I don't want to get off

[GuerillaPete]

I think he is trolling us .

 

[Jin23]

I think he is trolling us .

No, not trolling, he is daft. There were so many conversations with this man, but he is blind in hearing anything besides his already formed opinions and intentions.

Also, the tests he is performing are not adequate to make any sound judgements on ones health after such a long time of cycling. HDL, LDL, and hematocrit...? Are you kidding?

 

[Evom1]

No, not trolling, he is daft. There were so many conversations with this man, but he is blind in hearing anything besides his already formed opinions and intentions.

Also, the tests he is performing are not adequate to make any sound judgements on ones health after such a long time of cycling. HDL, LDL, and hematocrit...? Are you kidding?

100%

 

[Rido]

No, not trolling, he is daft. There were so many conversations with this man, but he is blind in hearing anything besides his already formed opinions and intentions.

Also, the tests he is performing are not adequate to make any sound judgements on ones health after such a long time of cycling. HDL, LDL, and hematocrit...? Are you kidding?

Agreed.

There are people who wanna permablast, whatever. They know the risks. Do what they want with their life, etc.


OP was at one point spitting shit out, talking about harm reduction, picking ideal compounds. And then he says he is having a month between cycles. He keeps going cause bloods are fine. Just pure delusional.

Posting victor black multiple times. At the same time he is permablasting. Says health markers are within normal limits... It's like uhh? Missed so many that cannot be tested by blood.

Clearly out of his mind and he would repeatedly say "logically"

can only think logically if you are well versed in the background of AAS and health....

 

[GuerillaPete]

Im going to speak to him in a language i know he understands

View: https://youtu.be/jNFOKDTmGN4

 

[lukiss96]

I was thinking to myself whether I'm abusing or not cruising on
250-300mg testosterone...

Now, I know the answer.

 

[Jin23]

I was thinking to myself whether I'm abusing or not cruising on
250-300mg testosterone...

Now, I know the answer.

You know, there is one debate, which is about androgens and their physiological impact on the body and organs. And that includes the brain, although it's seldom disregarded on aas forums (which are btw, very pro aas use, they are far from neutral). But the other debate is the androgens influence on your state of mind and being.

High androgens are simply a very specific, goal oriented, state of mind and consciousness to be in. Goal oriented, externally oriented, specifically. And the higher you go, the more you are transformed in to a machine that is driven towards a certain end point. You are in a race, a battle, to get there, to win. This dislodges you from being in touch with your self, from being mindful, present, cognitively flexible, etc. So it's obvious how androgens can be used to escape one self, no? And in this regard, they for sure are used in pathological ways, which includes; escaping trauma, escaping bad self image, filling in the big hole you call self worth, etc. And it's easy to not even be mindful of this characteristics that aas have, if you were never mindful, present, in the first place. But that doesn't mean you aren't using this drugs for their effects on your mind.

I hope you see where I was getting at. Being in a high androgen environment all the time is being in a very specific mind state, which will shape your life, the decisions you make, etc.

If I was going for a b&c protocol, I'd stick to normal physiological ranges of test, like 700 ng/dl, with free T in range, and would actually try to add to that SARMS, like LGD or Mk2866 or what's it called. Anything that is more selective towards AR's in the muscle opposed to AR's in the brain. SARMs are selective, but at lower dosages. At higher dosages they start becoming more unselective. And this is really missed by the AAS community. They probably (can't say anything definite here) are useful at keeping the androgen load on the brain to a minimum, while helping you retain a good amount of muscle tissue on the body. But ofc, you can forget looking like a monster on such a protocol. But honestly, there is just no way of doing that in a healthy way anyway ...

However, you are using test u right? And if memory serves, you don't metabolize aas that efficiently, so 300mg probably gets you around 1500, with free T 2x above range? I mean, it's still a mini cycle and you should drop down to physiological levels, but it's not as high as it seems ... 300 would net me 3000 ngdl ...

 

[Jin23]

What I noticed on my self is; the longer you use androgens, the longer you are disregarding your inner world and as time goes by, you start to loose it completely, to the point, you are probably scoffing at the words "inner world", as some mumbo jumbo. At this point, you probably can't even imagine being without aas, as you are so reliant on them for you basic mental and personality structure. And the longer you are on it, the more psychological damage you are accruing which is going to take a lot of therapy and cognition work to get back to healthy.

