Old man tren update

[adrenalytic]

How does E at the dose feel compared to A. I've always wondered that?

I've never run ace but with longer esters you actually end up with higher serum levels of the api vs. a shorter ester. Someone did the math here a while back. I'll see if I can find it.

 

[RockyP]

I've never run ace but with longer esters you actually end up with higher serum levels of the api vs. a shorter ester. Someone did the math here a while back. I'll see if I can find it.

Correct. Depending on injection schedule the longer esters like hex and enanthate will linger for longer so you get more of a compounding effect of the api in terms of area under the curve. It’s a little confusing but while the “dosages” are comparable the total exposure to the drug is usually greater in the longer esters.

So when the guys from the 90s say they did 2 to 3 amps of tren hex per week, it’s not the same effect as 225 (or 228) mg of tren ace. In many ways, they really are totally different drugs. I’ve heard lots of stories of guys who tried to use an equivalent dosage of enan after using acetate, and they had terrible side effects, and it leads me to believe that this was because the longer Ester produced a greater total exposure to the tren, i.e. greater area under the curve, and their bodies were better able to handle the rapidly metabolized acetate, but could not handle an equivalent dosage of the enan.

So for anyone looking to try hex or enanthate, best to start with 50% of your acetate dosage and slowly work up.

 

[adrenalytic]

Correct. Depending on injection schedule the longer esters like hex and enanthate will linger for longer so you get more of a compounding effect of the api in terms of area under the curve. It’s a little confusing but while the “dosages” are comparable the total exposure to the drug is usually greater in the longer esters.

So when the guys from the 90s say they did 2 to 3 amps of tren hex per week, it’s not the same effect as 225 (or 228) mg of tren ace. In many ways, they really are totally different drugs. I’ve heard lots of stories of guys who tried to use an equivalent dosage of enan after using acetate, and they had terrible side effects, and it leads me to believe that this was because the longer Ester produced a greater total exposure to the tren, i.e. greater area under the curve, and their bodies were better able to handle the rapidly metabolized acetate, but could not handle an equivalent dosage of the enan.

So for anyone looking to try hex or enanthate, best to start with 50% of your acetate dosage and slowly work up.

Here's that math I was talking about. The whole thread is worth a read.

Trenbolone Acetate vs Enanthate: Doses Are Not Equivalent, With Examples

 

[Mfras]

Oh man I read that thread with great interest recently- my tren ace experiment I’m running right now made me feel like 1-200mg/week is pretty darn tolerable but tren ace is a lot of pinning! I grabbed a couple bottles of enanthate for possible future use.

What I learned in that thread is that people have a lot of opinions based on their understanding of the dosages and esters. I’m the opposite of an expert but the takeaway for me, the usable information, was that ace might be something like 10% stronger but if a pinning schedule appropriate to the ester release is used then the actual amount of tren available to circulate in your body is similar when talking about 2-3x/week E vs every day A. With the caveat that the A would hit like 10% harder and the E is a ride you can’t get off of because while once saturated the doses are similar but on the E you’ve built up a massive amount of tren that’s locked up in the ester which is gonna take it’s time running through you.

It’s hard to sort through the signal/noise on this topic, and I haven’t been on a respectable dose of Ace long enough to know if I’m going to be super happy I can clear it when problems happen or if I’ll know that something like a 110% dose of enanthate would have been comparable. I will say despite no problems yet I still fear and respect the compound enough that I’d only use like 75% to start if I chose to crack my E stash next year.

