Endocrine Disrupting Chemicals (EDCs), Pollution, Testosterone Levels, Fertility, and the Size of yo' DICK....

We finally have had the alarmist headline: "PENISES ARE SHRINKING BECAUSE OF POLLUTION"


Honestly, it is about fucking time! I have been bitching about Endocrine Disrupting Chemicals (EDCs) since I learned about them way back when I was a teenager. Several years later, I remember back when America was going psycho over bisphenol A (BPA) causing endocrine disruption. I also specifically recall the massive movement to ban BPA entirely. Unfortunately, even I as a young adult at the time, knew that they were DOING IT WRONG, because nobody seemed to ask the question "what will we replace BPA with once it is banned?"

Thus, BPA was banned...and mostly just replaced with other bisphenol (BPx) chemicals, many of which are unresearched, or have very little research about them, and even are indicated to be MORE HARMFUL than BPA. Way to go people, mission failed. I don't know how nobody saw it coming: you make companies ban one thing and they will jus replace it with whatever is cheapest, even if it's probably worse for human health--they simply don't care about anything except their profits.

But that is only one miniscule little piece to the whole story. To provide some background, EDCs include a wide range of substances that are used across nearly every industry that have activity related to sex hormone receptors and pathways. The most well-studied and best known are the ones that agonize Estrogen. There are also antiandrogens

Unfortunately, and I mean seriously, really, tragically unfortunately, BPx's are not the only chemical at play here. Some of the most common EDCs, organized by type, are listed below:
- Pesticides: DDT; Chlorpyrifos; Atrazine; Glyphosate; vinclozolin (anti-androgen)
- Heavy metals: Lead; Cadmium; Arsenic
- Industrial chemicals and their byproducts: PCBs; Dioxins
- Plastics and food storage materials: Polychlorinated biphenyls (PCBs); bisphenols (BPx's); Phthalates; Phenol
- Electronics and building materials: Brominated fire retardants (PBDEs); PCBs again
- Personal care products: phthalates; parabens; UV filter chemicals in chemical sunscreens
- Soaps: triclosan (also found in colgate total toothpaste)
- Tons of things from textiles, clothing, food wrappers, teflon cookware, popcorn bags: Perfluorochemicals (PFCs)
- AND MORE!!! Let us not forget the random chemicals, drugs, and drug metabolites, found in our water: the birth control and other hormones; the anti-depressants; anti-anxiety; birth control; beta-blockers, etc. (1) (2)

In males, these chemicals cause all kinds of issues: decreased fertility; suppressed endocrine system (low testosterone); increased prostate size; delayed puberty; decreased penis size (even the medical condition "micropenis"); genital deformations; and of course cancer. A growing number of researchers are saying that most men will be infertile between 2045 and 2065 because of EDCs.

In females, these chemicals cause all kinds of issues too! Breast abnormalities/cancer; general endocrine disruption (low estrogen, issues with estrogen/progesterone balance); premature breast enlargement; early puberty; endometriosis; reproductive tract abnormalities/malignancies; disturbed lactation; polycystic ovarian syndrome; and of course other cancers too.

(source)

In amphibians, these chemicals actually cause them to change genders and even change their sexual preferences. (1, 2) This study made waves in the headlines and both liberal and conservative media ran with it. Look, just to be clear, I am NOT one of the psychotic idiots (cough Alex Jones) saying that "the government is purposefully putting drugs in the water to make people gay." That is fucking stupid on so many levels that I won't even go into it. However, it is a fact that this is happening as a side effect of our widespread use of pesticides. Now, taking the leap from amphibians to humans is a big one, but given the laundry list of issues above that EDCs cause, some people may be comfortable making that leap. Personally, I think it makes sense, when you look at the drug therapy that trans females go through: they are given antiandrogens and estrogens. Well, the same thing is happening, albeit at much lower levels to nearly every modern human living in a developed country (and sometimes underdeveloped countries are even worse, due to less government regulations to prevent pollution).


The only additional thing I will say about this is that I have had the privilege to speak with university professors involved in these studies or follow up research who firmly believe that these EDCs are having an impact on the percentage of LGBTQ people in the overall population. These are some of the leading ecology and wildlife researchers in the world. In their mind there is no doubt about it, but unfortunately, they aren’t able to be vocal about that opinion because the liberal media will label them as anti-LGBTQ and the LGBTQ community will explode with backlash on social media about the professor’s comments, etc. It is really a shame. The far left’s desire to hamper free speech really fucking irks me—it is not healthy, but I digress. This is not about politics. It’s about the science of EDCs.


So anyway: this is obviously a really big fucking deal! But for some reason, the vast majority of the population has been happy to just ignore it. It doesn't have immediate effects on people, the effects are long term--sometimes VERY long term--and also due to the many many variables in this thing we call life, it is nearly impossible to truly pinpoint these chemicals as the cause of the issues people are having. As such, sufficient momentum to create a sustained movement around reducing EDCs in the environment has never been attained--save for the BPA scare because that was having a relatively immediate impact on people's precious little babies, so of course everyone freaked out, but again nobody thought it all the way through.

There are even more issues and chemicals that could be added to this list, but that gives you the idea of just how damaging these chemicals are. And the worst part is that we are ALL exposed to them, unwillingly, from the time we are born on a daily basis. There is nothing we can do to avoid all of them--however we can avoid SOME of them by making healthier choices in the products we buy, the places we go, and are privileged enough to be able to purchase things like fancy water filters and organic foods.

<Warning, personal anecdote>

Unfortunately, our modern American medicine system doesn't think it is important to monitor hormones AT ALL. Even females on exogenous hormones in the form of birth control don't get hormone panels. The doctor asks "how do you feel" and adjusts the dose accordingly. Young men with pubertal gyno and no motivation and emotional issues are given anti-depressants and benzos--and this strike particularly close to home for me. I had pubertal gyno (as you can read about in a recent page in the gyno megathread), I also had depression and anxiety and serious confidence issues despite being an intelligent and attractive young man.

