post bloodwork for HCG just alone

[master.on]

How many cycles have you been on and have you ever run Nolva and/or Clomid for PCT?

Like 10 cycles
I already lost track off them all
I only used Clomid once and didn't like it
Now I never use Nolva for pct, but use it to block Dbol estrogen
Now I always use HCG during cycle so it has prevented suppression for me.

 

[5millionbucks]

heres something thats interesting hopefully someone can chime in on this. This guy ran HCG on his last cycle(which was his 3rd) and now he has secondary hyponganadism from his 3rd cycle; all his other cycles he rebounded fine from it. His pituitary isn't functioning like it used to(his testes are fine) but his pituitary is fucked. I'm going to bring up this old thread but would like people to chime in. https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/hcg-and-hypothalmus-pituitary-shutdown.134274302/ If this is the risk of taking HCG on cycle I would say HCG seems like risky business regardless of what positive reviews people have on it.

 

[master.on]

heres something thats interesting hopefully someone can chime in on this. This guy ran HCG on his last cycle(which was his 3rd) and now he has secondary hyponganadism from his 3rd cycle; all his other cycles he rebounded fine from it. His pituitary isn't functioning like it used to(his testes are fine) but his pituitary is fucked. I'm going to bring up this old thread but would like people to chime in. https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/hcg-and-hypothalmus-pituitary-shutdown.134274302/ If this is the risk of taking HCG on cycle I would say HCG seems like risky business regardless of what positive reviews people have on it.

While HCG halts LH/FSH secretion in the pituitary, that's always temporary, always resets back to normal on stopping HCG.

 

[5millionbucks]

While HCG halts LH/FSH secretion in the pituitary, that's always temporary, always resets back to normal on stopping HCG.

thats what I was always told, but why did this dude all of a sudden get secondary hypogonadism on his 3rd cycle where he first started to run hcg on cycle? He said he recovered during his past two cycles without hcg with just pct after. But then his 3rd cycle he ran HCG with it and basically never recovered again; his testes were fine; but his pituitary has been fucked for life.

 

[Worf]

Could be more to that story. Traumatic Brain Injuries, street drugs, long term use of pain killers and or SSRI drugs are also known to cause Secondary Hypo Conditions

 

[Dr JIM]

Dated 1998 Case study in which a "Young" cyclist developed AIH that was prolonged thru the use of TRT.

They stopped the TRT and the "hypogonadism" returned (hello) and then began a course of HCG

They then discontinued the HCG and the patient recovered MONTHS LATER, and thats what would have happened wo HCG

JIM

So your thought is that the HCG did nothing and he pretty much recovered on his own?

HCG did raise the patients TT levels but almost all younger folk recover w or wo HCG, yet it's use likely delayed spontaneous HTPA recovery.

Can HCG mediate Testicular recovery --- Absolutely
But I'm unaware of evidence intra-cycle HCG is of benefit, esp at the dosages some are touting

Can HCG mediate HTPA recovery ----- Absolutely NOT

Are SERMS capable of mediating HTPA recovery ---- Absolutely

Can SERMS mediate (indirectly) testicular recovery ---- Absolutely

Can SERMS correct those mechanisms responsible for AIH -- probably NOT based upon existing data and that data shows a return of baseline TT levels once discontinued.

Bottomline both HCG ad SERMS can be useful but they are not the recovery panacea many believe them to be.



JIM

 

[The Terminator]

I was curious how people's bloods looked after running HCG alone and how much it increased test compared to clomid. I know people who hop on HRT are usually prescribed this or clomid to increase low test levels; anyone ever 3x their natty test levels after HCG? I've seen people double their test on logs with HCG; but was wondering what the highest levels one ever had. The late Rich Piana I remember had an insane protocol where he would come off everything and just run 5000 IU of HCG eod and literally made gains even off the juice; but I know running that much for a few months can possibly desensitize your leydig cells.

He likely had a lot of juice still circulating for some time after his last shot. That’s probably where the gainz came from.

 

[BigG50]

How many cycles have you been on and have you ever run Nolva and/or Clomid for PCT?

So you can run Nolvadex and clomid alone for pct? How long for a test cycle?

 

[T-Bagger]

So you can run Nolvadex and clomid alone for pct? How long for a test cycle?

Do you mean without HCG? Normal PCT can last up to 6 weeks. You can run Nolva and/or Clomid but why wouldn’t you want to kickstart it with HCG? Nolva and Clomid together have a synergistic effect but people complain of vision problems and feeling like total ass.

 

[BigG50]

Do you mean without HCG? Normal PCT can last up to 6 weeks. You can run Nolva and/or Clomid but why wouldn’t you want to kickstart it with HCG? Nolva and Clomid together have a synergistic effect but people complain of vision problems and feeling like total ass.

Couldn’t a person just slowly taper off test doing slightly smaller doses every week or 2 weeks? Rather that just completely stopping cold turkey? Probably a stupid question but was just wondering. Just read a thread about a dude that’s been in “Blast and Cruise” mode for 4 years and is trying to come off seems like he’s going through a bunch of emotional shit, panic attacks ect...

 

[T-Bagger]

Couldn’t a person just slowly taper off test doing slightly smaller doses every week or 2 weeks? Rather that just completely stopping cold turkey? Probably a stupid question but was just wondering. Just read a thread about a dude that’s been in “Blast and Cruise” mode for 4 years and is trying to come off seems like he’s going through a bunch of emotional shit, panic attacks ect...

I don’t see the point in tapering off. Once you’re on Test, you’re shut down so it’s best if you’re running a longer ester like E or Cyp to drop that around the 3rd or even 4th week prior to your planned end of cycle and shooting Prop the rest of the cycle. That way the Prop has less time in your system and the long ester has cleared out and you can start your PCT within a few days after last pin (of Prop).

 

[BigG50]

I don’t see the point in tapering off. Once you’re on Test, you’re shut down so it’s best if you’re running a longer ester like E or Cyp to drop that around the 3rd or even 4th week prior to your planned end of cycle and shooting Prop the rest of the cycle. That way the Prop has less time in your system and the long ester has cleared out and you can start your PCT within a few days after last pin (of Prop).

That definitely sounds realistic. Why keep pinning Test E coming up to the end of your cycle when you can switch to Cyp. Brilliant. Thanks man.

 

[BigG50]

That definitely sounds realistic. Why keep pinning Test E coming up to the end of your cycle when you can switch to Cyp. Brilliant. Thanks man.

I don’t see the point in tapering off. Once you’re on Test, you’re shut down so it’s best if you’re running a longer ester like E or Cyp to drop that around the 3rd or even 4th week prior to your planned end of cycle and shooting Prop the rest of the cycle. That way the Prop has less time in your system and the long ester has cleared out and you can start your PCT within a few days after last pin (of Prop).

Switch to prop I mean

 

[T-Bagger]

Switch to prop I mean

Glad to help bro