Help with Weightloss (Girl)

[Lunex]

Hello Meso!

I’m on a journey to lose some weight and would love to gather some tips and guidance. If anyone has experience with effective methods for weight loss
Any recommendations on what to use and how would be incredibly helpful as I embark on this journey.

I'm not scared of needles
Ozempic/WeGovy sounds too expensive.

Would any recommend Cagrilintide / Cagrisema over Semaglutide or Tirze?
I wanna start of low dosages for the first 2 months, unless there is not alot of side effects or nausea.

Stats:
Woman
23 Years Old.
Height: 155 CM
Weight: 63 KG

Goal:
Weight: 53-55 KG

Thank you in advance for your support!

 

[Sam312xx]

This is where I think your reasoning has gone awry. The medication, in and of itself will address the root cause of weight gain.

How so?

Weight gain occurs as a result of caloric surplus. A GLP-1 RA will cure that calorie surplus.

Caloric surplus is a symptom, not the root cause.

 

[egruberman]

Caloric surplus is a symptom, not the root cause.

Again, I think this is where your reasoning is flawed. Poor diet and lack of exercise may cause a caloric surplus or it may not. Poor diet and exercise is neither necessary nor sufficient to cause weight gain. All that is necessary and sufficient is a caloric surplus. That could exist in the presence of a great diet and plenty of exercise.

Address the caloric surplus and that’s all that is necessary to cure weight gain.

 

[bigMoJo]

Personal choices don’t negate the ability to offer sound advice on a topic.

If "it’s better to lose fat without drugs first" were truly a "Captain Obvious" statement, the original poster to whom I replied wouldn’t have pushed the idea that permanent use of medication use as the primary and inevitable solution, comparing this medication to something like insulin for diabetics.

It seems ironic that you're calling me out for supposedly "taking swings," when the only person who actually resorted to direct insults was Ghoul, whom you seem to be defending.

I’ve remained respectful throughout the conversation, while that individual called people "pussies" and "knuckle draggers." If we’re going to talk about looking before leaping, it might be worth considering who’s actually crossing the line here.

Granted, my post failed to fully touch the thoughts I wished to convey, left intentionally shorter for sake of speed and ease.

As I said, I thought it was hypocritical that you yourself plan to use a GLP, but took issue with advising OP to do the same. I get it... there are other factors/circumstances that you likely considered/contemplated, and, OP should be advised to do as well, right? However, this was what sparked my response.

My statement on not defending ghoul should have been more specific as to the "name-calling." However, the point was to the "advice." "Harm reduction." OP was given info by different members: "diet;" "excercise;" How to use GLP." Does it end there? I think a reasonable person will do their own due diligence, after the fact, and find what fits for them, as @iris pointed out (By the way, you didn't "swing" at her?).

Those members providing their best "harm reduction" advice... neither needs to answer to me or you, right? That's my fundamental point.

To add: so ghoul called us "knuckledraggers" and so on. I say, "so what." He gets as good as he gives. Was his statement really meant to be personal? I didn't take it that way. Then again, my problem is: I don't take things personal, and I love a good roast... even at my own expense. I've thrown some roasts at him too. I don't get my panties in a bunch. In fact, I'm not wearing panties *wink wink*. Maybe you disagree here, that's understandable. But again, that was not my point.

So if there was flawed advice, and you want to call it out/rebut... great. You put forth a great argument and someone rebut yours. The more points of view the better... that's what I think anyway. And if someone feels they may have been "off," they can say so or not. It's up to us "reasonable" people to each decide for ourselves. And if our view changes or not, we need not answer to anyone about it.

 

[Sam312xx]

Address the caloric surplus and that’s all that is necessary to cure weight gain.

This is wrong. Focusing solely on calories overlooks many important physiological and biochemical processes.

A poor diet and a lack of exercise lead to weight gain and other adverse health effects through mechanisms that extend beyond simple caloric balance. They can alter metabolism, hormone levels, gut microbiota, and energy expenditure in ways that promote fat accumulation even in the absence of a caloric surplus.

 

[BuildABro]

Granted, my post failed to fully touch the thoughts I wished to convey, left intentionally shorter for sake of speed and ease.

As I said, I thought it was hypocritical that you yourself plan to use a GLP, but took issue with advising OP to do the same. I get it... there are other factors/circumstances that you likely considered/contemplated, and, OP should be advised to do as well, right? However, this was what sparked my response.

My statement on not defending ghoul should have been more specific as to the "name-calling." However, the point was to the "advice." "Harm reduction." OP was given info by different members: "diet;" "excercise;" How to use GLP." Does it end there? I think a reasonable person will do their own due diligence, after the fact, and find what fits for them, as @iris pointed out (By the way, you didn't "swing" at her?).

Those members providing their best "harm reduction" advice... neither needs to answer to me or you, right? That's my fundamental point.