I suspect the main factor in my issues was all due to endocrine disruption (too much E2 agonism and not enough T), but obviously can't prove it because I never had a hormone panel. Now, at the ripe young age of 31 I am on TRT (blast and cruise). It is the best thing I have ever done. My depression is gone, my anxiety is drastically reduced. Of course, body comp has gotten way better. I did have my gyno removed (again, see the gyno megathread). I really, really struggled as a teen; it was fucking awful. I came extremely close to killing myself several times. When I see other young kids struggle with similar issues and when I hear teens say they think they are a woman and all that, I just shake my head. Let me be perfectly clear: I do NOT think that gay and trans people wouldn’t exist if it weren’t for EDCs, they obviously have been around for much longer than EDCs have. However, I think the issue would be much, much smaller.

<End personal anecdote>

I feel like I am starting to go in circles here, so let me sum up my post thus far:

- EDCs are everywhere: in our water; our clothes; the air we breathe; the food we eat; the devices we touch; the upholstery we lounge or sit on; the personal care products we use; the artificial fragrances we smell; the sex products we use (yeah, check your lube for phthalates!!); they’re fucking everywhere!!!

- they have POWERFUL effects in the human body and mind. For example, "Sperm counts among men in North America, Europe, Australia and New Zealand declined more than 59% from 1973 to 2011, according to a meta-analysis Swan co-wrote in 2017. At the current rate, half of men in those countries would have no sperm by 2045, while many others would have very low counts" (source)

I hope that with more alarmist headlines about penises shrinking and the population becoming infertile, maybe the general population will start to pay more attention to this problem. Then maybe we can gain some momentum to make a change, regardless of the cost to big agriculture/pharma/manufacturing/chemical companies.

So, what can we do about this?

For starters, if you have kids:

- Get your kids a hormone panel when they hit puberty. Just monitor that shit yourself. Pay out of pocket if you have to, just monitor it to know. If something is off, then talk to your doctor about it. If your doctor is an idiot and doesn’t know anything about the endocrine system (like most doctors) then find a different doctor or take matters into your own hand (no, don’t start injecting your kid with TRT LOL :D).

For everyone, with or without kids:

- Make positive changes in your home to ensure that you are minimizing your and your family’s exposure to EDCs. Some of these things are easy, some are hard/expensive. This includes things like:
- opting for natural personal care products (in general avoid gels, get bar soaps and get natural organic products that either use essential oils for scents or have no scent)
- get natural toothpaste
- stop using plastic water bottles and food storage containers, glass is the only safe option (often times metal containers are coated with a BPx or similar chemical to prevent the metal from absorbing into the food/water)
- DEFINITELY NEVER heat up food in plastic - weight watchers and TV dinners = VERY BAD!!
- don’t buy fast food or junk food (including breakfast cereals and pop-tarts and toaster pancakes, etc.)
- buy organic foods to minimize your exposure to pesticides
- wear an N95 or KN95 mask if you go into the city where air pollution is always terrible
- get a high-quality under sink water filter
- don’t buy bottled water
- don’t get artificial fragrance things like those glade sprayers, candles, etc.
- don’t go swimming in nasty city lakes
- don’t use pesticides in your yard and don’t pay someone to spray your lawn!! Weeds are natural and honestly turf grass is pretty ecologically useless, let the weeds grow, it’s gonna be fine. For sidewalk cracks, etc., get a propane torch to burn that shit away!
- when painting or using volatile chemicals for home or construction or car projects, wear a high-quality respirator. I even wear an N95 mask when I go to the shooting range as the lead in the primers is not something I want to inhale while shooting (I put a little scotch tape at the top so it doesn’t fog up my glasses).
- there’s more but that’s about all I can think of right now!
- oh! And also, get enough sleep! Sleep is HUGE and even a single bad night of sleep and disrupt the hormonal balance. De-stress! Practice mindfullness meditation, go out into nature, take epsom salt baths to de-stress and lower cortisol. Avoid drugs: particularly opiates and alcohol (especially beer, the hops in beer is one of the strongest phytoesteogens on the planet), and also marijuana. Eat enough fats, studies show eating a diet with ~40% fat can increaze natty T levels, idk if it would mTter for enhanced guys though; lastly, make sure you aren't lacking in any nutrients like magnesium, boron, selenium, etc., but also don't supplement them "just because"

These are all things you can do to minimize your and your family’s exposure to EDCs. In doing so, you are drastically increasing the likelihood of being healthier into old age and raising healthy, stable kids. Hopefully you’ve found this interesting and helpful. Feel free to comment with any non-political comments you may have!

Just bouncing a couple of things back you may not have picked up on.

1. Be sure you are aware that PESITCIDES and HERBICIDES (2-4d) are two different animals. Herbicides are going to be your pancreatic and liver cancer. Longer & slower acting and more insidiously hidden in action. Pesticides can be less noxious to humans up front, yet kill your cats dead if they walk thru the lawn just once within a couple of days of a Terminix bug treatment. Dummbshit folks saying "yea the cat just came in and laid down and never got up"/ Not even realizing they killed his ass with their need to poison all the bugs in the lawn for whatever stupid reason. Certain pesticides like COPPER for example will kill yer ass quick if you get too much on your skill even.

As far as POLITICAL SAFETY - none - DDT is a great example of a pesticide what was banned but guess what we sold it all to Mexico so they can grow the fruit with it and sell it back to us with even higher concentrations :oops: .

-Pesticides kill the bee's and work the AIR & DRY LIFE CHAINs destroying ON-LAND life via insect death.
-Herbicides kill the aquatic life more directly working on all the critters that maintain those environments ultimately trickling down to the poisoned plankton beds that produce much of the O2 we breathe..
- DISTURBING.... As they synergize for a double whammy.

2. Be aware that the only security when handling these chems is an outside air source pumped into a mask or suit via POS pressure.

