HGH sleep issues

[400degrees]

About a month in on ugl GH, 4iu every night before bed, 2hrs after dinner. First couple weeks it knocked me out all night. Past couple weeks I've been wide awake at 3am every night. Almost feels like a cortisol spike. Wondering if I should ride it out, switch to am, or if anyone has had the same experience or knows the possible science behind this regarding the gh interactions with prolactin, progesterone or adrenals.

 

[MyNameIsJeff]

Blood work vs negative control without GH?

I wish I was that diligent. Will bite the bullet and get blood work if things don't resolve themselves.

 

[Benf15harp]

Despite the sleep disruptions, I'm sharp and productive at work. I have lots of energy and am wakeful all day. As long as it stays that way, I don't see any urgency in lowering the dose.

In fact, I hope that I will tolerate the current dose, and more, once my thyroid system has reached a new equilibrium.

lol. How illogical

 

[MyNameIsJeff]

lol. How illogical

You are low IQ, you can't tell what is and isn't logical.

 

[MyNameIsJeff]

Maybe we just need a beta blocker to counter the increased beta-adrenergic activity from higher fT3. Have you tried adding it?

Good point brother, I might increase my Nebivolol dose a bit and see if that helps.

 

[Fattyone]

I hopped back on GH after many years, at 3IU injected ~1.5 hours prior to bedtime. I have been tracking my sleep for a year, so I can tell what changed.

- Sleep duration went down by 1 to 2 hours per night
- More deep sleep, and it is more continuous in the first ~3 hours of sleep, when the GH serum levels are the highest
- REM sleep took a big hit, roughly a 40% reduction since starting to take GH
- I almost always wake up after 3-5 hours of sleep and have trouble falling asleep again
- My resting heart rate during sleep increased by 20%, and my heart beats feel somewhat more forceful, particularly when I wake up during the night
- No daytime sleepiness. On the contrary, I feel wired most of the day
- OSA got worse, since my AutoPAP cranks up the pressure higher than it used to

Funny enough, in my 20s I could inject 10IU prior to bed and had no issues. My suspicion is that my thyroid hormones are in overdrive. Would also explain the insane fat loss I have had since starting the GH again (~ 2 weeks ago). I was lean to begin with, so I can see small changes in body fat and fullness.

In any case, I will continue to take the GH for a couple more weeks, but if my sleep does not improve, I will have to lower the dose or just drop it

HGH kills my sleep too. My sleep data from my whoop has massively improved since I quit HGH.

 

[Benf15harp]

You are low IQ, you can't tell what is and isn't illogical.

Ouch.

 

[MyNameIsJeff]

I could dose it before bed and slept amazing

Switched to the provider's GH and I get bad sleep if I dose the GH before bed, but the results with the providers gh has been way better so I know its quality. Kind of makes me wonder what was in k4ls product. I can't explain it

Interesting, I get the sleep issues with TP's blacks, but never had any issues (even at 10IU bolus) with his higher-purity greys (when they were still available). Might need to try another GH product to see if that makes a difference in terms of sleep quality.

 

[Lord Commander]

Interesting, I get the sleep issues with TP's blacks, but never had any issues (even at 10IU bolus) with his higher-purity greys (when they were still available). Might need to try another GH product to see if that makes a difference in terms of sleep quality.

My sleep was ok too with Genotropin but not with TP.

 

[Intrepid]

Interesting, I get the sleep issues with TP's blacks, but never had any issues (even at 10IU bolus) with his higher-purity greys (when they were still available). Might need to try another GH product to see if that makes a difference in terms of sleep quality.

Yeah I wish I had a logical explanation for why this is the Case, but the reason alludes me.

The only variables I can think of:
Purity %
Dimer %
Fillers used

To expand on my previous post:
Slept great with k4l gh
Slept bad with TP GH
Sleeping great on QSC GH

 

[Lord Commander]

Yeah I wish I had a logical explanation for why this is the Case, but the reason alludes me.

The only variables I can think of:
Purity %
Dimer %
Fillers used

To expand on my previous post:
Slept great with k4l gh
Slept bad with TP GH
Sleeping great on QSC GH

To add to your list after 4 months or so on Providers black tops i have some acne around my chest, shoulders and upper back that doesn't seem to go away even though i haven't been on it anymore for about 6 weeks now. There might be some dirty fillers or impurities in it...

 

[Ateam2023]

To add to your list after 4 months or so on Providers black tops i have some acne around my chest, shoulders and upper back that doesn't seem to go away even though i haven't been on it anymore for about 6 weeks now. There might be some dirty fillers or impurities in it...

to much dimer lmao!

 

[Black Beard]

About a month in on ugl GH, 4iu every night before bed, 2hrs after dinner. First couple weeks it knocked me out all night. Past couple weeks I've been wide awake at 3am every night. Almost feels like a cortisol spike. Wondering if I should ride it out, switch to am, or if anyone has had the same experience or knows the possible science behind this regarding the gh interactions with prolactin, progesterone or adrenals.

