This is true. I also met the "shitting" head on and met it with an open mind and dialogue. I almost always walked away a better friend with the person starting shit. Never once did I pull the "don't shit in my log" card....
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
Powerlifting with a Legend
- Thread starter franchise24
- Start date
RodgerThat
New Member
One he isn't even on cycle right now so the success isn't due to AAS (like AAS is ever the biggest reason for success anyways) and two not to be mean or rude to franchise but with guys like prodical Perrin and DW to name a few who are stronger and have more video eveidence why would people be plunking for his source? Do you know how many people at the gym give a fuck that I have a 3x BW deadlift or 2.5x bodyweight squat absolutely fucking no one they care about guns and abs and that's why you get the PMs asking for sources and maybe that you are a bit more vocal with how large your cycles where (btw good on you for toning them back a bit for health purposes and realizing more isn't always better).
Franchise is giving legit good advice first hand from a pro and if you got that too and could share it for bodybuilders that would mean a lot to them as well. The tips he is sharing are a privilege to read for guys like myself who can't get an opportunity like the one he has but I can vicariously learn through him and his experiences. Rep or member or unicorn a log is a log to me and I would be more then happy to see a few reps having logs NN being one of them cause if you've had a conversation with the dude you'll know he never plunks his stuff outside the Newport thread and he's a knowledgable guy on training.
Out of respect for the powerlifting community I'd appreciate if you could lay off this @Wunderpus not for franchise but for the other boys who get value from a log like this. Rip him to shreds if he doesn't follow the rules in other threads sure but in his own log not cool
I appreciate why you would think this but you can also appreciate why I would think it does.
I think part of this log is to document the success he might/will have but I also believe it's more than that. Maybe my view on powerlifting is romanticized by my personal experiences. Maybe my views on this log are biased bc I too am a powerlifter. What is undeniable to me though is that at every turn I've taken in powerlifting I have had the help and support of others. I've had complete strangers become very good friends. I've had people drive 5+ hrs to see me compete and I drove 6+ hrs to see someone I'd never met before compete, plus help handle him and rub baby powder on his quads lol.
My point is this: powerlifting is a sport in which I truly believe most people go out of their way to help a fellow competitor/athlete. I've experienced it and I've also reciprocated it. Any knowledge I have I pass on to others for the sake of progressing the sport and putting my heart in the right place. I see this log no differently. The tips and tricks that Goggins has learned are being passed on here. Little things about setting up for a ME bench, what mobility work to do for certain common problems, how to pull properly, etc. there's a ton of good information to be had and from the posts I've read so far, franchise has seemed to share everything he is learning as well as documenting his progress. Isn't that exactly what a "log" is about? Have we seen outright solicitation or promotion of the source he reps for in this thread or are we weakly correlating the possibility for it to exist with it actually happening? If it gets proven that this thread becomes a TURE advertisement for said source I will be the first to cry for shutting it down but by the way it's been presented so far I don't see any advertising. Trying to shut it down before anythimg is proven reminds me of that Tom Cruise movie Minority Report where they arrest people for crimes they haven't yet comitted.
I don't doubt for a second you get tons of PMs about the gear you're using and I know you're too humble to brag about it. I know you could sell a ton of someone's gear if you became a rep but I also know you'd never rep a lab. What do you attribute your current and long term progress to? Is it the gear? Or is it the obsessive compulsive attitude towards your diet? I mean that you're dedicated to your diet by that not something bad lol. Is it your training? Is it you're one of the most consistent motherfuckers in the gym? Is it you're one of the hardest workers on here? What's that saying that results are mostly nutrition and training and consistency and a little bit bc of the gear? Don't we always preach don't rely on the gear? Well if someone is stupid enough to ignore that advice and get your source for the gear thinking he'll become Ronnie Coleman in 5wks then we can't prevent that from happening. We can only provide the information and hope it's listened to. The same in this thread. His progress is going to be mostly coming from the fact he has a world class level powerlifter for a coach. The gear plays a minuscule part in the big picture. If someone is dumb enough to think his progress is mainly due to the gear then we have done our job simply by telling them it's the training and diet and not gear. We can do our best to get the truth out but we can't prevent people from doimg what they want.