- N95 respirators are mostly PARICULATE CAPTURING in action and DO NOT work all that well in preventing exposure to "ORGANICS". No mask-type air filtration system that you can use is going to capture FUMES and GASSES unless they are organic. Hexavalent Chromium offput when welding stainless is a good example of a long chain carbon NASTY which requires outside air source to be protected....

For many PAINT applications for example, you will need an organic respirator. They dont look like much but that N95 does not work well for that application. And dont get me started on paint chems and I have never seen a primer stick like KILZ-2 and its water based for freaks sake... Serious toxins bleeding out of these paints FOR EVER...

- Many noxious chemicals will go right thru NITRYL, LATEX, "Rubber gloves" within a certain amount of time used. Sometimes minutes depending on the glove.

3. If you use an axe body wash product, or any for that matter YOU ARE CRAZY. They are basically treating your skin like a lawn and PRE-EMERGING chems in there so they stick around longer and kill your healthy bacteria off. You will wind up with a staph infection within 90 days of starting regular use of these every time guaranteed.
- And yes its sad that shit is in every skin product on the market. And then my wife would buy my daughters all these fucking Amazon make up kits with all the colors & stuff under the rainbow I would call them POISON STATIONS...

4. Don't think that ceramic cookware is safe/ there is an issue I don't recall off hand. And folks don't even realize that "New car smell is PFOAs" I wonder do they bottle it and put in in Xmas tree air fresheners. LOL
- New car smell
- New carpet off-gassing
- They put it in couch cushions and for a brief period CHILDRENS PAJAMAS as a "Flame retardant". :oops::mad: Fukkin REALLY???!?!
- Speaking of household poisons tangenting what about the recent onslaught of all this shitty formaldehyde off gassing Chinese cheapass laminate flooring around the country.?!? Lets not forget US Corporations DESIGNED AND SPEC'd it out...
- Did you know there is enough formaldehyde off-gassing from the glue in a classic luan hollow core door to poison a damn house.
- All you have to do is break one of those squiggly mercury gas filled light bulbs and the EPA says you must evacuate the room and air it our for 4-6 hours due to mercury content.
THE LIST GOES ON AND ON AND ONE AND ON.....

*** Its "innocence or lack of malfeasance - by compartmentalization and physical disconnection". In short, we design it and then assign a foreign country to do the dirty work and therefore we don't have to feel bad about ourselves and our poor moral decisions. Just tune down management expense at the foreign manufacturing plant and look the other way. Shit, even the Chinese used to say "Rearee!?!?!? You want us to make THIS and for YOU?!?!?"... Hell, they cloned everything we ever produced so why is it not a safe bet they cloned our business behavior model as well. ZERO MORAL CODE... Yea we agreed on that..

5. I'm guilty myself of just going with it - to some degree. There is no escape from it. The PFOA families are basically in ANY FOOD CONTAINER made of paper and treated with it to keep the paper from turning to mush with the hot/wet food. That's my cheeseburger wrappers, french-fry containers, and pizza boxes. That latter REALLY PISSES ME OFF AS I LIKE MY PIZZA.. Pizza joints should be required to use wax paper.. I feel sorry for the children. While the body is astute at least it protecting reproductive function in the past, I am not even sure if if can stand off these chems today simple because they are in everything. But we have made some progress as I have not doubt that back in the 1970's when I grew up, anything new that came along was just thrown into production big time. Right down to that preservative that used to make that fruity popsicle taste so fukkin good, or the original banana flavor the CRACK that it was. LOL. And my DAD would literally sit there using PAINT STRIPPERS (the TCE's and worse), Rinse his hands in GASOLINE, all while drinking a beer/smoking a sig/ and CHEWING ON STYROFOAM CUPS IN BETWEEN.. No shit...

I honestly DO NOT THINK our fathers are really behind all this. They are either demons in action, or a malevolent ET manipulating men's minds, or ET disguised to look like man. There is just no way that people would do this to themselves or humanity. Something is going on...

Alright, well I just wanted to touch up that volley just a tad. Because my 1970's chemical induced brain disease called ADD and God Knows what is kicking in again. I guess at least my generation did not get the modern AUTISM causing poisons they are using today... Getting back out of this one for a while before the internet police lock-in on me...:oops::)
I don't think there is alot we can do to reverse this. It's to far gone. We arr all gonna die that's why you have to be right wirb Jesus christ
 
I don't think there is alot we can do to reverse this. It's to far gone. We arr all gonna die that's why you have to be right wirb Jesus christ
Lmao yeah you are correct there. We COULD do something if we truly wanted to. Unfortunately the rich and powerful just can't agree enough to DO anything...itnis impossible to pool resources together for this cause..or to fight climate change, etc., because doing so would rock the status quo around who makes the money in society.

I do not think humanity is fit to make it long term. Our species is short sighted, selfish, greedy, and way overly violent.

Regardless, I will do what I can to protect myself and my family and anyone who will listen from these fucking awful chemicals. If nothing else hopefully people may have a longer health span and will die less painfully.
 
It is really fucked. The EPA is supposed to be the ones to protect us against these chemicals. It is literally their job to determine the safety of pesticides and such before they are approved for use. They have failed us MISERABLY. Pathetically so. This is what happens you have ex-industry people and even fucking lobbyists going from private sector into consumer protection agencies like the FDA (cough FUCK Scott Gottlieb) and the EPA.
The only job the FDA has is to make sure you get just enough roach and rat feces and chems in your food to kill you before you collect Social Security. Just enough...

And I am not so sure that @Iamnatty is not right to some degree as far as the situation being out of hand... And speaking business-politically. I don't know how you sway back the tide of a bunch of worthless sold out politicians short of a superhero. And last time I checked that is FICTION. Which is what world they would have us living in while they destroy the real one around us before our eyes distracted...
 
Today EPA is saying that the #pfas chemical #PFOA is 17,500 times more toxic than they thought in 2016. And 100,000 more toxic than 2009.


