Failed pct, low sperm count?

[chewiebaca]

Hey everyone, haven't posted on this sub forum before so I wanted to ask for some insight.

28 years old, was on cycle for approximately 6 months, using test e @600mg as a base for the cycle and using tren and deca at 600mg each alternating between the two. Once I was nearing pct, I swapped to only test @300mg for two weeks, then hopped off entirely.

After last shot of test, I began hcg at 2000mcg eod for 20 days. Following last hcg shot, I began Nolva @40mg for 20 days, then 20mg for 20 more days. Also ran Clomid at 100mg for 10 days, then 50mg for 20 days.

Recently had blood work done as my wife and I are trying to conceive and discovered my Lh and Fsh are out of range, as well as testosterone in the lower end range. I'll try to get a print out of the blood work. But I have also noticed my semen appears to be watery which is indicative of low sperm count, which all in all would make sense considering the blood work. I intend to follow up with a sperm analysis just of confirm my suspicions.

Anyways, was wondering what would be considered appropriate regime for this, I'm willing to do whatever and have most pct items on hand. I'm also roaming through this forum with whatever free time I have, but I am currently on a 72 hour shift at work so I am limited with what I can do currently. Thanks for your help guys, I appreciate it.

Edit:forgot to mention, I finished pct end of May/start of June. Thanks!

 

[Eman]

Can you post your baseline and current bloodwork?

Regardless, if you're just on the lower end it's not the end of the world considering the cycle you ran... Some guys have a tough recovery with just 12 weeks of a 19-nor. You were running two for over 20 weeks... It looks like you may have started PCT a bit early too, if I'm reading right.

 

[Riz]

Yes. You definitely started PCT way too early. Considering how long you were running DECA for then factoring in how long the ester stays in the body, there is no way it fully cleared from your system.

Get off everything for another few weeks and restart PCT.

 

[chewiebaca]

Yes. You definitely started PCT way too early. Considering how long you were running DECA for then factoring in how long the ester stays in the body, there is no way it fully cleared from your system.

Get off everything for another few weeks and restart PCT.

Yeah I haven't been on anything for a while now. I'm getting another set of bloods done because I can't seem to find my most recent ones. But what would you suggest, as far as restarting pct? Would you still recommend hcg blast at the start followed by Clomid/Nolva, or just serms? Thanks for the help

 

[hyty666]

You shouldn't use nolva when coming off of deca ... Torem and clomid are recommended

 

[G2Ready]

Post/ get bloods

Get a S/A
^^^^ u can't predict sperm count by it being "watery"

 

[chewiebaca]

Sorry just been getting hammered at work. Just got updated bloods done 2 days ago.

Testosterone serum - 55 264-916ng/Dl
Lh - <.2 1.7-8.6miu/ml
Fsh - .3 1.5-12.4miu/ml
Estradiol - 6.5 7.6-42.6pg/ml

Everything else was within normal range on the blood test.

So yeah, looks like I didn't recover at all, admittedly due to starting Pct before allowing esters to properly clear. I'm restarting on the power pct protocol and will be getting bloods drawn in 2 weeks, then in 4 weeks just to make sure I'm responding appropriately to the protocol. Thanks for all the insight guys. As for sperm analysis, I'll get that done if I still continue to have issues following this restart.

 

[chewiebaca]

Okay just had blood work drawn 2 days ago. Blood was drawn at 10 am and fasted.

Testosterone, serum 233 (264-916)
Lh 0.3 (1.7-8.6)
Fsh 0.9 (1.5-12.4)
Estradiol 6.6 (7.6-42.6)

I have been taking 500 iu hcg e3d and 20mg Nolva/day. So testosterone has technically quadrupled, but little changes in Lh and fsh but this is to be expected on hcg as it is artificial Lh. Estradiol also hasn't increased much, could be due to the Nolva. I'm just not sure where to go from here. I've been feeling a little better, and testicles have felt very firm and large and I have had increase in ejaculation. I suppose the next thing to do is get a sperm analysis to see if they are even any good. Anyone else have any input? I'm open to listening to any ideas on this. Thanks all.