This is imo the most important message to this "I don't want to get off" debate.

 

[lukiss96]

Jin, you're right on many things and I agree with you. If I could turn back time, man I would never touch steroids at all. I did hold myself for as long as I could until my results as a natural were only getting fatter for no real benefit, I couldn't gain more and the pressure to become muscular got me in to steroids. As if natural wasn't enough I was 200 pounds at about 12% and to a lot of people I looked good, but not to myself. I'm sure we have our own reasons to jump on and stay on. You were on for some time too, but decided to say fuck it and you did what most couldn't, congrats as I said before, you iron will power and mentally you're very strong person. I'm happy for you.

You're right I'm not that good responder to steroids or testosterone and yes you're dead right 300mg puts me 1566ng/dll. It is unhealthy and it is for me to feel enhanced and the minimum for that is 200mg/week. I feel like I went in too deep already for me to do a real trt. I still want to have that advantage of being enhanced. There is a fine line like you say when mentally it becomes damaging and probably even 250-300mg does that, but I noticed if I'm only on testosterone and don't go over 500mg/week I'm friendly human being and I have emotions and all that normal communication skills, but if I add in synthetics (derivatives) I start to feel like you call it a machine, yeah then it becomes eat, lift, sleep, repeat and it's not good.

So in the end I try to keep balance on this, I want to still be enhanced, but I try to take minimum amount (for me) to get the desired effect and not suffering a lot of side effects while being reasonably comfortable to stay on it long term. No, I don't plan to do this my whole life of course, perhaps in a few years I'll change my mindset and keep testosterone 800-1000ng/dl or something. For now since it suits my lifestyle and health is good, I can allow myself to do this and it benefits me in some ways, but when I no longer will be ale to do it comfortably I'll definitely "refine" myself and my protocol.

 

[Jin23]

Jin, you're right on many things and I agree with you. If I could turn back time, man I would never touch steroids at all. I did hold myself for as long as I could until my results as a natural were only getting fatter for no real benefit, I couldn't gain more and the pressure to become muscular got me in to steroids. As if natural wasn't enough I was 200 pounds at about 12% and to a lot of people I looked good, but not to myself. I'm sure we have our own reasons to jump on and stay on. You were on for some time too, but decided to say fuck it and you did what most couldn't, congrats as I said before, you iron will power and mentally you're very strong person. I'm happy for you.

You're right I'm not that good responder to steroids or testosterone and yes you're dead right 300mg puts me 1566ng/dll. It is unhealthy and it is for me to feel enhanced and the minimum for that is 200mg/week. I feel like I went in too deep already for me to do a real trt. I still want to have that advantage of being enhanced. There is a fine line like you say when mentally it becomes damaging and probably even 250-300mg does that, but I noticed if I'm only on testosterone and don't go over 500mg/week I'm friendly human being and I have emotions and all that normal communication skills, but if I add in synthetics (derivatives) I start to feel like you call it a machine, yeah then it becomes eat, lift, sleep, repeat and it's not good.

So in the end I try to keep balance on this, I want to still be enhanced, but I try to take minimum amount (for me) to get the desired effect and not suffering a lot of side effects while being reasonably comfortable to stay on it long term. No, I don't plan to do this my whole life of course, perhaps in a few years I'll change my mindset and keep testosterone 800-1000ng/dl or something. For now since it suits my lifestyle and health is good, I can allow myself to do this and it benefits me in some ways, but when I no longer will be ale to do it comfortably I'll definitely "refine" myself and my protocol.

Yes, we all need different levels of drugs to respond in the same manner. Maybe 900 ngdl does to me what 1500 does to you. In the end we all decide for ourself's what dosage suits us best, or what dosage feels healthy in regards to mental health. What I've found out is that being mid range, in terms of free T, is what gives me the most inner peace and is where I'm able to meditate the best. Going closer to upper range and I become more impulsive, harder to calm down and just be mindful. But I'm adhd and have problems with to high sub cortical (with concomitant low cortical) dopamine levels as is, and androgens just elevate it to much, making a mess out of me. So, the lower the androgen levels, the healthier, more calm, I am. But not to low, as then I start becoming depressed. Which is actually what I think is happening atm, as my libido is non-existent, need to check bloods, probably haven't recovered properly. But I digress ... Everybody needs to find the levels where they function the best on their own, but for general day to day functioning, this certainly wont be much above the natural limits.