 

[nukklehead]

Great info. Never ran Tren but slightly interested in using it for a last sha bang. 56 y/o competitive powerlifter (bench only now) multi ply. Grew up in the days of no internet and only way to get gear was knowing a guy who knew a guy (etc.) who loaded up at a Mexican veterinary clinic and made it across the border. By the time it filtered down to me there wasn't much left. I was tickled to get 3 bottles of test and a bottle of D-bol etc. for a meet. My total gear usage over the years will say was on the moderate side. Largest cycle has been 750 test 400 Deca and whatever oral was available (Var, D-bol) a few weeks before the meet. I think I am going to hang up the old bench shirt after a meet in March. Kind of want to go out with a bang and push it for old times' sake. Already ramping up the test slowly and planning on totaling out at 1.2-1.5 gm by meet time. Deca will be at 500 by then and have Dbol on hand for last 6 weeks. Not interested in doing a lot of different compounds, sticking with what I have learned over the years with my body. I like the MWF injection schedule myself fwiw. If I got 10 mls of Tren any suggestions on how to squeeze that in the end of the cycle going into the meet? Would it make a strength difference at that low of dose and that short of time? Also any problems with Acetate mixing with the test and deca in the same syringe? Thanks

 

[bob357sig]

Great info. Never ran Tren but slightly interested in using it for a last sha bang. 56 y/o competitive powerlifter (bench only now) multi ply. Grew up in the days of no internet and only way to get gear was knowing a guy who knew a guy (etc.) who loaded up at a Mexican veterinary clinic and made it across the border. By the time it filtered down to me there wasn't much left. I was tickled to get 3 bottles of test and a bottle of D-bol etc. for a meet. My total gear usage over the years will say was on the moderate side. Largest cycle has been 750 test 400 Deca and whatever oral was available (Var, D-bol) a few weeks before the meet. I think I am going to hang up the old bench shirt after a meet in March. Kind of want to go out with a bang and push it for old times' sake. Already ramping up the test slowly and planning on totaling out at 1.2-1.5 gm by meet time. Deca will be at 500 by then and have Dbol on hand for last 6 weeks. Not interested in doing a lot of different compounds, sticking with what I have learned over the years with my body. I like the MWF injection schedule myself fwiw. If I got 10 mls of Tren any suggestions on how to squeeze that in the end of the cycle going into the meet? Would it make a strength difference at that low of dose and that short of time? Also any problems with Acetate mixing with the test and deca in the same syringe? Thanks

I don’t believe there is any issue with mixing in the tren A with the other oils. I have been mixing in low dose ( 30mg) with my Wednesday pin of test C and EQ. I have been experimenting with low dose tren A for 6 weeks now pinned MWF. My suggestion to utilize the 10 ml’s you have would be to pin either 50mg every day for the last 20 days leading up to the meet, or 100 mg pinned Every other day. I believe it will give you a strength boost you are looking for. I pin the tren A at about 4 AM before work, figuring it is fully in my system by 4 PM when im at the gym.

 

[RockyP]

Great info. Never ran Tren but slightly interested in using it for a last sha bang. 56 y/o competitive powerlifter (bench only now) multi ply. Grew up in the days of no internet and only way to get gear was knowing a guy who knew a guy (etc.) who loaded up at a Mexican veterinary clinic and made it across the border. By the time it filtered down to me there wasn't much left. I was tickled to get 3 bottles of test and a bottle of D-bol etc. for a meet. My total gear usage over the years will say was on the moderate side. Largest cycle has been 750 test 400 Deca and whatever oral was available (Var, D-bol) a few weeks before the meet. I think I am going to hang up the old bench shirt after a meet in March. Kind of want to go out with a bang and push it for old times' sake. Already ramping up the test slowly and planning on totaling out at 1.2-1.5 gm by meet time. Deca will be at 500 by then and have Dbol on hand for last 6 weeks. Not interested in doing a lot of different compounds, sticking with what I have learned over the years with my body. I like the MWF injection schedule myself fwiw. If I got 10 mls of Tren any suggestions on how to squeeze that in the end of the cycle going into the meet? Would it make a strength difference at that low of dose and that short of time? Also any problems with Acetate mixing with the test and deca in the same syringe? Thanks

No issues mixing Tren with other oils. As a general rule I don’t use more than one vial
Of Tren per cycle. In terms of pure strength gains, i would probably try to run it as high as you can for as short a time as you can. But if you’re not totally sure how you tolerate it that might be problematic. I think that with EOD dosing by day 10 you’d get full benefit from the dosage of acetate. If you’re feeling saucy you can add in Anadrol or halo (or both, but that’s a little nuts).