EPA: Toxic ‘forever chemicals’ levels in drinking water should be much lower
EPA: Toxic ‘forever chemicals’ levels in drinking water should be much lower


WASHINGTON – The Environmental Working Group today applauds the Environmental Protection Agency for proposing new lifetime health advisories, or LHAs, that suggest levels of four “forever chemicals” known as PFAS in drinking water should be significantly lower.

The EPA on Wednesday announced updated LHAs for PFOA and PFOS, the two most notorious PFAS. It also announced new LHAs for PFBS and Gen-X. LHAs provide information on contaminants in drinking water that can harm people throughout their lives.

The four LHAs are:
  • 0.004 parts per trillion, or ppt, for PFOA
  • 0.02 ppt for PFOS
  • 10 ppt for GenX chemicals
  • 2,000 ppt for PFBS
Previously, the EPA had set an LHA for PFOA and PFOS of 70 ppt.


EPA warns toxic ‘forever chemicals’ more dangerous than once thought
https://wapo.st/3xIgO4G


The Environmental Protection Agency warned Wednesday that a group of human-made chemicals found in the drinking water, cosmetics and food packaging used by millions of Americans poses a greater danger to human health than regulators previously thought.

The new health advisories for a ubiquitous class of compounds known as https://www.washingtonpost.com/magazine/2022/01/12/lake-superior-forever-chemicals/?itid=lk_inline_manual_4 (polyfluoroalkyl and perfluoroalkyl substances), or PFAS, underscore the risk facing dozens of communities across the country. Linked to infertility, thyroid problems and several types of cancer, these “forever chemicals” can persist in the environment for years without breaking down.

“People on the front-lines of PFAS contamination have suffered for far too long,” EPA Administrator Michael Regan said in a statement. “That’s why EPA is taking aggressive action.”

The guidance aims to prompt local officials to install water filters or at least notify residents of contamination. But for now, the federal government does not regulate the chemicals. Health advocates have called on the Biden administration to act more quickly to address what officials from both parties describe as a contamination crisis that has touched every state
 
Looksl
Today EPA is saying that the #pfas chemical #PFOA is 17,500 times more toxic than they thought in 2016. And 100,000 more toxic than 2009.


EPA: Toxic ‘forever chemicals’ levels in drinking water should be much lower
EPA: Toxic ‘forever chemicals’ levels in drinking water should be much lower


WASHINGTON – The Environmental Working Group today applauds the Environmental Protection Agency for proposing new lifetime health advisories, or LHAs, that suggest levels of four “forever chemicals” known as PFAS in drinking water should be significantly lower.

The EPA on Wednesday announced updated LHAs for PFOA and PFOS, the two most notorious PFAS. It also announced new LHAs for PFBS and Gen-X. LHAs provide information on contaminants in drinking water that can harm people throughout their lives.

The four LHAs are:
  • 0.004 parts per trillion, or ppt, for PFOA
  • 0.02 ppt for PFOS
  • 10 ppt for GenX chemicals
  • 2,000 ppt for PFBS
Previously, the EPA had set an LHA for PFOA and PFOS of 70 ppt.


EPA warns toxic ‘forever chemicals’ more dangerous than once thought
https://wapo.st/3xIgO4G


The Environmental Protection Agency warned Wednesday that a group of human-made chemicals found in the drinking water, cosmetics and food packaging used by millions of Americans poses a greater danger to human health than regulators previously thought.

The new health advisories for a ubiquitous class of compounds known as https://www.washingtonpost.com/magazine/2022/01/12/lake-superior-forever-chemicals/?itid=lk_inline_manual_4 (polyfluoroalkyl and perfluoroalkyl substances), or PFAS, underscore the risk facing dozens of communities across the country. Linked to infertility, thyroid problems and several types of cancer, these “forever chemicals” can persist in the environment for years without breaking down.

“People on the front-lines of PFAS contamination have suffered for far too long,” EPA Administrator Michael Regan said in a statement. “That’s why EPA is taking aggressive action.”

The guidance aims to prompt local officials to install water filters or at least notify residents of contamination. But for now, the federal government does not regulate the chemicals. Health advocates have called on the Biden administration to act more quickly to address what officials from both parties describe as a contamination crisis that has touched every state
Looks like some states are responding to this well. Others are not (Wisconsin republicand unanimously passed legislation setting the limit to 17,500 times higher than the EPAs new limits, so basically the 2016 levels.

This is happening as many Wisconsin cities are actively struggling with PFAS contamination.

I used to live there and I'm so fucking glad i don't anymore. My state responded the same day saying they are going to figure out what to do to react to and ensure the EPA limits are followed and propritize communities based on people impacted and have specifically called out risk sites (such as manufacturing plants, etc., that will be addressed). They have big write ups for each chemical individually, it's just such an amazing difference compared to where I was before.

Maybe that's why this shouldnt be left up to the states, but instead federally illegal with funding and resources to remediate contamination and research dollars going into things like microbial destruction of PFAS chemicals, which is currently being tested with extremely promising results (literally removing 50-90% of PFAS from soil within just a few weeks!)

"As of today, seven states including California, New York, Maine, Vermont, Washington, Connecticut, and Minnesota have adopted legislation banning the use of PFAS in food packaging. At the federal level, FDA entered into an agreement with PFAS manfuacturers over the voluntary “phase-out” of certain PFAS by Jan 2024."

That is so fucking pathetic. Ban it, but only in food packaging? And only on a voluntary basis? What the fuck? And of course we follow the same route as BPA, WHERE THEY DONT DEFINE ANY SAFE ALTERNATIVE TO REPLACE IT WITH!!! They don't say to use silicone or something, so of course manufacturers will just replace PFAS with PFxx and then it'll be 20 years before we realize that is just as, if not more, toxic, and then have to fight not to be poisoned all over again.

Manufacturing and chemical industry is such a fucking nightmare. That's why the only safe way to eat is to grow your own food and cook it and store it in glass/safe cookware.

