High SHBG , low free T help

[Alyk89]

@Jdoe32

Yeah so an update, turns out I have sleep apnea. I have an appointment to pick up my calibrated CPAP next week. I ended up having "mild" sleep apnea, having 8 disturbances an hour, and 13 in REM. 15 in REM is the sleep docs marker for moderate sleep apnea. Focusing on losing the 25lbs I put on in the last year or so, should help.

I ended up finding my login that had the schedule for my past blood donations, I donated 1 time and my TSAT was 38%, never measured before. I doubt I have an iron absorption issue.

I was on 180mg from the clinic for 2 weeks, lowered it myself to 150mg, (the 160 before was a typo) did that for about 5 weeks then started to get high e2 symptoms. Lowered my dose even more to 120mg for a few weeks then ran a test just to see where I was at....1060 ng/dl in my trough so I have since lowered to 100mg a week along with 500 iu HCG a week. Waiting another 5 weeks to test. Might go even lower than that if the HCG puts me to high numbers.

Started drinking a gallon of water, eating a grapefruit a day, along with 6,000 iu Nattokinase at bed. RBC dropped slightly to 6.23 from 6.28. Hemoglobin went to 17.9 from 17.6 and Hematocrit dropped to 54% even from 54.8%. Havent donated in blood in 4 months.

SHBG on a couple of months of Test has put me at 46 and I feel great. I have pretty much full symptom resolution. Libido never came back like it was but I can get erections with stimulation. I have enough energy to run 4-5 days a week, and lift. I have been sleeping like a champ 7-9hours a day, previously unheard of for me. I can stay up until 10-11pm without issue. I also have been the calmest and most relaxed I have been in a very long time. As of late I am just running 4 days a week and doing some bag work 1x a week to get my weight back down along with adjusting down my diet.

Next steps for me are going to see how much using a CPAP lowers my RBC. Hopefully enough that I can stick to this 100mg test and resume living a normal moderately active life.

 

[Jdoe32]

@Jdoe32

Yeah so an update, turns out I have sleep apnea. I have an appointment to pick up my calibrated CPAP next week. I ended up having "mild" sleep apnea, having 8 disturbances an hour, and 13 in REM. 15 in REM is the sleep docs marker for moderate sleep apnea. Focusing on losing the 25lbs I put on in the last year or so, should help.

I ended up finding my login that had the schedule for my past blood donations, I donated 1 time and my TSAT was 38%, never measured before. I doubt I have an iron absorption issue.

I was on 180mg from the clinic for 2 weeks, lowered it myself to 150mg, (the 160 before was a typo) did that for about 5 weeks then started to get high e2 symptoms. Lowered my dose even more to 120mg for a few weeks then ran a test just to see where I was at....1060 ng/dl in my trough so I have since lowered to 100mg a week along with 500 iu HCG a week. Waiting another 5 weeks to test. Might go even lower than that if the HCG puts me to high numbers.

Started drinking a gallon of water, eating a grapefruit a day, along with 6,000 iu Nattokinase at bed. RBC dropped slightly to 6.23 from 6.28. Hemoglobin went to 17.9 from 17.6 and Hematocrit dropped to 54% even from 54.8%. Havent donated in blood in 4 months.

SHBG on a couple of months of Test has put me at 46 and I feel great. I have pretty much full symptom resolution. Libido never came back like it was but I can get erections with stimulation. I have enough energy to run 4-5 days a week, and lift. I have been sleeping like a champ 7-9hours a day, previously unheard of for me. I can stay up until 10-11pm without issue. I also have been the calmest and most relaxed I have been in a very long time. As of late I am just running 4 days a week and doing some bag work 1x a week to get my weight back down along with adjusting down my diet.

Next steps for me are going to see how much using a CPAP lowers my RBC. Hopefully enough that I can stick to this 100mg test and resume living a normal moderately active life.

Thank you for your update, I hope it will end up very well for you!. I was curious what happened to your SHBG and if you found a way to lower it without going on TRT, but it’s not the case anymore lol. I also have high SHBG (made a thread about it few days ago if you want to see it), with normal hormone levels (according to every doctor I’ve been with). But the symptoms ruined my life, and I don’t know what could be causing it. The only thing that made me look into this were 2 months of HCG that gave me my life back after years of suffering and I thought “that’s it, by chance you found what’s going on”. But my docs say I’m wrong, that’s not it. Interesting about your libido, what could be the reason? I think that you’ll want to fix that some day, you need it for your emotional wellbeing I think. At least I would, I am needing it lol. Also could high shbg be caused by sleep apnea? (Idk, maybe fatigue liver due to not sleeping well).
All the best!

