact prolactin at all? I believe that is the main culprit for Deca for me/anyone who feels the sides, since it's tiredness and difficulty climaxing that gets me immediately. Or maybe I'm better off actually doing blood work to check prolactin, and if it's high, taking enough caber to keep it in range, as the better solution before downgrading to EQ for my mass goals.

I’ve ran EQ up to 800 and never noticed any prolactin related problems.

Just watch your hematocrit on EQ. It promotes red blood cell production pretty strongly. That’s a wonderful thing performance-wise, but it can be dangerous if you let it get way out of range. Strokes are no fun, so keep that in mind.

 

[CooSee]

Definitely don't take anymore caber. Drop it entirely, use a moderate AI and get bloods. Using caber without bloods is not the way to go... It's tremendously rare to need caber at all.

And yes, I personally don't think there's a much better compound to go with test than nandrolone. Even tren, I don't consider a great compound for bulking. EQ isn't a bad choice at all though, I like it... It's just not going to build tissue the way deca will

Good to know on Deca with Test. If I can get to be able to manage the Deca sides, would love to be able to run it more than 200mg/week. Regarding dropping the caber: do you think I should get prolactin bloods or just E? And, any particular reason why you say drop the caber, or just because I don't know for sure that I need it (aside from my sides)?

 

[Demondosage]

Used equipoise more than any other steroid myself. I always like banging 800 mg per week for the first 2 wks and then 400-600/wk throughout the remainder of the cycle. I've gone over a gram with it and honestly didn't get anything more that 600/wk provided. Just my experience. Mg for mg deca is the superior mass builder, hell even at 1/2 mg for mg. But the lack of fluid retention and vascularity from equipoise always provided a sharper look for me

 

[EazyE]

Deca hands down for mass. EQ gives more of a quality look overall. Both compounds seem to have a lot of similar traits yet also act very different. I always found EQ to be a very slow acting compound but yet it does what it’s intended to. With the required long duration of EQ cycles I always seemed to feel weird when into it for multiple weeks at say 800mg. Noticed this more so than other compounds. Somewhat of a depression state, if that makes sense. Deca on the other hand is a real nice feel good compound for me that also dramatically increases my sex drive and response. I like to add masteron in with nandrolone on cycle. Masteron is such a great compound. Not the main driver of a cycle but definitely a big catalyst/support product.

 

[AlwaysHungry]

I wish i was responding to boldenone the same way i respond on nandrolone.
Deca for me personally is all benefits and gains happy horny big I can't even tell I'm using something. But in the gym, I explode in size.

Now boldenone of course less mass than deca. But that's not a problem it makes you look very good nice skin rounder vascular nice delts tight midsection along with testosterone and GH you will grow very lean on it.
Wish I could use it more it gives me a wonderful look that I can't replicate (I like more the look of boldenone than primobolan)

Eq for me bring all kind of side effects. No interest in sex , high bp , anxiety ,insomnia, a cloud in my head , like a depressed state of mind. I can blast tren and deca sky high, but boldenone fucks me up big time.

Ive also noticed that in my country now boldenone had replaced nandrolone among most gym rats.
Believe me I have seen all kinds of side effects on gym rats using boldenone.
It makes the blood into syrup in a lot of people.
it also gives limp cock
high bp , high hematocrit ,clots.
gyno

In past years they used nandrolone I haven't heard any side effects maybe 1 or 2 people got limp cock but that's it.
Nandrolone is much safer imo
But boldenone is so much better.

 

[TrEnsgender]

The combination of all three compounds are a superior combination.

Boldenon is in my opinion not a good steroid on its own, because to get atleast a pleasant effect (compared to other anabolics) you have to dose it very high, but boldenon is can be very harsh in his side effects at this dose, the endurance, vascularity etc top notch but the rising hematocrit is pretty dangerous in the long run for the cardiovascular health aspect and in relation to his very mild anabolic proptierties a poor choice on its own.

This changes, if you add boldenon to a stack.
Testosteron with Nandrolone and Boldenon is my absolute favorite stack, because it has probably the best synergistic effects you can get from any stack.

Testosteron as a minimum base of 250mg with around 500mg Nandrolone and 500mg Boldenone Cypionat or around 750mg of Boldenon U (because of the heavier weight of the Ester upping the dose makes more sense)

In my case, i have way less bloat, estrogenic or proalctin related side effects, with controlled estrogen (in my case no AI at 250mg), these makes Nandrolone easy to manage, the more estrogen you have the more likely is that Nandrolone will fuck you up because it toys with your Prolactin, if your estrogen is under control chances are good that you will have nearly no sides from that.

You can get like all the wanted benefits with lesser sides, the Boldenon will boost your endurance / red bloodcell count a lot, you will retain less water and you can get a strong synergistic effect with Nandrolone to use the androgena to fullest extent, higher endurance can lead to a better workout, you could actually improve it with an good insulin regime to increase recovery and performance, Nandrolone goes well along insulin if you can manage the bloat.


But if you have one to choose, take Nandrolone.

These informations are about my personal experience and preferences it may differ from individual to individual.

 

[Ridethelightningbarefoot]

Depends on your goals they are very different compounds. Deca put mass on me like ive never had, biggest push in weight. Boldenone is good for strength and mild tissue gains, at least i got some good strength gains. Boldenone is better for joints imo, thats really the only way they are comparable.

 

[Eman]

Good to know on Deca with Test. If I can get to be able to manage the Deca sides, would love to be able to run it more than 200mg/week. Regarding dropping the caber: do you think I should get prolactin bloods or just E? And, any particular reason why you say drop the caber, or just because I don't know for sure that I need it (aside from my sides)?

Get both prolactin and E. I say drop the caber because you can almost always control prolactin by controlling estrogen. So, you should be more focused on getting estrogen under control rather than prolactin. If you get the former under control, you'll get the latter under control by default.

 

[Demondosage]

Get both prolactin and E. I say drop the caber because you can almost always control prolactin by controlling estrogen. So, you should be more focused on getting estrogen under control rather than prolactin. If you get the former under control, you'll get the latter under control by default.

Agreed, too many ppl jump the gun on caber and in reality it can cause more problems than not using it at all

 

[Ridethelightningbarefoot]

Get both prolactin and E. I say drop the caber because you can almost always control prolactin by controlling estrogen. So, you should be more focused on getting estrogen under control rather than prolactin. If you get the former under control, you'll get the latter under control by default.

Thats some good info. Do you have any more details on how that works?