Old post, but should help. PM GH makes my sleep dog shit. AM makes my sleep awesome.

 

[MyNameIsJeff]

Old post, but should help. PM GH makes my sleep dog shit. AM makes my sleep awesome.

Do you remember the source of the generic GH that caused you the sleep issues?

 

[400degrees]

Don't forget vasopressin, also very important for sleep stability/fragmentation and I'm guessing GH probably affects it's release, receptor expression, ... if nothing else, via increases in plasma osmolality due to increased sodium retention ... : D

I'm not going to pretend like I know the answer to this, as I don't think the science community has a clear understanding of it, but anything that increases sleep pressure should help. Although any agents in this regard will have a noticeable effect on your brain chemistry (think sleep medications like H1 antagonists which increase SWS, ...) and overall mood/cognition.

For me, most of the awakenings happen during REM, so if I was to base my hypothetical over my personal experience I'd go in the direction of decreasing REM density (5HT1a agonists do this, for instance CBD) or maybe vice versa, increasing REM stability, make it harder to wake from REM (cholinergic's, I had success with phosphatidyl serine, although combining two drugs which make REM sleep more vivid might be a wild experience).

Also seeing how GH increases NREM2 and decreases SWS, anything that increases SWS should help. But now we are again at H1, 5HT2a antagonists, pregabalin, etc. GHRH (ie. cjc1295) which increases SWS might be worth a try. Maybe dual orexin receptor antagonists? but purportedly, they also tend to increase REM ...

In regards to cortisol I'd potentially try some natural adaptogens like bacopa or ashwagandha, rhodiola, as mentioned phosphatidyl, etc. But everything here will again have an effect on your mood/cognition and I'd be weary of ashwagandha.

One thing which is for sure is that what ever will down regulate/calm the HPA axis and the amygdala should help (providing that some deficits aren't the issue in the first place) as GH related sleep issues are most probably more prevalent in people who have problems in this department already. I'm talking about taking care of anxiety, stress, etc. It takes about 3 months for the HPA axis to normalize.https://www.embopress.org/doi/full/10.15252/msb.20209510 A hyperactive HPA axis will fragment your sleep as is and will react with a greater intensity to any agent which has an inclination of modulating it, GH being such a substance ofc.

Maybe there is a protocol out there which doesn't include the use of such psychotropic drugs, if so, I hope someday somebody finds it. I'd look at electrolytes and blood glucose management first ... I personally found that I was sleeping even poorer when sodium ingestion was higher for instance.

Great post here. A lot of good starting points for some potential research/experimentation.

 

[400degrees]

Surprised about the amount of quality responses on this post I didn’t think it’d get much attention. New to meso so thanks! Figured I’d give an update:
I switched to am dose only and sleep improved. Threw in some low dose tren to my current cycle and was worried about sleep again. So I started trying a pm GH dose again, for some reason I thought it might help. So 4/4 am/pm doses totaling 8ius. Also added in a supplement sleep stack after some further research- 5htp, optizinc, mag, p5p (based off dr dean st marts product). I’ll add in ksm66 or emodin depending on stress levels. All this with the split dose I’m ending up with decent sleep quality even with a pm dose. Not super consistent but manageable.

There’s so much going on when looking at this topic I’m excited to find some time to go down a few more rabbit holes like in regards to a few of the points made in the post I replied to above this

 

[Ateam2023]

a little update on my sleep , i've been taking 5 ius split am/pm, i was recently "trying" different splits on doses ie: 3iu am 2 iu pm, but my sleep quality was poor as to compare it to my doses of 3 iu at night and 2 iu in the am, that little switch of taking the bigger bolus at night deffo helped my deep sleep cycle , going from 2-3 hrs deep sleep to 5-7 hrs deep sleep
i tried the lesser of the protocol for about 2 weeks and just suffered imo , so i will continue to do the bigger bolus at night

 

[Jin23]

a little update on my sleep , i've been taking 5 ius split am/pm, i was recently "trying" different splits on doses ie: 3iu am 2 iu pm, but my sleep quality was poor as to compare it to my doses of 3 iu at night and 2 iu in the am, that little switch of taking the bigger bolus at night deffo helped my deep sleep cycle , going from 2-3 hrs deep sleep to 5-7 hrs deep sleep
i tried the lesser of the protocol for about 2 weeks and just suffered imo , so i will continue to do the bigger bolus at night

You are not getting 5 to 7h of slow wave sleep. From where are you deriving that info?

 

[Ateam2023]

You are not getting 5 to 7h of slow wave sleep. From where are you deriving that info?

You are correct, its from some bs app i have been using , its not effective at all! as i'm now using my apple watch and the difference is alarming,, nowhere near what i thought,

 

[Ateam2023]

back to the drawing board

 

[MyNameIsJeff]

Deep sleep is always fine for me on GH. It's REM sleep that is hit hard. I tried AM dosing, which is definitely better for sleep, but my REM sleep duration is still below what it used to be. This could lead to somewhat impaired memory formation.