 

[Jin23]

@Jdoe32

Yeah so an update, turns out I have sleep apnea. I have an appointment to pick up my calibrated CPAP next week. I ended up having "mild" sleep apnea, having 8 disturbances an hour, and 13 in REM. 15 in REM is the sleep docs marker for moderate sleep apnea. Focusing on losing the 25lbs I put on in the last year or so, should help.

I ended up finding my login that had the schedule for my past blood donations, I donated 1 time and my TSAT was 38%, never measured before. I doubt I have an iron absorption issue.

I was on 180mg from the clinic for 2 weeks, lowered it myself to 150mg, (the 160 before was a typo) did that for about 5 weeks then started to get high e2 symptoms. Lowered my dose even more to 120mg for a few weeks then ran a test just to see where I was at....1060 ng/dl in my trough so I have since lowered to 100mg a week along with 500 iu HCG a week. Waiting another 5 weeks to test. Might go even lower than that if the HCG puts me to high numbers.

Started drinking a gallon of water, eating a grapefruit a day, along with 6,000 iu Nattokinase at bed. RBC dropped slightly to 6.23 from 6.28. Hemoglobin went to 17.9 from 17.6 and Hematocrit dropped to 54% even from 54.8%. Havent donated in blood in 4 months.

SHBG on a couple of months of Test has put me at 46 and I feel great. I have pretty much full symptom resolution. Libido never came back like it was but I can get erections with stimulation. I have enough energy to run 4-5 days a week, and lift. I have been sleeping like a champ 7-9hours a day, previously unheard of for me. I can stay up until 10-11pm without issue. I also have been the calmest and most relaxed I have been in a very long time. As of late I am just running 4 days a week and doing some bag work 1x a week to get my weight back down along with adjusting down my diet.

Next steps for me are going to see how much using a CPAP lowers my RBC. Hopefully enough that I can stick to this 100mg test and resume living a normal moderately active life.

A 38% tsat after a blood donation, as I said previously, would indicate it was elevated before. You can have normal ferritin with elevated tsat. Heterozygous hemachromatosis H63D, some form of transferin mutation, or more likely low transferin synthesis due to some liver issues (especially seeing as shbg is also high).

Sleep apnea is also definitely a factor in haematology (increased rbc synthesis) and consequently in endocrinology. So get that sorted.

1000 ngdl at through at 2 x week pinning schedule is high, too high, that's not trt. However since you have high shbg you need to look at free sex hormones (T and e2). At 45 shbg I would like to have TT at around 900 at Tmax.

Get your TT levels sorted out. You are in your so called honeymoon phase, but sooner or later the excess androgen load will catch up to you.

 

[Jdoe32]

A 38% tsat after a blood donation, as I said previously, would indicate it was elevated before. You can have normal ferritin with elevated tsat. Heterozygous hemachromatosis H63D, some form of transferin mutation, or more likely low transferin synthesis due to some liver issues (especially seeing as shbg is also high).

Sleep apnea is also definitely a factor in haematology (increased rbc synthesis) and consequently in endocrinology. So get that sorted.

1000 ngdl at through at 2 x week pinning schedule is high, too high, that's not trt. However since you have high shbg you need to look at free sex hormones (T and e2). At 45 shbg I would like to have TT at around 900 at Tmax.

Get your TT levels sorted out. You are in your so called honeymoon phase, but sooner or later the excess androgen load will catch up to you.

Hey Jin,

I really like your answers man, they are really comprehensive and well structured. Without asking to much of your free time, could you take a look over my personal thread and express maybe 1-2 general opinions? Thx

 

[Alyk89]

@Jin23 Sorry, I misread your previous post I thought because I thought it had been 2-3 donations it be likely that I had an elevated saturation.In the case it is a iron saturation issue, do you know what the likely solution or treatment is?

Also do you have. to wait a full 6 weeks every-time you change your dose to get an accurate reading? I just dropped the dose to 100 this last week. I pin 3 days a week, M,W,F if that makes a difference. Clinic said higher frequency would likely lead to less hematocrit spikes.


