Losing fat, building muscle - diet help?

[UpandDown]

Hi everyone,

This is my first post to the forums, and I'm getting lots out of all I've been reading. Here's my story.

Background:
Back in May, I was 225lb and in terrible shape. Started walking a few miles almost every day, started eating a little better, and dropped 20lb (and 2 pant sizes) in about 4 months. Yay!

A little under 2 months ago, I started working weights into my routine, and have really been ramping up - I used to lift a lot (used to = 10 years ago), but haven't touched a weight in years. My schedule doesn't allow me huge amounts of time to lift, but I get in at least half an hour 4 times a week. Usually 5 times a week. And I love it.

So, now I'm hooked. I'm pushing my workouts harder and I still walk. My goal is to lose the rest of this dang fat (I'm probably around 28% body fat right now, and I'd like to be down around 12%) and, of course, build up the muscle and strength.

My question:
I keep hearing that, to lose fat, you have to cut about 500 calories off your "maintenance" number of calories. Problem is, I'm also trying to build muscle, and I don't want to impede that process. I ran a nutrition calculator, and it came back with about 2700 calories a day - i'm way under that right now, and, traditionally having a hard time losing fat, and very leery of increasing.

The only supplements I'm on are whey protein (every day) and glutamine (most days, certainly on workout days). I have about 5 or 6 meals a day, but my calories per day are always under 2000. And, I know enough about nutrition that my calories are, for the most part, pretty good calories (ie, not too much fat, leaner proteins, etc.)

Lots of nutrition stuff I read is written by folks who call themselves "hard gainers," and I am certainly not one of those.

Can anyone give me some guidance? Do I really want to jack up my calories to 2700 or so and assume that the fat will take care of itself? Am I inhibiting my progress my not eating more? Or should I cut my calories even more? Is a protein/carb/fat ratio of 50/40/10 about right?

Any and all thoughts are _greatly_ appreciated!

Thanx!!!!

PS: Sorry my debut post is so wordy!

 

[Neodavid]

Most guys will tell you you can't build muscle and lose fat at the same time. But that's not been my experience.

The body is just a biochemical homeostatic machine. It will respond to changes you make by adapting to the environment you create for it. If it see's you need muscle, it will put it on. You slow down your progress in the weight strength department, but it's worth it if you want to get rid of the fat.

I can lose weight and gain muscle easily, especially if on a cycle of test.

First, building muscle will make you burn more calories. You may not have to cut down on your diet at all, if you just add in a bit more than a half hour, but cut back on the number of days you lift, and get in come biking or some kind of long term low level exercise (walking won't cut it). Are you lifing heavy enough to gain size?

One sure fire way to do it is to go on the Atkins diet. Cut carbs back to 20 a day, and eat tons of protien for most of your calories.

You definitely won't get as strong as fast as if you upped your calories, but this way you don't put on more fat either.

Or you can just do a cutting cycle, cutting the cals back, and really just stay where you are muscle wise, but lose the fat faster.

I can hear Bob Smith about to pipe up now, so I'll shut up. (he would probably not like my advice much)

I'd like to be down around 12%) and, of course, build up the muscle and strength.

My question:
I keep hearing that, to lose fat, you have to cut about 500 calories off your "maintenance" number of calories. Problem is, I'm also trying to build muscle, and I don't want to impede that process. I ran a nutrition calculator, and it came back with about 2700 calories a day - i'm way under that right now, and, traditionally having a hard time losing fat, and very leery of increasing.

Can anyone give me some guidance? Do I really want to jack up my calories to 2700 or so and assume that the fat will take care of itself? Am I inhibiting my progress my not eating more? Or should I cut my calories even more? Is a protein/carb/fat ratio of 50/40/10 about right?

Any and all thoughts are _greatly_ appreciated!

Thanx!!!!

PS: Sorry my debut post is so wordy!

 

[MANWHORE]

Most guys will tell you you can't build muscle and lose fat at the same time.

anyone who knows what they're talking about won't ... It will just take longer but i like the idea of gaining lean mass instead of trying to lose the fat later. i definitaly don't agree with the Atkins diet. you cut carbs to 20/day and you won't gain anything not to mention you will probably lose strength. Eating foods in the right combination is the key to building muscle and losing fat but not high protein low carbs

 

[kenneth]

okay.. correct me if i'm wrong, but you want to build muscle and burn fat, but primarily burn fat. your calories are below 2000 a day right now, and what I got out of your cardio is that "you still walk", unless I missed, I got that you lift 4 days a week but nothing more about cardio other than that you still walk. If I were you, at whereyou are, and wanting what you want, I would FOCUS hardcore on the fat burning part, and for now, just try and maintain what muscle you have. Trying to do both at the same time will be both frustrating and a much slower process. I'd spend the next 3 months burning off that bodyfat then concentrate on upp'ing your calories and building muscle once you're atleast halfway satisfied with what you look like..If I were you, I'd be doing cardio ATLEAST 5 days a week, and interval training is much better for maintaining muscle while burning fat then say going for a long walk or a distance run or a long jog or whatever,,these are my opinions, i'm sure you'll get more imput.