To add: so ghoul called us "knuckledraggers" and so on. I say, "so what." He gets as good as he gives. Was his statement really meant to be personal? I didn't take it that way. Then again, my problem is: I don't take things personal, and I love a good roast... even at my own expense. I've thrown some roasts at him too. I don't get my panties in a bunch. In fact, I'm not wearing panties *wink wink*. Maybe you disagree here, that's understandable. But again, that was not my point.

So if there was flawed advice, and you want to call it out/rebut... great. You put forth a great argument and someone rebut yours. The more points of view the better... that's what I think anyway. And if someone feels they may have been "off," they can say so or not. It's up to us "reasonable" people to each decide for ourselves. And if our view changes or not, we need not answer to anyone about it.

I think it is important to keep in mind that most of the people who frequent this place are into fitness and anabolics. As such, many of us are naturally we are going to give advice through this type of lens.

This is not MyFitnessPal or some Discord peptide group of soccer moms after all, where you are going to get kid gloves for a horrible diet and lack of self discipline. Proper nutrition, rigorous training and self discipline is our stock and trade. So the natural inclination is to see weakness and a shade of pathetic in those who do not possess these traits. It's admittedly unfair that my default position is to view people of the previously mentioned mentality in this light, and I do my best to be empathetic, but It can be challenging.

At the end of the day, I guess I am ultimately left with 'who gives a fuck'? Some person thinks they need to inject a GLP1 until the day they land in a casket then why is this problematic in any way? We can view them in whatever light we choose, but it's their life after all.

Again, I think you did a commendable job in summarizing the various viewpoints expressed here. People can make up their own minds from there I reckon.

As for the civility thing, just speaking for myself, if folks can't act like a mature adult then I have no interest in engaging. I have kids, so I have all immaturity I can deal with in my domestic life. I don't need it to follow me here.

 

[egruberman]

A poor diet and a lack of exercise lead to weight gain and other adverse health effects through mechanisms that extend beyond simple caloric balance. They can alter metabolism, hormone levels, gut microbiota, and energy expenditure in ways that promote fat accumulation even in the absence of a caloric surplus.

Right: Like the nutrition professor Mark Haub that went on a Twinkie diet, lost 27lbs and had all of his biomarkers improved.

You’ll have to substantiate your claim for me to believe it.

 

[BuildABro]

Right: Like the nutrition professor Mark Haub that went on a Twinkie diet, lost 27lbs and had all of his biomarkers improved.

You’ll have to substantiate your claim for me to believe it.

Yes, in terms of weight loss, sure you can eat pure shit and lose weight, and if you drop weight your biomarkers are naturally going to improve.

But I dare say you would not find a registered dietitian or MD on the planet who would advise this as a great solution for long term health.

 

[MrTexas2]

Thank you, but I'm looking to inject some shit.

I have not read all the replies, but I wanted to respond to this post. For reference, I have been bodybuilding for 49 years, done 17 contests (won a few but fell short of getting my pro card) and have prepped female competitors.

I have also personal trained many women. I don't post this to brag but to let you know I have been to a few rodeos.

Here is my main point: Don't think you are just going o "inject some shit" and look great. Yes drugs will help, but the key is hard work, diet, discipline and patience.

You must be willing to do the work and discipline the diet and lifestyle.

 

[biggerben69]

I only read the first page of this thread. My comments aren't aimed at the OP, @Lunex , unless they they should be.

I registered here in 2006. I've seen some strange behavior by members when a new "female" member comes on board. There have been some relationships that have gone to the next level....most doing so while not actually meeting irl. Members who were friendly, after catching feelings for the new "female" member, have become enemies. I've seen threats exchanged and members banned.

I'm going to make this short. I could go on and tell some stories. I'm going to put my CONSERVATIVE estimate at about 8 out of 10(80%). That would be the # and % of members that register as FEMALES that are actually MALE.

Again, lunex, I'm sure you're all woman. I caution because most members...male and female...won't be around in 30 days anyway.

 

[Sam312xx]

Right: Like the nutrition professor Mark Haub that went on a Twinkie diet, lost 27lbs and had all of his biomarkers improved.

You’ll have to substantiate your claim for me to believe it.

Again, your argument is fundamentally flawed.

While weight loss can temporarily improve biomarkers regardless of diet quality, it fails to address a crucial point.

Diets high in processed foods and low in essential nutrients can lead to long-term health issues, including cardiovascular disease, type 2 diabetes, and nutrient deficiencies, which may not manifest immediately.

 

[Sam312xx]

I have not read all the replies, but I wanted to respond to this post. For reference, I have been bodybuilding for 49 years, done 17 contests (won a few but fell short of getting my pro card) and have prepped female competitors.

I have also personal trained many women. I don't post this to brag but to let you know I have been to a few rodeos.