Now, if I had just had to get some shit done, like go to war, or just some intense physical labour that needs some heavy ass mental fortitude and stamina, a higher aas dose might be a good thing. But again, this is situational, aas are a tool, a means to an end, not something you're on all the time. It might be suitable for a certain time period of your life, like it is to you at this moment, but then, let it pass, step up on to the next part of your life. Don't let your self get stuck on level 3 for eternity, it's just level 3, there are infinite levels to go : )

 

[Sustanation79]

I will admit that logically I should get off soon, go back to a "TRT" dose, but I won't; my TRT dose is 200mg of cyp, which isn't even TRT, and puts me over 1000.

I've been on for a while now; taking only a month or so between cycles, since literally last year, when I did my 1 gram of Deca only for 12 weeks; after that, I went like few weeks, then started Test/Tren E/Primo. 15 weeks into that, I dropped the Tren E, and switched to Anavar 50mg ed. I'm currently still on the Test/Primo/Var since my cutting cycle started in Feb!

I've been taking 5iu of GH ED since last year, and I recently bumped it up to 10ius about 20 days ago.

I don't care to take bloods, because it wouldn't stop me anyway, and I only do so when its my time to go to get a yearly check up. And when I did take my bloods, they weren't bad at all, few things like AST and Hemocrit 51% elevated but nothing crazy. In fact, a year prior, I ran a low-dose of Cyp 200 / Tren E 200 for six months straight, and I only took a month off, and my bloods were normal after. My EKG and everything was literally perfect.

I don't get high blood pressure from any drug, while on; I don't feel like shit; I don't get any of the sides most people complain about, even from Tren. I feel like I'm one of those people who are very side-effect resistant. The only drug that I got noticeable shit from was anadrol, which gave me acid reflux that was annoying. I stopped that 17 days in because it was not allowing me to eat the calories I needed to bulk.

Point is, since I am on TRT for life, I see no reason why to stop, even if it is to return to "normal" levels of whatever blood markers. What is the point really, if I'm just gonna blast again in another month; even if I took two or three months off, how does that help? It's not like a month or so will undo all the damage being done to my organs, if any. And like I said, my bloods come back perfect, so where is this damage that supposed to be harming me? This makes me think pros are taking 100x more than we do, as they are literally walking around with high blood pressure for years, and having shitty bloodwork the whole time.

Why couldn't I just drop all gear and return to Cyp only, but at 600mg to maintain what I built? There was a study showing that men taking 600mg had literally no negative sides at all. In fact, Milos runs 500mg for 20+ years as his "TRT" based on this very study. I just feel that gaining size, then going to TRT for a month just doesn't make any sense; if the drugs are fucking your bloodwork up badly, you shouldn't be taking those drugs at all, and you should find drugs that don't.

Am I addicted to these drugs or am I just not seeing the point? There is not one pro who has taken off gear and retained anything he's built; not one. All these guys coming out like Seth Feroce or Lee Preist claiming they are on TRT only are full of shit: Look at Dorian, Arnold, Haney, Ronnie, and everyone else running TRT, how much they shrunk. So why would we want to blast and cruise, to gain and shrink, on and off? Isn't that retarded or what? Why not just stay on until you're done taking them all together?

You’re an idiot, hope this helps as nothing else will until reality presents itself to you in its truest form.

 

[Jin23]

This falsprophet ain't nuthin really. Ya'll should look at this fuck up:

diary of a young bodybuilder (20 years old)

In reality. I don’t even know about my pancreas it was a speculation but since I stop tren e, I feel better. So maybe it was because of this shit It's because you stopped insulin mabye? Tren as you said you are still using it

thinksteroids.com

So many addicts, delusional people in this thing it ain't even funny.

 

[Big_paul]

I will admit that logically I should get off soon, go back to a "TRT" dose, but I won't; my TRT dose is 200mg of cyp, which isn't even TRT, and puts me over 1000.

I've been on for a while now; taking only a month or so between cycles, since literally last year, when I did my 1 gram of Deca only for 12 weeks; after that, I went like few weeks, then started Test/Tren E/Primo. 15 weeks into that, I dropped the Tren E, and switched to Anavar 50mg ed. I'm currently still on the Test/Primo/Var since my cutting cycle started in Feb!