 

[master.on]

Hey everyone, haven't posted on this sub forum before so I wanted to ask for some insight.

28 years old, was on cycle for approximately 6 months, using test e @600mg as a base for the cycle and using tren and deca at 600mg each alternating between the two. Once I was nearing pct, I swapped to only test @300mg for two weeks, then hopped off entirely.

After last shot of test, I began hcg at 2000mcg eod for 20 days. Following last hcg shot, I began Nolva @40mg for 20 days, then 20mg for 20 more days. Also ran Clomid at 100mg for 10 days, then 50mg for 20 days.

Recently had blood work done as my wife and I are trying to conceive and discovered my Lh and Fsh are out of range, as well as testosterone in the lower end range. I'll try to get a print out of the blood work. But I have also noticed my semen appears to be watery which is indicative of low sperm count, which all in all would make sense considering the blood work. I intend to follow up with a sperm analysis just of confirm my suspicions.

Anyways, was wondering what would be considered appropriate regime for this, I'm willing to do whatever and have most pct items on hand. I'm also roaming through this forum with whatever free time I have, but I am currently on a 72 hour shift at work so I am limited with what I can do currently. Thanks for your help guys, I appreciate it.

Edit:forgot to mention, I finished pct end of May/start of June. Thanks!

2000 mcg? Is that 2000 IU
If so, that might be too much.
You may need a lower HCG dose something like 500 or 1000 IU per WEEK at most, but for an extended period of time like 3 months.
Get Estradiol blood tests every month (you may need low dose AI) and sperm count at the end of the 3 month period.
If it doesn't get sperm count to normal you may need some FSH along HCG.

 

[chewiebaca]

2000 mcg? Is that 2000 IU
If so, that might be too much.
You may need a lower HCG dose something like 500 or 1000 IU per WEEK at most, but for an extended period of time like 3 months.
Get Estradiol blood tests every month (you may need low dose AI) and sperm count at the end of the 3 month period.
If it doesn't get sperm count to normal you may need some FSH along HCG.

Sorry, I misspoke, I meant 2000iu. I was following the power pct protocol. But following that and getting blood work a couple months after, I was still shut down. Since then, I have been continuing with hcg 500iu/eod, 50mg Clomid daily. Went and rechecked bloods last week, and after being on this protocol for a month, I've quadrupled in test, but I am still outside of the range, being too low. I have Hmg on the way, and am planning on upping my hcg to 750 eod, and will continue that with Hmg 75iu 3x weekly and retest in a couple weeks. I appreciate the advice and input, thanks!

 

[Jeffg353]

Sorry, I misspoke, I meant 2000iu. I was following the power pct protocol. But following that and getting blood work a couple months after, I was still shut down. Since then, I have been continuing with hcg 500iu/eod, 50mg Clomid daily. Went and rechecked bloods last week, and after being on this protocol for a month, I've quadrupled in test, but I am still outside of the range, being too low. I have Hmg on the way, and am planning on upping my hcg to 750 eod, and will continue that with Hmg 75iu 3x weekly and retest in a couple weeks. I appreciate the advice and input, thanks!

While hcg will help increase test production n LH it will still KEEP u shut down. U need to start pct after a week or two of last hcg shot. Novala will not decrease E2 it only blocks it from attaching to the breast receptor. HCG should cause E2 to increase slightly. Are u confident HCG is legit/good? Are u keeping it refrigerated?

 

[chewiebaca]

While hcg will help increase test production n LH it will still KEEP u shut down. U need to start pct after a week or two of last hcg shot. Novala will not decrease E2 it only blocks it from attaching to the breast receptor. HCG should cause E2 to increase slightly. Are u confident HCG is legit/good? Are u keeping it refrigerated?

Positive it's legit, it's from reliablerx. I mean, my testosterone has technically quadrupled in about a month, and testicles feel very full. It might just be taking a while for my testicles to become functional, who knows. I plan on hopping off hcg once I start getting higher numbers on blood work

 

[Jeffg353]

Positive it's legit, it's from reliablerx. I mean, my testosterone has technically quadrupled in about a month, and testicles feel very full. It might just be taking a while for my testicles to become functional, who knows. I plan on hopping off hcg once I start getting higher numbers on blood work

Ok just a thought. Test, LH, FSH have all increased so thats a sign things are going in the right direction. Perhaps it's taking a little longer to get firing again. Hope the HMG helps.