These facts domt change the fact that he's still logging workouts, progress, and giving away the information he learns from his coach.
How does one see this as a advertisement when nothing explicitly advertises the source? Just bc he's a rep makes this an advertisement? You're proclaiming guilt based on association not on actual wrongdoing in that case.
I fully understand nothing you said was untrue. Believe me, I beat him over the head for his decision to rep a source in private. I expressed to him how disappointed I was and my reasoning for feelimg so. I also expressed to him the opinions I'm sharing with you about his log and that he was welcome to post in my log SO LONG AS THERE WAS ABSOLUTELY NO EXPLIXIT ADVERTISING OR SOLICITATION FOR GEAR OR ANYTHIMG TO DO WITH HIS LAB.
I am happy you are open minded enough to take this dialogue we have under consideration. I cannot make you change your mind but I will respect your decision either way. Maybe a simple post reminding everyone he's a rep is enough every now and then. Maybe we can al agree on something in the middle but just avoid the Meso flame wars that are so common here. I would also expect him to ignore comments he doesn't agree with and avoid the bickering on his end.
Thank you for the respect you've shown by engaging in conversation about this rather than us going at each other's throats. You will always have my utmost respect.
This is true but doesn't change the fact that it is wrong to shit on someone's log. I would never want to see your log turned into a bitch fest
The videos no longer work because It was suggested I take them down for security reasons. They were up for number of weeks. But if you'd like to see them it's very easy to make them public on you tube the videos will play.
I understand where you're coming from.
I can't begin to express how disappointed I am that this log is being encouraged to go on... But, I'll stay out of the log out of respect for those that want to see more.
My opinion doesn't change. If he gave two shits about this forum he wouldn't have sold out for discounted gear. The principal alone of him lying right to all of his "friends" would've been enough to tell him to pound sand I would've thought.
My opinion is almost identical to Eman's.... I'm disappointed in the community as a whole, and it looks awfully like a lot of the powerlifting crew willfully neglecting an obvious issue, just to protect one of their own.
But, nonetheless, I've said what I feel was needed to be said for the current situation. If things change, you can bet I will have more to say. Until then, I suppose I will watch and see how things progress....
I do wish this gave me pleasure, or joy, to see and comment on. However, I truthfully hate that this is the situation we are in.... I would hate to see this become a trend. At the end of the day, we are a community... If this community wants to see Franchise's log, so be it...
But, nonetheless, I've said what I feel was needed to be said for the current situation. If things change, you can bet I will have more to say. Until then, I suppose I will watch and see how things progress....
I do wish this gave me pleasure, or joy, to see and comment on. However, I truthfully hate that this is the situation we are in.... I would hate to see this become a trend. At the end of the day, we are a community... If this community wants to see Franchise's log, so be it...
Duh? PL isnt about building muscle. It can be a decent side effect but its certainly not the main priority. As a former skinny dude who could count double x bodyweight on the main lifts it wont ever be as impressive as building visible, tangible muscle. That is prolly 95% of peoples goals. And if that can be accomplished lifting LESS weight than your ahead of the game. We know what your accomplishments mean but but you know muscle talks baby
pitbull
Member
Since I am not a memeber who is involved in many threads I do enjoy reading the power lifting section. Everyone here has helped me in many ways.
the funny part is since I don't read alot of the drama section , I had no idea he repped for anybody. So i can vouch that this log in no was is in support of any gear, I dont even think he post any cycle info in it
the funny part is since I don't read alot of the drama section , I had no idea he repped for anybody. So i can vouch that this log in no was is in support of any gear, I dont even think he post any cycle info in it
@Wunderpus @Eman @gr8whitetrukker
i totally get where you all are coming from. no doubt about it. and respect all of you and hold you guys to a conduct degree of the board because you are long standing members how genuinely CARE.
am i disappointed? yes.
My perception is this though. Say you had a good friend of yours make a mistake, like cheating on his wife. Do you outcast him from your friends group just because he is cheating and you dont agree? All the while he has always been a good friend to you and had your back?