Ken

 

[Neodavid]

Huh, well, all I know is I did the atkins and while on juice I still made gains. I ate tons of protien and fat.

anyone who knows what they're talking about won't ... It will just take longer but i like the idea of gaining lean mass instead of trying to lose the fat later. i definitaly don't agree with the Atkins diet. you cut carbs to 20/day and you won't gain anything not to mention you will probably lose strength. Eating foods in the right combination is the key to building muscle and losing fat but not high protein low carbs

 

[MANWHORE]

Huh, well, all I know is I did the atkins and while on juice I still made gains. I ate tons of protien and fat.

key words .. "while on juice"

 

[UpandDown]

All, thanks for your input - I'm not crazy about the news, but I'm glad to get it straight. I'll focus on burning the fat for now and cutting up. Later, I'll bulk up with lean muscle. And that means, I gather, keeping my calories under 2000.

(Btw, when I say "I still walk," I should clarify. I walk at least 4 times a week, usually 6 times a week. Tonight, for instance, I walked my standard route: in just under an hour I walked about 3.5 miles, averaging 4mph - and the last 1.5 miles was up a steep hill. I know it's not an Ironman or anything, but it does keep the heart-rate up. I'll see what I can do about adding in some more, though.)

Also, to answer another question, when I lift, I lift very hard, and focus on just a few exercises with low rest periods. I cycle low-weight/high reps with high weight/low reps over the course of a couple of weeks. I also do a different core exercise everday, after the weights. Sundays are a rest day, but I don't really take a rest from my diet. Just the exercise.

 

[jth99]

obviously continue to workout and do cardio. up your grams of protein a day to 300 to 400. eat no more than 30 to 50 grams of carbs a day. give it time and your body will adapt. it will use the protein you are giving it to maintain and possibly build muscles. since you are doing cardio and watching your diet you will begin to shed the fat, especially the more lean muscle you put on your body.

 

[Neodavid]

That's a fast walk. Usually people kinda amble and wonder why they don't lose weight. You can tell by your breathing. Oxygen equals fat burning.

All, thanks for your input - I'm not crazy about the news, but I'm glad to get it straight. I'll focus on burning the fat for now and cutting up. Later, I'll bulk up with lean muscle. And that means, I gather, keeping my calories under 2000.

(Btw, when I say "I still walk," I should clarify. I walk at least 4 times a week, usually 6 times a week. Tonight, for instance, I walked my standard route: in just under an hour I walked about 3.5 miles, averaging 4mph - and the last 1.5 miles was up a steep hill. I know it's not an Ironman or anything, but it does keep the heart-rate up. I'll see what I can do about adding in some more, though.)

Also, to answer another question, when I lift, I lift very hard, and focus on just a few exercises with low rest periods. I cycle low-weight/high reps with high weight/low reps over the course of a couple of weeks. I also do a different core exercise everday, after the weights. Sundays are a rest day, but I don't really take a rest from my diet. Just the exercise.

 

[UpandDown]

That's a fast walk. Usually people kinda amble and wonder why they don't lose weight. You can tell by your breathing. Oxygen equals fat burning.

I used to average 3.5 mph, but I've been actively trying to increase my pace. I really can't walk with my wife anymore, because she thinks I'm psycho with the pace I shoot for. 4mph is my new benchmark, and believe me, I break quite a sweat - especially on the uphill part.

 

[axisys]

ya bro

eat a lot of calories... Do not ignore the law of thermo-D... eat in proportion to your weight and hit the cardio... look for 1 lb a week, it sucks waiting that long to get rid of the fat, but long term it will be worth it,...

k

 

[Neodavid]

I'm going to disagree and tell you why.

At 100 calories per mile, and 3500 calories per lb of body weight, he would have to run 35 miles a week to lose 1 pound.

Weightlifting uses about enough calories as you'd find in an apple.

The only other alternatives are diet, or upping the metabolism with something usually illegal.

My best advice is do the atkins, as he will get all the protien he needs, and will drop weight going into ketosis and only burning fat (rather than protien, which is the bodies prefered source of power after carbs are gone, while exercising and dieting the usual way).

eat a lot of calories... Do not ignore the law of thermo-D... eat in proportion to your weight and hit the cardio... look for 1 lb a week, it sucks waiting that long to get rid of the fat, but long term it will be worth it,...

k

 

[MANWHORE]

I'm going to disagree and tell you why.