I just can't stand our politicians that don't give a fuck about our health and our government that gives companies basically most of the same rights as people, but then when they kill thousands and thousands of people via toxic chemicals (oftentimes knowingly, I might add), what happens? They just pay a fucking fine and go rinse and repeat. There's no real consequences. If one person shoots another though they are sentenced to death or life in prison. Doesn't seem like equal punishment to me.


Anyway I'm done ranting. Sorry yall! I just care about our collective health too much!
 
Looksl

Looks like some states are responding to this well. Others are not (Wisconsin republicand unanimously passed legislation setting the limit to 17,500 times higher than the EPAs new limits, so basically the 2016 levels.

This is happening as many Wisconsin cities are actively struggling with PFAS contamination.

I used to live there and I'm so fucking glad i don't anymore. My state responded the same day saying they are going to figure out what to do to react to and ensure the EPA limits are followed and propritize communities based on people impacted and have specifically called out risk sites (such as manufacturing plants, etc., that will be addressed). They have big write ups for each chemical individually, it's just such an amazing difference compared to where I was before.

Maybe that's why this shouldnt be left up to the states, but instead federally illegal with funding and resources to remediate contamination and research dollars going into things like microbial destruction of PFAS chemicals, which is currently being tested with extremely promising results (literally removing 50-90% of PFAS from soil within just a few weeks!)

"As of today, seven states including California, New York, Maine, Vermont, Washington, Connecticut, and Minnesota have adopted legislation banning the use of PFAS in food packaging. At the federal level, FDA entered into an agreement with PFAS manfuacturers over the voluntary “phase-out” of certain PFAS by Jan 2024."

That is so fucking pathetic. Ban it, but only in food packaging? And only on a voluntary basis? What the fuck? And of course we follow the same route as BPA, WHERE THEY DONT DEFINE ANY SAFE ALTERNATIVE TO REPLACE IT WITH!!! They don't say to use silicone or something, so of course manufacturers will just replace PFAS with PFxx and then it'll be 20 years before we realize that is just as, if not more, toxic, and then have to fight not to be poisoned all over again.

Manufacturing and chemical industry is such a fucking nightmare. That's why the only safe way to eat is to grow your own food and cook it and store it in glass/safe cookware.

I just can't stand our politicians that don't give a fuck about our health and our government that gives companies basically most of the same rights as people, but then when they kill thousands and thousands of people via toxic chemicals (oftentimes knowingly, I might add), what happens? They just pay a fucking fine and go rinse and repeat. There's no real consequences. If one person shoots another though they are sentenced to death or life in prison. Doesn't seem like equal punishment to me.


Anyway I'm done ranting. Sorry yall! I just care about our collective health too much!
Well you got to remember the ROTTEN OLD CUNTZ don't give a fuck about the next generations, even eating their own offspring like rabid dogs. And the truth is that EVERYONE IS ALREADY BOUGHT OR HONEY TRAPPED - AT EVERY LEVEL - ON EVERY LEVEL. It doesn't matter if you are in charge of the garbage collection route. Some CUNT is going to want his trash picked up first and with technology today its just not that difficult to set a person up for a dirt bath and document it via video AND audio...

And finally consider that our entire CONGRESS is 50% over the age that they should have been taken to the vet and put down years ago if only acknowledged as the filthy rabid dogs they are... Hell even the states legislatures are so old even the dentures are decaying... The remaining half is mildly retarded, ignorantly inept, completely unqualified, and just downright stupid. Fuk, they were actually put in their prospective pollical roles hand picked for these reasons alone.. Not a competent unbias seat to be found..

Digressing a bit further (for my pleasure:p) And WHY is this?? Its because the fukked over Gen X so badly that we are all in coffins now and thus you have millennial turds and on that had no one to raise them. The baby boomers just could not part with a dime more than they could screw us out of... Earn that money boy...! Get out there and cut that acre of grass for 15bux. When I was yer age a coke was a nickel. BLA BLA BLA... BLA BLA.... BLABLABLA...

The NWO move from sovereign US corporations to international conglomerates in international markets has now further made it impossible to intervene, punish, and bust up monopolies. The anti-trust act is D.E.A.D..... Rotten bastards destroyed this country...

The highest powers FAR above governmental levels want us all dead - AGENDA 21 and all. I challenge you to identify the people and minds behind the mysterious Georgia Guidestones that were apparently built only in the 70's. They would have you believe E.T. put them here eons ago.. The magic trick is confusing you to believe its some super-grand conspiracy when all along they are killing us slowly at an exponentially increasingly rate on all levels far below all the psychotic distractions they charade around the internet.. Ridiculous..
 
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its not about money like you say and it actually is deliberate like the controlled op alex jones says. Its generational warfare. This is noones fault except ur own honestly, ur ancestors basically fought for this,sins of the father and all that etc. should have sided with axis...woops Bye-Bye!!!
 
its not about money like you say and it actually is deliberate like the controlled op alex jones says. Its generational warfare. This is noones fault except ur own honestly, ur ancestors basically fought for this,sins of the father and all that etc. should have sided with axis...woops Bye-Bye!!!
FYI - You BECAME the Axis as of Operation Paperclip. Just in case you are unclear on that... You ARE living in the 4th Reich AKA The United States of America...... Iron Cladded and fully completed as marked by the date of assassination of Kennedy...
 
FYI - You BECAME the Axis as of Operation Paperclip. Just in case you are unclear on that... You ARE living in the 4th Reich AKA The United States of America...... Iron Cladded and fully completed as marked by the date of assassination of Kennedy..
u think because "they" took scientists that were some of the greatest minds whos contributions in ww2 made this modern world possible instead of killing them or letting them re assimilate that these scientists managed to turn the tables on "them" take over the u.s gov and kill kennedy??? thats a new one... I wish, if that were the case we would probly be getting pro hormones in our food and every guy would be walking around with horse nuts.
 
u think because "they" took scientists that were some of the greatest minds whos contributions in ww2 made this modern world possible instead of killing them or letting them re assimilate that these scientists managed to turn the tables on "them" take over the u.s gov and kill kennedy??? thats a new one... I wish, if that were the case we would probly be getting pro hormones in our food and every guy would be walking around with horse nuts.
No not a new one at all. Just an unknown one lost to time..