I've been taking 5iu of GH ED since last year, and I recently bumped it up to 10ius about 20 days ago.

I don't care to take bloods, because it wouldn't stop me anyway, and I only do so when its my time to go to get a yearly check up. And when I did take my bloods, they weren't bad at all, few things like AST and Hemocrit 51% elevated but nothing crazy. In fact, a year prior, I ran a low-dose of Cyp 200 / Tren E 200 for six months straight, and I only took a month off, and my bloods were normal after. My EKG and everything was literally perfect.

I don't get high blood pressure from any drug, while on; I don't feel like shit; I don't get any of the sides most people complain about, even from Tren. I feel like I'm one of those people who are very side-effect resistant. The only drug that I got noticeable shit from was anadrol, which gave me acid reflux that was annoying. I stopped that 17 days in because it was not allowing me to eat the calories I needed to bulk.

Point is, since I am on TRT for life, I see no reason why to stop, even if it is to return to "normal" levels of whatever blood markers. What is the point really, if I'm just gonna blast again in another month; even if I took two or three months off, how does that help? It's not like a month or so will undo all the damage being done to my organs, if any. And like I said, my bloods come back perfect, so where is this damage that supposed to be harming me? This makes me think pros are taking 100x more than we do, as they are literally walking around with high blood pressure for years, and having shitty bloodwork the whole time.

Why couldn't I just drop all gear and return to Cyp only, but at 600mg to maintain what I built? There was a study showing that men taking 600mg had literally no negative sides at all. In fact, Milos runs 500mg for 20+ years as his "TRT" based on this very study. I just feel that gaining size, then going to TRT for a month just doesn't make any sense; if the drugs are fucking your bloodwork up badly, you shouldn't be taking those drugs at all, and you should find drugs that don't.

Am I addicted to these drugs or am I just not seeing the point? There is not one pro who has taken off gear and retained anything he's built; not one. All these guys coming out like Seth Feroce or Lee Preist claiming they are on TRT only are full of shit: Look at Dorian, Arnold, Haney, Ronnie, and everyone else running TRT, how much they shrunk. So why would we want to blast and cruise, to gain and shrink, on and off? Isn't that retarded or what? Why not just stay on until you're done taking them all together?

Blast and cruise is the more sustainable way. At what point you begin to listen to the advice of medical professionals is up to you.

 

[Country Club Hero]

What I noticed on my self is; the longer you use androgens, the longer you are disregarding your inner world and as time goes by, you start to loose it completely, to the point, you are probably scoffing at the words "inner world", as some mumbo jumbo. At this point, you probably can't even imagine being without aas, as you are so reliant on them for you basic mental and personality structure. And the longer you are on it, the more psychological damage you are accruing which is going to take a lot of therapy and cognition work to get back to healthy.

This is imo the most important message to this "I don't want to get off" debate.

You are dead on sir and something I wish I would have known earlier. I didn’t even perma blast but ran the same toxic stuff every blast. I guess just spending more time in that androgen buzzed state than out of it made my brain stay that way. For like 8 years. I didn’t even realize the difference in the two brain states until I dropped down to daily micro doses for a substantial period of time. So it’s neat to read someone actually explain it well.

 

[malfeasance]

This is my current blood work on week 6 or 7 of my 400 cyp, 400, deca, 400 primo cycle, with 5ius ED.

I posted it in another thread I'm still getting notifications on this one, might as well post it here, also.View attachment 175045View attachment 175044
I started taking DIM last week to lower E levels, as I don't want to take serms or AIs.

Blood pressure was normal when taken the morning of this test.

And this cycle was right off of a 400mg cyp cruise for 6 weeks. I've been "on" doing various blasts and cruises, since Nov of last Jan 2021.

Currently 254lbs, eating 5k calories a day. I'm going to continue bulking until my coach and I decide its time to hold for two months, then cut next spring. I may reach 260-70 at the rate I'm going, and my fat hasn't been too bad. Once I'm done cutting and finally reach my end goal, then it will be a maintenance phase for life, ending the perma-blasting.

Your cholesterol is really screwed up.

That is true for all of us, when "on," but we take breaks and get it back to normal.