Here is my main point: Don't think you are just going o "inject some shit" and look great. Yes drugs will help, but the key is hard work, diet, discipline and patience.

You must be willing to do the work and discipline the diet and lifestyle.

I've been trying to relay this same message for the last 4 pages of this thread.

 

[BuildABro]

I've been trying to relay this same message for the last 4 pages of this thread.

Never thought I would see the day on this forum of someone defending eating MSG laden, processed garbage. But never say never I suppose? People used to use the excuse that healthy food is too expensive, to which I say shop at friggin Aldi's then. You do not need to shop at Trader Joe's or Whole Foods to be able to achieve a nutrient rich diet. In fact, most of the stuff those places sell is over priced and hyper-marketed nonsense.

Though I do see the point they are making, at least in the short term, which is that losing weight in general has dramatic health benefit. This I do agree with, but at some point people are going to have to learn some basic nutritional principles and this is just the forum to pick up this skill set.

 

[Sam312xx]

Never thought I would see the day on this forum of someone defending eating MSG laden, processed garbage. But never say never I suppose? People used to use the excuse that healthy food is too expensive, to which I say shop at friggin Aldi's then. You do not need to shop at Trader Joe's or Whole Foods to be able to achieve a nutrient rich diet. In fact, most of the stuff those places sell is over priced and hyper-marketed nonsense.

Though I do see the point they are making, at least in the short term, which is that losing weight in general has dramatic health benefit. This I do agree with, but at some point people are going to have to learn some basic nutritional principles and this is just the forum to pick up this skill set.

It shows a side effect of the advent of GLP-1 RAs for weight loss, it can lead to an over reliance on medication instead of healthy lifestyle habits that promote long term health.

We have a person literally using the Twinkie diet experiment to demonstrate how it's okay to eat utter trash as long as there's a caloric deficit.

This is so far off the edge, you can't even see the line anymore.

 

[bigMoJo]

​

 

[BuildABro]

Yes, we have now entered the Meso twilight zone.

We have a person literally using the Twinkie diet experiment to demonstrate how it's okay to eat utter trash as long as there's a caloric deficit.

This is so far off the edge, you can't even see the line anymore

 

[egruberman]

Diets high in processed foods and low in essential nutrients can lead to long-term health issues, including cardiovascular disease, type 2 diabetes, and nutrient deficiencies, which may not manifest immediately.

I challenge you to find anything in the literature that teases apart the health impact of consuming processed food that is independent of the fact that the consumption of processed, ultra-palatable foods tends to lead to a caloric surplus.

Go ahead, I’ll wait.

We have a person literally using the Twinkie diet experiment to demonstrate how it's okay to eat utter trash as long as there's a caloric deficit.

You seemed to have read something that doesn’t exist. If you’re going to engage in an argument with me, do so with the actual words that I used rather than what you imagined I wrote.

I did not write that a Twinkie diet is “okay”, however it is an example that people can consume shit food in a caloric deficit and have improved health outcomes. That is a fact. Is it okay? Nope, not something I’d recommend. Does it work? Yes.

What it appears that you’re failing to do is apply principles of reductionism. If the goal is weight loss, and obesity is problematic, then I’m going to employ only those mitigations which are necessary and sufficient to address the problem.

While I readily agree that lifestyle change in terms of diet and exercise are beneficial, encouraging them is an unnecessary impediment to achieving the desired outcomes.

If that doesn’t make sense to you, I can’t make it any more clear.

 

[BuildABro]

I challenge you to find anything in the literature that teases apart the health impact of consuming processed food that is independent of the fact that the consumption of processed, ultra-palatable foods tends to lead to a caloric surplus.

Go ahead, I’ll wait.

Type the search term "Processed Foods" into Pubmed. You will get just shy of 23,000 results. Many of the more recent journal articles you have to pay for other than the abstract, but I don't think it will take you very long to get a sense of the universal scientific consensus.

 

[egruberman]

Type the search term "Processed Foods" into Pubmed. You will get just shy of 23,000 results. Many of the more recent journal articles you have to pay for other than the abstract, but I don't think it will take you very long to get a sense of the universal scientific consensus.

Now I need you to read the actual words that I wrote: which is whether the literature reflects a negative health impact independent of caloric surplus.

I doubt you’ll find anything.

 

[BuildABro]

Now I need you to read the actual words that I wrote: which is whether the literature reflects a negative health impact independent of caloric surplus.

I doubt you’ll find anything.

Conduct the search i suggested and you will quickly see this is not the case.

 

[egruberman]

Conduct the search i suggested and you will quickly see this is not the case.

I did. I found some data around gut health, micronutrient deficiency, and inflammation. Though the latter is kinda nebulous independent of a caloric surplus.

I found a whole lot of literature that suggests that ultra-processed foods lead to a caloric surplus and that's bad, but we all knew that. Other than the above, I could find very little that shows harm in the absence of a surplus.