I was taught to never give up on yourself, your family or your friends. EVER. not matter what they do. There have been plenty of times friends and family should have turned their backs on me when i did absolutely awful things to them. they stuck by me and now im at a place in my life where ive regained that trust and support fully.
also @Wunderpus i never thought about the connection between starting this log, being coached by a legend and becoming a rep. i can see how that all would be EXTREMELY misleading if someone weren't telling the truth and promoting the lab via the success of their log.
The thing is, while i haven't told @franchise24 this, i saw him in a few of his coaches videos/live feeds over the last couple weeks. how i know its him is because he has sent me videos for form corrections.
my thoughts are lets see how things play out.
unfortunately i have a feeling they arent going to play out well. i just hope @franchise24 you have enough whereabouts that when something doesnt feel right with IA, or things are going in a direction you dont like, you get the fuck out.
i totally get where you all are coming from. no doubt about it. and respect all of you and hold you guys to a conduct degree of the board because you are long standing members how genuinely CARE.
am i disappointed? yes.
My perception is this though. Say you had a good friend of yours make a mistake, like cheating on his wife. Do you outcast him from your friends group just because he is cheating and you dont agree? All the while he has always been a good friend to you and had your back?
I was taught to never give up on yourself, your family or your friends. EVER. not matter what they do. There have been plenty of times friends and family should have turned their backs on me when i did absolutely awful things to them. they stuck by me and now im at a place in my life where ive regained that trust and support fully.
also @Wunderpus i never thought about the connection between starting this log, being coached by a legend and becoming a rep. i can see how that all would be EXTREMELY misleading if someone weren't telling the truth and promoting the lab via the success of their log.
The thing is, while i haven't told @franchise24 this, i saw him in a few of his coaches videos/live feeds over the last couple weeks. how i know its him is because he has sent me videos for form corrections.
my thoughts are lets see how things play out.
unfortunately i have a feeling they arent going to play out well. i just hope @franchise24 you have enough whereabouts that when something doesnt feel right with IA, or things are going in a direction you dont like, you get the fuck out.
I'd definitely get out. This has been the most enjoyable, information forum or thread. The tips, advice, help with changing my programming and all the other helpful members here in this thread. You guys not knowing along with my son pushed me to do my first meet in September.
I had reached out to Steve before the meet and then joined Steves team.
I just want to return any info on form technique and anything to the members here. Since everyone in the lower thread has been more than helpful.
100% true in my case.
It's hard to permanently shit on a friend for making an error. I'm not good at it. It's a fucked up spot to be in as one of his friends dude, but I'm finding it hard as fuck to junk that relationship just yet.
He knows where my head is at on the subject and I'm not pleased. Actually pissed off to an extent but I'm stuck in the middle. If he ends up involved in anything suspect he will most likely loose most of his support.
I'd imagine some others may feel similar.
Thanks man
Yes, i care. Dont know why but i do
tandd6
Member
I like stuff.
tandd6
Member
If I read it and I like it, doesn't matter who said it I'll hit the like button
Because this is your life. Like it or not, we love the sport of lifting weights and this community. No matter the persons goals. It's mine, for sure.
I would, and have, literally help anyone who asks for my help. And I know all of the guys in this thread would. Cause they all have helped me at times.
I can't tell you how much this board helped me since joining probably close to 4 years ago.
I read so fucking much when I first joined and did ZERO posting. I read and consumed all the info available. When I started lifting almost 5 years ago I was 170lbs. Weighed 240.3 this morning. NONE of that would have been possible if it wasn't for the information I got from this board. NONE. Sure, there is a level of someone's drive and will power in play. But getting and using the proper info is equally as important.
That's what's great, and that's why Meso will always be my home board. As fucked up as it can be at times. Thank you @Millard Baker for making this all possible for us.
I appreciate your position.
I've said all I need to say. You guys want him and his log here, I won't try and interfere.
With that said, I hope you guys don't easily forget. He was given a choice and he chose to go against all of you that call him a friend... All for a discount on gear. Don't forget it.
Quite the contrary. This has nothing to do with protecting one of our own...at least for me it doesn't.