At 100 calories per mile, and 3500 calories per lb of body weight, he would have to run 35 miles a week to lose 1 pound.

Weightlifting uses about enough calories as you'd find in an apple.

The only other alternatives are diet, or upping the metabolism with something usually illegal.

My best advice is do the atkins, as he will get all the protien he needs, and will drop weight going into ketosis and only burning fat (rather than protien, which is the bodies prefered source of power after carbs are gone, while exercising and dieting the usual way).

I don't like the idea of those Keto diets ... Get .. Burn the fat Feed the muscle by author Tom Venuto ... Eating the right portions of good fats,protein,and carbs you won't need Ketosis

 

[kenneth]

I'm going to disagree and tell you why.

At 100 calories per mile, and 3500 calories per lb of body weight, he would have to run 35 miles a week to lose 1 pound.

Weightlifting uses about enough calories as you'd find in an apple.

The only other alternatives are diet, or upping the metabolism with something usually illegal.

My best advice is do the atkins, as he will get all the protien he needs, and will drop weight going into ketosis and only burning fat (rather than protien, which is the bodies prefered source of power after carbs are gone, while exercising and dieting the usual way).

"At 100 calories per mile, and 3500 calories per lb of body weight, he would have to run 35 miles a week to lose 1 pound."

This is where I get confused, how can a statement like this be true? With all the different body types, metabolisms, speeds that you could run a mile, types of diets and supplements your using, I find it basically impossible to go by such a carved in stone rule. I know where you're coming from, I've found the same information before as well, but i don't thnk something could be so damn standard.

 

[Bod]

I don't like the idea of those Keto diets ... Get .. Burn the fat Feed the muscle by author Tom Venuto ... Eating the right portions of good fats,protein,and carbs you won't need Ketosis

I've looked in to buying this e-book before. Have you personally used it and did it work for you?

I won't get sucked in to testimonials provided on websites etc, but if you give a personal recommendation that the methods are good and do what they say they do, then I'm dedicated to try it and stick with it.

 

[MANWHORE]

I won't get sucked in to testimonials provided on websites etc,

I never saw the cover of the book and i never saw testimonials from people who have used it. I never even knew it existed until I downloaded it from limewire one day when i was looking for BBing stuff, it took a few days for me to finish reading it and i really liked it. It's not anything fancy like atkins. I would say most BBers already use a diet/diets very close to it.... It's 340 pages long and he goes into detail about how different foods effect Metabolism,
Metabolic individuality and your body type: Doing your best with what youve
got,
The law of calorie balance and the mathematics of losing body fat,
Secrets of meal frequency & timing: How to turbo charge your metabolism and
turn your body into a fat-burning machine ,
Macronutrient ratios: The optimal combination of protein, carbohydrates and fats
for improving your muscle to fat ratio ,
Good fats vs. bad fats: How to speed up fat loss, boost muscle growth, increase
energy and rev up your metabolism by eating the right fats in the right amounts at
the right times ,
Protein: The muscle builder and metabolic activator How much you really need ,
Clearing up carbohydrate confusion: Are carbohydrates your friends or foes? ,
: How to get as lean as a bodybuilder or fitness model using a new twist on the old
low carbohydrate diet ,
Why water is essential for fat loss, how much you need, and what else you
should (and shouldnt) drink ,

Supplements: What the supplement companies hope you never find out
Cardio training secrets for maximum fat loss: Why its better to burn the fat than
to starve the fat.
Weight training for fat loss: Why diet and cardio are not enough

 

[ricknash]

All, thanks for your input - I'm not crazy about the news, but I'm glad to get it straight. I'll focus on burning the fat for now and cutting up. Later, I'll bulk up with lean muscle. And that means, I gather, keeping my calories under 2000.

(Btw, when I say "I still walk," I should clarify. I walk at least 4 times a week, usually 6 times a week. Tonight, for instance, I walked my standard route: in just under an hour I walked about 3.5 miles, averaging 4mph - and the last 1.5 miles was up a steep hill. I know it's not an Ironman or anything, but it does keep the heart-rate up. I'll see what I can do about adding in some more, though.)

Also, to answer another question, when I lift, I lift very hard, and focus on just a few exercises with low rest periods. I cycle low-weight/high reps with high weight/low reps over the course of a couple of weeks. I also do a different core exercise everday, after the weights. Sundays are a rest day, but I don't really take a rest from my diet. Just the exercise.

do running/sprints man
u would not believe the results u get from running then doing balls out sprints for liek 20 seconds then going back to a run etc.
u will burn so much fat doing this while weight training and eating right man.