Good questions and valid thoughts indeed. Welcome to the awakening. (note that the description of "Woke" is an exact counter-term designed to confuse you and keep you from WAKING UP). Grand conspiracy going on at its highest levels ever.

MOST AMERICANS AS A GENERAL RULE ARE SO FUCKING STUPID AND IGNORANT IN TERMS OF HISTORY THAT ITS DIFFICULT TO DESCRIBE AND QUANTIFY..!!!

I think the Germans incepted Amphetamine, Dbol, and ASPIRIN (Bayer) minimally..


"Ciba-Geigy[edit]

Ciba-Geigy was formed in 1970 by the merger of J. R. Geigy Ltd (founded in Basel in 1857) and CIBA (founded in Basel in 1859).[33]

Ciba began in 1859, when Alexander Clavel (1805–1873) took up the production of fuchsine in his factory for silk-dyeing works in Basel. By 1873, he sold his dye factory to the company Bindschedler and Busch. In 1884, Bindschedler and Busch was transformed into a joint-stock company named "Gesellschaft für Chemische Industrie Basel" (Company for Chemical Industry Basel). The acronym, CIBA, was adopted as the company's name in 1945.[34]

The foundation for Geigy was established in 1857, when Johann Rudolf Geigy-Merian (1830–1917) and Johann Muller-Pack acquired a site in Basel, where they built a dyewood mill and a dye extraction plant. Two years later, they began the production of synthetic fuchsine.[35] In 1901, they formed the public limited company Geigy, and the name of the company was changed to J. R. Geigy Ltd in 1914.[36]

CIBA and Geigy merged in 1970 to form Ciba‑Geigy Ltd. /ˌsiːbə ˈɡaɪɡi/.[37]"




As far as the silent Qu that manifest in the US. Well, I might even SUPPOSE that "They" were already silently in charge and thus ushered it all in. Especially when you consider that PRESIDENTS NOW HAVE BOSSES TOO. But PRECISELY.. And keep in mind they weren't here to build a super army. At least not at first. But look around and then realize where we are militarily. but, That was not the overall goal at that point. It was simply the next logical evolution of a society that was secretly light years beyond the rest of the world on most likely due to the help of ET.

But YES, I am saying that while our founding fathers were fairly advanced, a complete disconnect from our constitution was already forming. Look at all the corporate family names from the US that supported Germany financially in ww2. Germans were already here in plentiful numbers as natural migration thru Ellis Island as many on us indeed have German European roots. And what has changed in today's wars, industrial complex, and politics? Absolutely nothing. Make no mistake that when Putin stated his goal was to cleanse Ukraine of fascist, purple hairs, and factions against GOD... HE WAS DEAD FUCKING SERIOUS....

There is no "in between" in Europe to this day FYI, as there never has been. You are either Communist or Fascist. And if you study history you will be surprised where many of the countries that we know as allies stand in this grand stage even today... While a REPUBLIC DOES by original intent, a capitalist democracy does not neccessarily diconnect from fascism.. A republic however is still defined as the will of the people.. Which can politically go anywhere it wants in nature by its own defintion..

The Breakdown in the initial proposal as to what the US was developed as to be a REPUBLIC by constitution occurred with the end of WW2 and Full German integration of the latest German Tech into the us.. History is a mutherfukker and hence why they continue to BURN and REWRITE books, and lately even pulling down the historical lessons of STATUES. And all along manipulating the very STUPID ASS CITIZENS of the US to do it for them...

And where do we hail from and what are out alliances.? Here is just one semi-neutral capitalist example..

https://www.amazon.com/Wall-Street-Rise-Hitler-Astonishing/dp/1905570279
But don't fret. There are many that can still think for themselves which is good. Whether or not they would choose differently in the way we operate in the US and would give up our ROME 2.0, is another question of TRUTH, MORALITY, RELIGION, and the most highest of humanity's governing principles. And I will be the first to tell you I would not trade my birthright even in someone said there is a chance you could come back in the next life as wealthier, but the gamble was that I could reincarnate poorer. Hence a reason most folks don't want to question or know certain truths. In the grand scheme its a little demonic in principle even. But who am I to question. But I can do my part to educate myself and make every day a chance to make the world a better place. And to begin this path one must review the one we have already walked... And that just happens to become somewhat difficult when they continuously destroy the evidence we know as THE PAST... Then let your mind start to wonder so much and WHY. Its a never ending rabbit hole if you dont focus on the facts that must remain evident to even stand a chance..


View: https://youtu.be/eNDdn4de35Y
 
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Well you got to remember the ROTTEN OLD CUNTZ don't give a fuck about the next generations, even eating their own offspring like rabid dogs. And the truth is that EVERYONE IS ALREADY BOUGHT OR HONEY TRAPPED - AT EVERY LEVEL - ON EVERY LEVEL. It doesn't matter if you are in charge of the garbage collection route. Some CUNT is going to want his trash picked up first and with technology today its just not that difficult to set a person up for a dirt bath and document it via video AND audio...

And finally consider that our entire CONGRESS is 50% over the age that they should have been taken to the vet and put down years ago if only acknowledged as the filthy rabid dogs they are... Hell even the states legislatures are so old even the dentures are decaying... The remaining half is mildly retarded, ignorantly inept, completely unqualified, and just downright stupid. Fuk, they were actually put in their prospective pollical roles hand picked for these reasons alone.. Not a competent unbias seat to be found..

Digressing a bit further (for my pleasure:p) And WHY is this?? Its because the fukked over Gen X so badly that we are all in coffins now and thus you have millennial turds and on that had no one to raise them. The baby boomers just could not part with a dime more than they could screw us out of... Earn that money boy...! Get out there and cut that acre of grass for 15bux. When I was yer age a coke was a nickel. BLA BLA BLA... BLA BLA.... BLABLABLA...