 

[master.on]

While hcg will help increase test production n LH it will still KEEP u shut down. U need to start pct after a week or two of last hcg shot. Novala will not decrease E2 it only blocks it from attaching to the breast receptor. HCG should cause E2 to increase slightly. Are u confident HCG is legit/good? Are u keeping it refrigerated?

If sperm count is low whilst on HCG or HCG+HMG, it will likely be lower without, even with good natural LH/FSH levels.

 

[chewiebaca]

If sperm count is low whilst on HCG or HCG+HMG, it will likely be lower without, even with good natural LH/FSH levels.

That was my thinking as well, and because my goal is just fertility and not recovery of natty T levels, I feel as though staying on hcg/Hmg is the best option for obtaining fertility. I'll keep you all updated on any progress I make, I'll get more bloods in 2 weeks.

 

[MaxTheMonster]

Can you post your baseline and current bloodwork?

Regardless, if you're just on the lower end it's not the end of the world considering the cycle you ran... Some guys have a tough recovery with just 12 weeks of a 19-nor. You were running two for over 20 weeks... It looks like you may have started PCT a bit early too, if I'm reading right.

I don't know if I would say it's not the end of the world. My natty levels have been at the low end of the range naturally since puberty, and I think it has affected my development, life experiences and sense of wellbeing. 300s range. I was used to these levels and still felt like shit. So if someone is coming off and not used to these lower levels naturally, i feel sorry for them!

 

[Eman]

I don't know if I would say it's not the end of the world. My natty levels have been at the low end of the range naturally since puberty, and I think it has affected my development, life experiences and sense of wellbeing. 300s range. I was used to these levels and still felt like shit. So if someone is coming off and not used to these lower levels naturally, i feel sorry for them!

You're absolutely right, thank you for correcting me. I'll contact the OP right away to inform him that all is lost and it is, in fact, the end of the world.

 

[chewiebaca]

You're absolutely right, thank you for correcting me. I'll contact the OP right away to inform him that all is lost and it is, in fact, the end of the world.

I've been informed that my world is coming to an end. Guess that ends my adventure of trying to regain fertility, time to end it all.

On topic: looking to get bloodwork at the end of the month. Currently running Hmg @75iu 3x week and hcg at 750 3x a week. Mood has improved, I also feel more aggressive, and have had more frequent erections as well as increased testicular mass. My nipples have been itchy and sore lately as well, so I'm implementing adex @.5mg a week. Thanks all for your interest.

 

[EcpertRealistic]

Hey everyone, haven't posted on this sub forum before so I wanted to ask for some insight.

28 years old, was on cycle for approximately 6 months, using test e @600mg as a base for the cycle and using tren and deca at 600mg each alternating between the two. Once I was nearing pct, I swapped to only test @300mg for two weeks, then hopped off entirely.

After last shot of test, I began hcg at 2000mcg eod for 20 days. Following last hcg shot, I began Nolva @40mg for 20 days, then 20mg for 20 more days. Also ran Clomid at 100mg for 10 days, then 50mg for 20 days.

Recently had blood work done as my wife and I are trying to conceive and discovered my Lh and Fsh are out of range, as well as testosterone in the lower end range. I'll try to get a print out of the blood work. But I have also noticed my semen appears to be watery which is indicative of low sperm count, which all in all would make sense considering the blood work. I intend to follow up with a sperm analysis just of confirm my suspicions.

Anyways, was wondering what would be considered appropriate regime for this, I'm willing to do whatever and have most pct items on hand. I'm also roaming through this forum with whatever free time I have, but I am currently on a 72 hour shift at work so I am limited with what I can do currently. Thanks for your help guys, I appreciate it.

Edit:forgot to mention, I finished pct end of May/start of June. Thanks!

Better get back on the juice before your wife dump you