Lab Max Alternative

[dredd09]

Exactly.
I think the remaining percentage in a lot of cases is a select solvent. Dcm , ether, could be formaldehyde. Any other thoughts?

 

[Drayen]

Could also be the purity of the acid as well. Not saying there isn't something else added either.
Wikipedia says that concentrated H2SO4 is 98%.
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sulfuric_acid#Grades_of_sulfuric_acid)
Marquis is H2SO4 and formaldehyde, Mandelin is H2SO4 and ammonium metavanadate. So it's possible the remainder is the added chemical(and maybe water)

The big question in my mind is what's the difference between vial A and B.
Possibly, one could be straight H2SO4 and the other is marquis. I have no proof of this, it's just a theory I've had.

 

[GothamGear]

I used to work with Hydrochloric, Boric, Caustic, Sulfuric and nitric acid everyday the only one Id be concerned with is Nitric the rest cause slight irritation and mild chemical burns. But Nitric on the other hand I used to throw pennies in a cup of it to show the new guy why they were to stay the fuck away from that tank, if youre wondering what happens to the pennies, they dance and boil at the top of the jar and turn into orangeish smoke and puff they disappear

 

[jackthegripper2]

So If I wanted to burn a body in acid, what kind of acid would I use? ;]

Has anyone found a LM alternative. at 17$ a test this shit does add up pretty fast. Its gotta be 10X cheaper to buy the kit.

 

[GothamGear]

So If I wanted to burn a body in acid, what kind of acid would I use? ;]

Has anyone found a LM alternative. at 17$ a test this shit does add up pretty fast. Its gotta be 10X cheaper to buy the kit.

I used to threaten my ex with nitric acid bath and then put her bones in an industry ultrasonic machine (which I believe my boss lied to about its ability to disintegrate bones but he was a sick fuck so idk) then I planned on using the disintegrated bone fragments to make a sculpture of her to give her mother... But I think that's a little off subject.
I think the alternative lm will not only be cost effective be more accurate as we'd have the ability to cater different test for different compounds not a broad range of compounds with one test

 

[Kinikuman]

Could also be the purity of the acid as well. Not saying there isn't something else added either.
Wikipedia says that concentrated H2SO4 is 98%.
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sulfuric_acid#Grades_of_sulfuric_acid)
Marquis is H2SO4 and formaldehyde, Mandelin is H2SO4 and ammonium metavanadate. So it's possible the remainder is the added chemical(and maybe water)

The big question in my mind is what's the difference between vial A and B.
Possibly, one could be straight H2SO4 and the other is marquis. I have no proof of this, it's just a theory I've had.

So, who will be the first to begin putting some of these theories to the test? We can postulate forever. Somebody needs to start running experiments. C'mon boys, this can't be such a tough nut to crack...

 

[GothamGear]

I'll put a shopping list together and current compounds I can test will be test e, test p, test cyp, tren ace( 2 different powder sources) trne, tne ( 2 sources) dbol and masteron prop also willing to ship sample vials (2-5ml) of various compounds

 

[GothamGear]

I'll put a shopping list together and current compounds I can test will be test e, test p, test cyp, tren ace( 2 different powder sources) trne, tne ( 2 sources) dbol and masteron prop also willing to ship sample vials (2-5ml) of various compounds

Samples will be sent to member involved in this thread with intention of testing only

 

[dredd09]

Id say start with the mecke and marquis and test two known compounds with each. The key will be using known compounds as a control, and looking for indicators. Ill do some more research on possible solvents as well.

 

[dredd09]

http://www.mmcinter.com/downloads/downloads/Steroid%20Substances%20ID%20Case-1.pdf
steroid test A: Sulphuric acid 90-97%
steroid test B: Sulphuric acid 90-97%
stanozolol oxandralone test sulphuric acid 90-97%

(http://www.mmcinter.com/downloads/)

Now that's out in the open, we just have to figure out what the remaining 3-10% is. Those who think acids are scary and simply destroy a chemical with nothing useful coming about of it, can and should sit off to the side while the grown ups talk.

I got a laugh out of the
"you can also argue to by a chicken and have your own eggs or just make your own car from parts on ebay or just bake your own bread
why the fuck did you buy furniture just pick up some nails and wood in the forest."
comment.

A more accurate statement would be "you could buy a ready made protein shake, or you could add powder to milk" or "you could buy a sandwich, or you can add some meat to bread"

Intelligent discussion......and GO!

From the msds it appears "test a" is nothing more than h2so4 and water would be the remaining percentage, i do believe.

 

[Drayen]

From the msds it appears "test a" is nothing more than h2so4 and water would be the remaining percentage, i do believe.

How did you figure that out comparing the MSDS of test A and B? I read both of them and they seemed exactly the same. I'm wondering what I missed...

 

[dredd09]

Test b warns of blindness risk, which is a common warning for methanol. Maybe a small amount of methanol is the difference between tests. I'm thinking one is just acid, the other is acid ..plus.

 

[dredd09]

The other tests list other ingredients though and there percentages. If it was something other than water, wouldn't it need to be listed for safety?