@Jdoe32

Yeah theres quiet a few things I found online that could be contributing to high SHBG that don't require a medical intervention. I'll list some of it out below, some was supported by research articles, some by bro science.

- Severe caloric restriction for extended periods of time can lead to increase in SHBG. (This was me)
- Lack of carbs, make sure you are eating 200g of carbs. (somtimes more depending on your activity level)
- Low protein diets can lead to high SHBG, make sure you get .75g per lb at least.
- Thyroid issues, make sure you get TSH, Free T3 and T4 checked
- High levels of cortisol can lead to increase SHBG. This means stress, lack of sleep, and or too much caffeine.
- Overtraining - if you train too much can cause high SHBG.Usually you can tell if you are if you have shitty RHR, unusually high BP, and low HRV. You'll probably be exhausted for no reason even when getting some rest, your hair might fall out, your thyroid levels will become depressed along with an inability to sleep properly. (this was me for a while)
- Check liver function, also check for NAFLD which has to be sussed out by an ultra sound.
- Check your iron, ferritin, TIBC, and TSAT. You can either have too high of iron levels or have too high of a saturation causing issues with the liver.
- Make sure your selenium, magnesium, copper and zinc levels are in line.
- Look into your basic vitamins to make sure there is no deficiency, A,B's,C,D,K etc.
-Boron deficiency can lead to an increase in SHBG as well.
- Jin23 also mentioned having poor gut health can lead to oxidation issues in the liver so make sure you aren't eating dog shit, it's similar vein to the NAFLD issue I think.

That should cover most of what I found as I remember it. If I remember any stragglers, I'll add them. Hope that helps.

 

[Jdoe32]

@Jin23 Sorry, I misread your previous post I thought because I thought it had been 2-3 donations it be likely that I had an elevated saturation.In the case it is a iron saturation issue, do you know what the likely solution or treatment is?

Also do you have. to wait a full 6 weeks every-time you change your dose to get an accurate reading? I just dropped the dose to 100 this last week. I pin 3 days a week, M,W,F if that makes a difference. Clinic said higher frequency would likely lead to less hematocrit spikes.


@Jdoe32

Yeah theres quiet a few things I found online that could be contributing to high SHBG that don't require a medical intervention. I'll list some of it out below, some was supported by research articles, some by bro science.

- Severe caloric restriction for extended periods of time can lead to increase in SHBG. (This was me)
- Lack of carbs, make sure you are eating 200g of carbs. (somtimes more depending on your activity level)
- Low protein diets can lead to high SHBG, make sure you get .75g per lb at least.
- Thyroid issues, make sure you get TSH, Free T3 and T4 checked
- High levels of cortisol can lead to increase SHBG. This means stress, lack of sleep, and or too much caffeine.
- Overtraining - if you train too much can cause high SHBG.Usually you can tell if you are if you have shitty RHR, unusually high BP, and low HRV. You'll probably be exhausted for no reason even when getting some rest, your hair might fall out, your thyroid levels will become depressed along with an inability to sleep properly. (this was me for a while)
- Check liver function, also check for NAFLD which has to be sussed out by an ultra sound.
- Check your iron, ferritin, TIBC, and TSAT. You can either have too high of iron levels or have too high of a saturation causing issues with the liver.
- Make sure your selenium, magnesium, copper and zinc levels are in line.
- Look into your basic vitamins to make sure there is no deficiency, A,B's,C,D,K etc.
-Boron deficiency can lead to an increase in SHBG as well.
- Jin23 also mentioned having poor gut health can lead to oxidation issues in the liver so make sure you aren't eating dog shit, it's similar vein to the NAFLD issue I think.

That should cover most of what I found as I remember it. If I remember any stragglers, I'll add them. Hope that helps.

That helps quite a lot, thank you. Some of them i already ruled out, I’ll check out the ones that remains. I already made an appointment for liver ultrasound in a few weeks and after that do the rest. Funny enough, no matter what is causing it, I didn‘t found any mentions of fixing SHBG without starting TRT, proviron or others. I mean I still want to read that post that say “I had no libido due to high SHBG, but I fixed my vit K deficiency, SHBG got down, and I’m ok without needing TRT or something else” lol. I’m at that point where I don’t even know if my problem it’s from this issue, I’m just testing waters. I do have high SHBG, but I was told that I have normal hormone levels so I shouldn’t be feeling the way I do based on my levels alone. Thanks for the help, keep us posted with your evolution.