To be 100% honest, I never agreed or liked the idea that a rep can only post in their source's thread. I think it's a bad rule and one I've never been behind, never "enforced", and never encourage. This doesn't mean I want reps to spam threads promoting their source, on the contrary, I just don't see a strong enough justification to prevent them from posting completely. If a rep spams and promotes their source in threads then fuck them and run them out; but if they can provide good information on threads and avoid promoting the source they work for then what's the big deal?
The idea behind this "rule" is to protect members from being preyed upon by sources and reps correct? To HELP members, is it not? How much are you really helping members when you prevent potentially good information from being posted based solely on the fact that someone is a rep? You're basically cutting off your nose to spite your face.
This "rule" has prevented NorthernNutrition from posting and he is one of the most intelligent people on here, rep or no rep. I'd give what's left of my shriveled up left testicle to have him posting again, especially in the nutrition and training sections. So now, one of the most quality posters on this forum is prevented from helping others bc he is a rep and people can't think for themselves. Northern nutrition is not a powerlifter either but I would wholeheartedly welcome his posts again irrespective of the fact that he is a rep.
Our job here, at least in my opinion, is to help people educate themselves on steroids, how to use them as safe as possible, how to make progress towards their goals, teach them how to educate themselves, and promote the passing of knowledge from one person to the next or one generation of steroid users to the next. My job is not to baby people. My job is not to hold someone's hands the entire time they use steroids. My job isn't to be like an overbearing parent that never takes the training wheels off their kid's bike. I'll do what I can and then expect that person to take it from there. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink comes to mind. We can tell people that people are reps, we can educate them that reps don't always have their best interests at heart, we can warn them to take reps' recommendations with a grain of salt but we cannot, nor should not, expect to be ultimately responsible for if/when members don't listen to what we teach.
I also provided several examples of other reps posting outside of their source's threads. Where is the outrage for them? Where is the shit talking towards them? Where is the bullying back to their threads for them? Maybe people are tired of hammering Julius idk. Maybe Franchise is the fresh meat so other people's transgressions can be left ignored.
And finally, I thought this forum was not supposed to be a source board? Sources are encouraged to post on here to help solve issues with their gear and help provide harm reduction correct? Why is it that we have to enforce the rule about reps but not sources? As far as I'm concerned, a source posting their list, T/A times, accepted payment methods, etc etc has nothing to do with harm reduction or solving issues with their gear. Yet sources are encouraged to post their lists all the time. They're encouraged to keep their lists updated for crying out loud. Regular members dick ride sources left and right, promote sources every day, bump source threads so they remain up top of the queue, etc etc. regular members do a fantastic job of telling for sources, better than the reps even, and the only difference is they do it for free (I'm not suggesting everyone become a rep now, I never would). We encourage sources to give freebies and sales. We play along with source contests like guessing the final scores of football games for credit to buy gear. Am I the only one who sees hypocrisy here? I'm not saying I know the answer to fix it just pointing out what's in front of me.
There's so much more I can say but this post is long enough already and I do not want you to think I'm attackimg you or your views Wunder. You're my boy and I am venting to you not at you.
Well thats the genius that is millard Baker. He could easily say this isnt a source board and ban all public sourcing. Easy enough. Its HIS board. I do believe that was his intention behind starting MESO. But he doesnt because he promotes free will so long i guess as a death threat, unsolicited pm sourcing or talk of raping kids doesnt go down. Which are pretty damn good rules...i do think MESO is the ONLY true source for unfiltered reviews and that is its best quality and may even be better that way. But there is a ton of reasons why MESO has morphed in to what it is today. I learned from the ppl before me and the ppl before them and so on. And ppl will learn from me and you and MESO will be shaped and passed down like that in the future. Im not naming members but anyone who has spent time here knows who helped influence this place and if u been here a while u could easily see a passing of the guard here and things have changed. I hear talk of the old timers, you know the ones who are extinct or mostly inactive about how this place changed for the worse and i call BS on that! Its never been better and heres why...
MESO is slowly becoming board where "vets" arent protected and allowed to do as they please. MESO is more moral now than it was say 3 or 4 yrs ago.
MESO encourages free thought now more than ever. There is no hierarchy of member status who control the good ol boys of MESO. Anymore...
I dont always like what goes down here and i dont always help the situation but in whole i am trying to leave this place a better place than when i found it. In my own small way.