 

[nukklehead]

appreciate you guys input---cya at the MCL cafeteria

 

[RockyP]

Happy new year fellas.

Quick update it’s been around 10 days since coming off the tren. I had previously said side effects were essentially nil at up to 60 eod. Even tho my BP was normal on the tren, it’s even lower now that I’m off. So it does seem that it raises my BP slightly, about 5-10 points systolic. Also the very mild night sweats are now gone. Still not a bad deal for the results I got from it.

 

[Mfras]

Happy new year fellas.

Quick update it’s been around 10 days since coming off the tren. I had previously said side effects were essentially nil at up to 60 eod. Even tho my BP was normal on the tren, it’s even lower now that I’m off. So it does seem that it raises my BP slightly, about 5-10 points systolic. Also the very mild night sweats are now gone. Still not a bad deal for the results I got from it.

Nice. Do you experience the thing on tren where weight shoots up and stays there but after a few weeks or more you start looking way harder & leaner but at the same higher weight?

And now that you’re coming off, are you seeing weight go down along with some of the glycogen hardness?

 

[RockyP]

Nice. Do you experience the thing on tren where weight shoots up and stays there but after a few weeks or more you start looking way harder & leaner but at the same higher weight?

And now that you’re coming off, are you seeing weight go down along with some of the glycogen hardness?

I’ve been cutting the entire time so the weight has steadily fallen. Noticed a slight drop in fullness but that largely returned with using preworkout Anadrol. Hardness is the same / improving as bf continues to drop and I’m still using masteron

 

[Mfras]

I’ve been cutting the entire time so the weight has steadily fallen. Noticed a slight drop in fullness but that largely returned with using preworkout Anadrol. Hardness is the same / improving as bf continues to drop and I’m still using masteron

That’s awesome. Kinda wish I saw the scale go down for me but I’m sure it’ll settle when I’m off. I am wrapping up my run and still carrying the 5-7lbs that came on when I was doing 5-10mg/day, but even just above 15% the leaner harder look is peeking.

Been on the same deficit the whole run until the past few days so I *know* I lost fat even without the tren. Went back up to just under maintenance cals to support the end of the cycle and the rebound.

I learned a lot on my run but the biggest takeaway for me is that tren is most useful when already properly lean. Might try it again after I’m done cutting, do some healthy maintenance, and put on some more meat with a lean bulk on NPP followed by a mini cut.

 

[RockyP]

That’s awesome. Kinda wish I saw the scale go down for me but I’m sure it’ll settle when I’m off. I am wrapping up my run and still carrying the 5-7lbs that came on when I was doing 5-10mg/day, but even just above 15% the leaner harder look is peeking.

Been on the same deficit the whole run until the past few days so I *know* I lost fat even without the tren. Went back up to just under maintenance cals to support the end of the cycle and the rebound.

I learned a lot on my run but the biggest takeaway for me is that tren is most useful when already properly lean. Might try it again after I’m done cutting, do some healthy maintenance, and put on some more meat with a lean bulk on NPP followed by a mini cut.

When on tren I wouldn’t obsess over tbe scale. It can add tissue in a deficit and / or cause glycogen / water retention in the muscle while you lose fat, keeping the scale stagnant My coach is a retired open pro and he always said that when he prepped on Tren his weight would mostly stay the same but his appearance would change drastically.

 

[Mfras]

When on tren I wouldn’t obsess over tbe scale. It can add tissue in a deficit and / or cause glycogen / water retention in the muscle while you lose fat, keeping the scale stagnant My coach is a retired open pro and he always said that when he prepped on Tren his weight would mostly stay the same but his appearance would change drastically.

Yup I’m not worried about the total weight- the tren cycle is all bodyweight noise. Very curious what will come out in the wash after.