The NWO move from sovereign US corporations to international conglomerates in international markets has now further made it impossible to intervene, punish, and bust up monopolies. The anti-trust act is D.E.A.D..... Rotten bastards destroyed this country...

The highest powers FAR above governmental levels want us all dead - AGENDA 21 and all. I challenge you to identify the people and minds behind the mysterious Georgia Guidestones that were apparently built only in the 70's. They would have you believe E.T. put them here eons ago.. The magic trick is confusing you to believe its some super-grand conspiracy when all along they are killing us slowly at an exponentially increasingly rate on all levels far below all the psychotic distractions they charade around the internet.. Ridiculous..

Read this post.

Then read it again.

Then again.

Keep reading it until it literally becomes part of your brain because this is exactly where we are.
 
Today EPA is saying that the #pfas chemical #PFOA is 17,500 times more toxic than they thought in 2016. And 100,000 more toxic than 2009.


EPA: Toxic ‘forever chemicals’ levels in drinking water should be much lower
EPA: Toxic ‘forever chemicals’ levels in drinking water should be much lower


WASHINGTON – The Environmental Working Group today applauds the Environmental Protection Agency for proposing new lifetime health advisories, or LHAs, that suggest levels of four “forever chemicals” known as PFAS in drinking water should be significantly lower.

The EPA on Wednesday announced updated LHAs for PFOA and PFOS, the two most notorious PFAS. It also announced new LHAs for PFBS and Gen-X. LHAs provide information on contaminants in drinking water that can harm people throughout their lives.

The four LHAs are:
  • 0.004 parts per trillion, or ppt, for PFOA
  • 0.02 ppt for PFOS
  • 10 ppt for GenX chemicals
  • 2,000 ppt for PFBS
Previously, the EPA had set an LHA for PFOA and PFOS of 70 ppt.


EPA warns toxic ‘forever chemicals’ more dangerous than once thought
https://wapo.st/3xIgO4G


The Environmental Protection Agency warned Wednesday that a group of human-made chemicals found in the drinking water, cosmetics and food packaging used by millions of Americans poses a greater danger to human health than regulators previously thought.

The new health advisories for a ubiquitous class of compounds known as https://www.washingtonpost.com/magazine/2022/01/12/lake-superior-forever-chemicals/?itid=lk_inline_manual_4 (polyfluoroalkyl and perfluoroalkyl substances), or PFAS, underscore the risk facing dozens of communities across the country. Linked to infertility, thyroid problems and several types of cancer, these “forever chemicals” can persist in the environment for years without breaking down.

“People on the front-lines of PFAS contamination have suffered for far too long,” EPA Administrator Michael Regan said in a statement. “That’s why EPA is taking aggressive action.”

The guidance aims to prompt local officials to install water filters or at least notify residents of contamination. But for now, the federal government does not regulate the chemicals. Health advocates have called on the Biden administration to act more quickly to address what officials from both parties describe as a contamination crisis that has touched every state
And look they raised a stink about PFAS in the area down south were I live last year and they were complaining about 0.003 Trillionths and I thought that was laughable. But I see your stats published here and it re-alarms me. Shit I thought our municipality was just taking a shot at some more Federal A$$istance..

What is really disturning is how little it takes. 0.004 parts per trillianth is almost unmeasureable . I would actually like to see their evaluation method speaking of. I wonder are they using electron scope assays or something newer?

I have recently read that these new refrigerators are indeed coming with filtration cartridge's that can capture these particles indeed... That's a little comforting at least POSSIBLY being able to have clean ice for my DRANK o_O :oops: :D :p ... I still need one of those kick ass countertop water distillers that run about 1500 bux.. But I FUKKING JUST KNEW IT WAS NOT THAT FIFTH OF VODKA PERDAY. Bastards..
 
I skipped several of the recent posts as we are all extremely verbose on this thread. Our pontification is likely annoying to most. I'll catch back up when I have more time.

I just saw an email update from Pure Water Filters today about PFAS


I like that on each product page they have a direct link to the performance data sheet. For example for their under sink filter: https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1...rformance_Data_Sheet.pdf?13463139502928231787

From the first link:

Water Filter Pitcher PFAS Testing:​

PFOA Removal Levels:​

Epic Pure Water Filter Pitcher >99.6%
Epic Nano Water Filter Pitcher >99.6%

PFOS Removal Levels:​

Epic Pure Water Filter Pitcher >99.6%
Epic Nano Water Filter Pitcher >99.6%

Additional Water Filter PFAS Testing:​

Epic Smart Shield Under Sink Filter 95%
Epic Urban Water Bottle Filter >98%
Epic Outdoor Adventure Water Bottle Filter >99.6%
Epic Universal Refrigerator Filter >99%

I'm not sure why their under sink filter is so much less than the pitcher filters. I may email them to ask. I use the under sink (but my well has been tested and had undetectable levels of PFAS, PFOA, PFOS so I'm not concerned).
 
I was recently surprised ///
Just adding that a friend that bought a new fridge recently noted that the water filter that goes in it is stated to remove PFAS in the upper 90's %. Not sure what brand off hand might be a GE. But its not a special fridge or filter. All I am saying is the latest lines of mainstream appliance filters are stated to include this. I think the replacements run about 50bux every months or so..
 
Interesting, yeah they're getting better. The key is whether they filter out other carcinogenic chemicals, endocrine disruptors, pesticides and herbicides, pharmaceuticals and hormones or not.

The under sink filter from Epic filters out slightly less PFAS due to the flow rate. The water has less time in contact with the filter so a little less gets filtered out.