 

[Drayen]

H2SO4 could do a good job causing blindness on it's own though. You've got me thinking and re-reading them side by side...
The biggest(or only) difference I've found is
test A;

2.1 Classification of the substance or mixture
Classification according to Regulation (EC) No 1272/2008 [EU-GHS/CLP]
Skin corrosion (Category 1A), H314
Acute toxicity, Inhalation (Category 4)
Acute toxicity, Oral (Category 4)
Acute aquatic toxicity (Category 1)
Classification according to EU Directives 67/548/EEC or 1999/45/EC
C Corrosive R35
Very toxic to aquatic organisms. Harmful by inhalation and if swallowed.
2.2 Label elements
Labelling according Regulation (EC) No 1272/2008 [CLP]
Hazard statement(s)
H302 Harmful if swallowed.
H314 Causes severe skin burns and eye damage.
H332 Harmful if inhaled.
H400 Very toxic to aquatic life
Precautionary statement(s)
P273 Avoid release to the environment.
P280 Wear protective gloves/ protective clothing/
eye protection/ face protection.
P310 IF SWALLOWED: Immediately call a POISON CENT
ER or doctor/ physician.
P305 + P351 + P338 IF IN EYES: Rinse cautiously with water for several minutes. Remove contact lenses, if present and easy to do. Continuerinsing.
Supplemental Hazard Statements
R-phrase(s)
R20/22 Harmful by inhalation and if swallowed.
R50 Very toxic to aquatic organisms.
S-phrase(s)
S24/25 Avoid contact with skin and eyes.
S61 Avoid release to the environment. Refer to special instructions/ Safety data sheets

Test B
2.1 Classification of the substance or mixture
Classification according to Regulation (EC) No 1272/2008 [EU-GHS/CLP]
Skin corrosion (Category 1A), H314
Classification according to EU Directives 67/548/EEC or 1999/45/EC
C Corrosive R35
2.2 Label elements
Labelling according Regulation (EC) No 1272/2008 [CLP]
Hazard statement(s)
H314 Causes severe skin burns and eye damage.
Precautionary statement(s)
P280 Wear protective gloves/ protective clothing/eye protection/ face protection.
P310 IF SWALLOWED: Immediately call a POISON CENTER or doctor/ physician.
P305 + P351 + P338 IF IN EYES: Rinse cautiously with water for several minutes. Remove contact lenses, if present and easy to do. Continue rinsing.
Supplemental Hazard Statements
None

So what's in the vial A that's more dangerous to aquatic life then what's in vial B...
Also found a little tidbit on the marquis reagent on wikipedia
"Methanol may be added to slow down the reaction process to allow better observation of the colour change. This is done by slowing down the polymerisation process."
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marquis_reagent)

 

[GothamGear]

The other tests list other ingredients though and there percentages. If it was something other than water, wouldn't it need to be listed for safety?

I believe whatever is the remaining substance in vail a and b is protected under the trade secret clause of the msds

 

[dredd09]

I don't think Hazardous materials are protected under trade secret though batman. And drayen, i read the same thing about using methanol to slow the reaction. I think this is enough to begin experimenting a bit

 

[bdg77]

That mecke reagent is some very nasty stuff. I have some that's over 10 years old. It came in a glass bottle with a special tip making a drop take a really long time to come out. The bottle has a heavy duty cap. This bottle comes in another plastic container. I keep these smaller plastic containers in a larger plastic container with tape around the lid. When I first got it the label on bottle was red. After a few years it started turning black and now is just pure flat black. That's how nasty it is. I have no idea how this happened. The lid was on tight, every precaution taken, upright position. It's like uncontainable or something.

 

[bdg77]

But regarding the reagents that are available. I've used the dance safe color bar instructions that came with the kit to check a decent amount of pills for various things. The first step involves the mecke reagent. You basically want to scrape as tiny of a sample off the pill as possible. Like just enough so that you can see it without magnification. The mecke will show you the presence of extasy, dxm and 2ct-7. It does this by changing color. The colors are shown on a scale from 0-20 and the concentration can cause a big difference. It's watching the color change that's important. Not just the end result. The end result for x and 2ct-7 are very close. One's dark blue the other dark purple. However x goes from dark green to dark blue and the 2ct starts orange and ends up dark purple. So observing the change is important almost more so than the end result. If you didn't notice the orange at beginning of reaction you could end thinking you have a different result. The second test involves simon's reagent which for some reason is in two different bottles. You only proceed to this test if the mecke test indicated a positive for "E". This test differenciates mdma from mda. You take another tiny sample add a drop from bottle one, not much happens. The reagent is a dull green color. Then you add a drop from bottle two. If it turns purple it is mdma or mde if not just mda. The last test involves the Marquis reagent. With a tiny crumb you add a drop and you get a color change. Dark purple is mdma, speed turns orange and 2c-b turns lime green. It's a very simple test actually. The important part in having the color change bar there for reference. I apologize for mentioning a recreational drug and have no interest in them what-so-ever. Just giving some info on how these reagent tests work. I may have tested 5-10 different pills over 10 years ago. And in case you wondering every one passed every test with flying colors. Went right to the strongest possible color. These we're all very well made "designer" tabs. I woulding even thing about touching powder or a generic looking pill. As far as E goes. Seems light street drugs are worthless garbage right now. At least in my neck of the woods. Except for the weed that is. That stuff has gotten too strong. They even have vape juice with cannibinoids in it. Saw it at a local head shop. I'll stick to very low nicotine vape juice myself. I don't know if this post is going to be of much help. But I think the key is going to be figuring out exactly what color these compounds will turn. Or colors in some cases as they might start one color and turn another over time. This is all visible light stuff. There's also the uv light test and figuring out if another ingredient is necessary to make it flourese.

 

[dredd09]

Anyone with samples tested this yet? To see any reaction?

 

[Sworder]

Bumping, good info.