 

[Alyk89]

That helps quite a lot, thank you. Some of them i already ruled out, I’ll check out the ones that remains. I already made an appointment for liver ultrasound in a few weeks and after that do the rest. Funny enough, no matter what is causing it, I didn‘t found any mentions of fixing SHBG without starting TRT, proviron or others. I mean I still want to read that post that say “I had no libido due to high SHBG, but I fixed my vit K deficiency, SHBG got down, and I’m ok without needing TRT or something else” lol. I’m at that point where I don’t even know if my problem it’s from this issue, I’m just testing waters. I do have high SHBG, but I was told that I have normal hormone levels so I shouldn’t be feeling the way I do based on my levels alone. Thanks for the help, keep us posted with your evolution.

I mean I don’t know what your symptoms are but testosterone is not the only thing that controls how you feel.

Thyroid
Adrenal glands
Growth hormone

All have a big part in how you feel. Forgot to mention adrenal gland issues can impact SHBG too.

If it makes you feel any better I did see some folks in different forums that resolved their issues with SHBG without drugs. Most of them had either iron issues or diet. A couple of carnivore and keto folks had elevated levels due to the lack of carbs. One or two people who were underrating saw positive movement as well. I think I’ve seen like 3-4 video bloggers with iron issues wether they were using cast iron pans or had hemacromotosis.

I hear you though it can be pretty frustrating. A lot of the time doctors don’t really want to put in any effort to help identify the root cause.

 

[Jdoe32]

I mean I don’t know what your symptoms are but testosterone is not the only thing that controls how you feel.

Thyroid
Adrenal glands
Growth hormone

All have a big part in how you feel. Forgot to mention adrenal gland issues can impact SHBG too.

Low to no libido, depression, anxiety, no energy or motivation, brain fog, ED…you name it. High SHBG and low DHEA (normal DHEA-S tho) are the only ones that are off limits. The others are ok, with some low normal, high normal, it depends, but still in limits and oscillating. Thyroid markers ok, GH ok, cortisol ok (both serum and from 24 h urine), acth ok, I don’t know what else could I test for adrenal issues. I do have a thread posted if you want to take a look.

 

[Jin23]

Low to no libido, depression, anxiety, no energy or motivation, brain fog, ED…you name it. High SHBG and low DHEA (normal DHEA-S tho) are the only ones that are off limits. The others are ok, with some low normal, high normal, it depends, but still in limits and oscillating. Thyroid markers ok, GH ok, cortisol ok (both serum and from 24 h urine), acth ok, I don’t know what else could I test for adrenal issues. I do have a thread posted if you want to take a look.

I'd suggest trying saffron. Look for a supplement containing Affron ®, take 30mg pre bed, and when it becomes stimulating, start taking it in the am.

 

[Jdoe32]

I'd suggest trying saffron. Look for a supplement containing Affron ®, take 30mg pre bed, and when it becomes stimulating, start taking it in the am.

Thx. Saffron for low T symptoms? How that work?

 

[Jin23]

Thx. Saffron for low T symptoms? How that work?

Saffron is effective for PSSD (which I presume you have), it's great for libido - really strong, and it's an antidepressant in it's own right, besides being an NRF2 inducer. Do some research. Examine.com, check user feedback on reddit, etc. I have shbg at around 85 and saffron is just wild for libido. Waking up throughout all the night with night wood to the point it's annoying (dose dependent off course).

 

[Jdoe32]

Saffron is effective for PSSD (which I presume you have), it's great for libido - really strong, and it's an antidepressant in it's own right, besides being an NRF2 inducer. Do some research. Examine.com, check user feedback on reddit, etc. I have shbg at around 85 and saffron is just wild for libido. Waking up throughout all the night with night wood to the point it's annoying (dose dependent off course).

I see. Thank you for that informations. I will read more. I had moments where I also thought of having PSSD, but this thing started way before getting on SSRI. I actually ended getting SSRI because of this problems. And as far as I know, one of the main conditions for PSSD diagnosis is not having the symptoms BEFORE starting ssri, which is not my case. Anyway, tricky. Thank you for your feedback on saffron also. Are you also on TRT or something else?