Below isn't apples to apples as Epic doesn't make a fridge filter, but worth checking out.
You can always search for the PDS for any filter, or email the manufacturer if they don't have it posted (but that would be a red flag for me)

Epic pitcher filter test performance data sheet:

1677679169650.png
1677679200269.png


GE fridge filter (just the first one that came up)
1677679234787.png


This one is a little more apples-to-apples since it's an inline filter like the GE one, you can see the capacity and flow rate are both twice as high as the GE one though, so again time in contact with the filter makes a difference, which is why this one has slightly lower percentages of contaminants removed for various things:

1677679415959.png


I always recommend people look at their utility's water test results, you can find a ton of info at EWG's Tap Water Database: What's in Your Drinking Water? or if you're on a well get a well test, preferably once a year, done by a national laboratory that tests for everything they can.
 
Interesting, yeah they're getting better. The key is whether they filter out other carcinogenic chemicals, endocrine disruptors, pesticides and herbicides, pharmaceuticals and hormones or not.

The under sink filter from Epic filters out slightly less PFAS due to the flow rate. The water has less time in contact with the filter so a little less gets filtered out.

Below isn't apples to apples as Epic doesn't make a fridge filter, but worth checking out.
You can always search for the PDS for any filter, or email the manufacturer if they don't have it posted (but that would be a red flag for me)

Epic pitcher filter test performance data sheet:

View attachment 252741
View attachment 252744


GE fridge filter (just the first one that came up)
View attachment 252746


This one is a little more apples-to-apples since it's an inline filter like the GE one, you can see the capacity and flow rate are both twice as high as the GE one though, so again time in contact with the filter makes a difference, which is why this one has slightly lower percentages of contaminants removed for various things:

View attachment 252747


I always recommend people look at their utility's water test results, you can find a ton of info at EWG's Tap Water Database: What's in Your Drinking Water? or if you're on a well get a well test, preferably once a year, done by a national laboratory that tests for everything they can.
Thats some interesting data. Yes the GE fridge one specs were similar to the ones listed at the bottom of your post. I think those a ANSI specs. I think the issue with the fridge ones is they cap out about 200gals lifespan. But thats a shiton in terms of ice and water. 6 months at least.. But nothing like the Epic as listed up top if they are legit. I would imagine the EPIC boasts a little on the promising side and the GE inline just sticks the the standard they meet possibly catching some more that this, but not the whole next level up so they just dont go there in their list..

I've always heard that you can stir your finger around in a glass of tap water and that would basically instantly nullify any chlorine. I only mention that because I am wondering if you know the byproduct of charcoal filtered chlorine since you always see that filter reduction advertised as "TASTE an ODOR".. So what are they saying? It the chlorine REMOVED. Is it just converted to something else?

I have never been overtly concerned with Chlorine as I have basically spent my life around it. But I don't like it in the tap water when it comes time to drink it. And lately the municipality I live in creates some really "HOT" days as they seem to dose the water in intervals once or twice a week. I think it depends on factors like how close you live to a water substation etc.. I've noticed if you pay attention they have little WATER HUTS around town I call them where I speculate there are automated chemical additive machines injecting into the water supply in an automated manner.

Sometimes I do wonder what chlorine has done and is doing to me from the minor exposures..
 
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Thats some interesting data. Yes the GE fridge one specs were similar to the ones listed at the bottom of your post. I think those a ANSI specs. I think the issue with the fridge ones is they cap out about 200gals lifespan. But thats a shiton in terms of ice and water. 6 months at least.. But nothing like the Epic as listed up top if they are legit. I would imagine the EPIC boasts a little on the promising side and the GE inline just sticks the the standard they meet possibly catching some more that this, but not the whole next level up so they just dont go there in their list..

I've always heard that you can stir your finger around in a glass of tap water and that would basically instantly nullify any chlorine. I only mention that because I am wondering if you know the byproduct of charcoal filtered chlorine since you always see that filter reduction advertised as "TASTE an ODOR".. So what are they saying? It the chlorine REMOVED. Is it just converted to something else?

I have never been overtly concerned with Chlorine as I have basically spent my life around it. But I don't like it in the tap water when it comes time to drink it. And lately the municipality I live in creates some really "HOT" days as they seem to dose the water in intervals once or twice a week. I think it depends on factors like how close you live to a water substation etc.. I've noticed if you pay attention they have little WATER HUTS around town I call them where I speculate there are automated chemical additive machines injecting into the water supply in an automated manner.

Sometimes I do wonder what chlorine has done and is doing to me from the minor exposures..
Yeah it'd be nice if there was more standardization for tests. I'd be very interested to see the performance it depends where you live, for example in places with hard water filters will clog up very fast. Even the under sink filter I had where I lived before would be reduced to a slow drizzle in just 5 or 6 weeks. Fridge filters? They were done in like 3 or 4 tops. Basically the better the filter the faster it clogged since more minerals were captured.

Chlorine is actually very easy to mitigate, all you have to do is let the glass sit out for a while (I think an hour or something?) and all the Chlorine will gas off. Flouride has to be filtered out though. I know for the epic filters they filter out Chlorine, it's on their PDS. I asked them about that and it was just the way the marker was labeled for some reason, it is just a plain chlorine test though.

That said you'll still get chlorine when you shower. I have never been concerned with it either.
 
Yeah it'd be nice if there was more standardization for tests. I'd be very interested to see the performance it depends where you live, for example in places with hard water filters will clog up very fast. Even the under sink filter I had where I lived before would be reduced to a slow drizzle in just 5 or 6 weeks. Fridge filters? They were done in like 3 or 4 tops. Basically the better the filter the faster it clogged since more minerals were captured.

Chlorine is actually very easy to mitigate, all you have to do is let the glass sit out for a while (I think an hour or something?) and all the Chlorine will gas off. Flouride has to be filtered out though. I know for the epic filters they filter out Chlorine, it's on their PDS. I asked them about that and it was just the way the marker was labeled for some reason, it is just a plain chlorine test though.

That said you'll still get chlorine when you shower. I have never been concerned with it either.
Yes you are fucked with hard water. On the bright side the water molecules are so saturated with local minerals, etc, that there can't be too much room for further saturation. Unless of course the tend to chemically bond to said natural adjuncts. Which would not surprise me..
 
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