Source Testing Group (thoughts, ideas & opinions)

[nealcaffrey16]

smfh. again, I had no problem with test results being privatized - it's when they become a point of contention in a public dispute that it becomes a different story. and if that still counts me out, then count me the f*ck out.

 

[B Ware]

Say 5 of us pile in for WongDong AAS Labs and get a $300 credit, well, we should all in theory get a $50 share of that order. even if it's a vial or two, well hell, it'll still be something. just everyone would cover the extra shipping cost.

No, just no. Lmao

I didn’t even think of gaining credits for this venture but obviously after reading what you wrote here this is a bad idea and would cause conflict. I’m starting to see more and more now why the communities that have this in place already are small tight groups. The point of all this is for harm reduction and education.

 

[Jestopherson]

No, just no. Lmao

I didn’t even think of gaining credits for this venture but obviously after reading what you wrote here this is a bad idea and would cause conflict. I’m starting to see more and more now why the communities that have this in place already are small tight groups. The point of all this is for harm reduction and education.

I couldn't really care less about the credits. All I'd want is that if the cost of testing Is refunded by the lab that it goes back into the pool for the next test. I completely understand why it likely wouldn't work via donation system but it doesn't hurt to hope. I'd gladly contribute monthly for tests and even provide gear from Canadian/international sources if I have it on hand.


@Cashton do you still plan to test that gh?

 

[nealcaffrey16]

I couldn't really care less about the credits. All I'd want is that if the cost of testing Is refunded by the lab that it goes back into the pool for the next test. I completely understand why it likely wouldn't work via donation system but it doesn't hurt to hope. I'd gladly contribute monthly for tests and even provide gear from Canadian/international sources if I have it on hand.


@Cashton do you still plan to test that gh?

this is an even better idea. perhaps some labs would even offer donations in lieu of actual product to go back into the pot for further testing. But what the fuck do I know? amazing what happens when discussion takes place and people don't give condescending answers.

 

[L0ND0N]

How the group started:
Through the years I have seen that simple donation did not work. The proof @ShankHunt received really little donation. I have spent more than 10 years on forum. When Qingdao arrived, I left some messages to suggest to share the cost of lab test. One member contacted me @AD. Then we talked about how to make a group and to get other people on board. After getting more members we were able to pay our first lab test.

We use skype for talking. Probably not the best but we have the possibility to vote there.
Because one of our strengths is we do not have a boss. Everyone is equal. We vote for everything/anything. Everyone has some missions. Example mine is to talk for the group and to contact sources.

Most important is transparency. We are transparent on each step of the process. We have no interest and earn nothing from this group.
All our tests are blind tests. We take photos of product, package etc, for proof.

Our goal:
Harm reduction for everyone, not only for the group.
A big part of our test lab are public. We will do our best to have all of them public.
If we really find something harmful, we will tell it to the world straight away.
Having some power over the sources in order to get more test labs. All for health safety.
Since we started, we have noticed already a big change on many sources on meso FR. Nowadays they all publish lab tests. Which was not always the case before. So again, this part has helped everyone.

What the group is really about:
One thing that most of you do not know, is that we are not just a group of lab tester. We are a group of bodybuilding passionate people. We exchange on many topics. We are all friends there. One of our unwritten rule is to try to participate in our conversation once in a while for example.
This privacy gives us a space where we can talk a bit more freely

Rules:
There was no rule at first. Over the time we all make rules together. All pretty fair. However, no one can cross them without getting a sanction.

Sources:
We play fair with all sources. We try to collaborate with them as much as possible in a total transparency with everyone.
@Liska here can testify. We never ask or accept money or product in return of favor. No source knows what the test lab is before paying for it. This guaranty the honesty of everyone.
On that point I can say that the sources who collaborate with us are the most professional ones. They know they have good product and nothing to hide. I thank them for that.

Money:
It seems that money management is an issue for some.
The group is like a car. Without fuel it does not go anywhere. You need money to keep testing.
Member started by putting 25e each. Over the time whoever wanted to add money have done it. This was a big help at first. Now we also rely on refund from sources. Both combined have help us to pay for around 20 test labs. Thousands of dollars fund raised and spent. This is just the beginning of it.
No one in the group make any money, or get free gears or anything else. Some sources add a bit extra for postage and product, that is it.

A secret!
For the stingiest people. The truth is we share good tips about cryto, and some other special tips. So, at the end a lot members got much more than what they spent for participation.


Where to start to make a US group:
Get some trusted members. Talk together. Put money in a pot and start.
Choose carefully who handle the money, etc.
It will grow by itself little by little.
Bear in mind, this ask a lot of work and time.

I will be happy to answer any question that could help to set up a US group.
I will not answer crying babies who keep asking for all lab tests. As I said it all depends of sources if they are out or not. Ask them directly why it is not out.

 

[trl01]

Whoever handles the money better not run with our money

 

[L0ND0N]

Whoever handles the money better not run with our money

true !
We made a rule for that. Whenever there is enough money in the BTC wallet for a lab test, we send them to Janoshik. So no money stay in the wallet for long.

 

[Type-IIx]

I don't like the idea. It's been done before. Leads to fragmentation (e.g., AnaSci), perverse incentives (hoarding the results of testing). I prefer decentralization with this sort of thing.

@SkankHunt has been doing a great job for us. He should put a BTC address in his signature, and guys should fund his testing. If others are going to do what SkankHunt does, do the same, put a BTC address in your signature.

 

[Cashton]

I couldn't really care less about the credits. All I'd want is that if the cost of testing Is refunded by the lab that it goes back into the pool for the next test. I completely understand why it likely wouldn't work via donation system but it doesn't hurt to hope. I'd gladly contribute monthly for tests and even provide gear from Canadian/international sources if I have it on hand.

Great input brother.

@Cashton do you still plan to test that gh?

100% yes, it was shipped today, so I’ll let everyone know when it lands and when I send for testing and when I receive.

 

[Cashton]

How the group started:
Through the years I have seen that simple donation did not work. The proof @ShankHunt received really little donation. I have spent more than 10 years on forum. When Qingdao arrived, I left some messages to suggest to share the cost of lab test. One member contacted me @AD. Then we talked about how to make a group and to get other people on board. After getting more members we were able to pay our first lab test.

We use skype for talking. Probably not the best but we have the possibility to vote there.
Because one of our strengths is we do not have a boss. Everyone is equal. We vote for everything/anything. Everyone has some missions. Example mine is to talk for the group and to contact sources.

Most important is transparency. We are transparent on each step of the process. We have no interest and earn nothing from this group.
All our tests are blind tests. We take photos of product, package etc, for proof.

Our goal:
Harm reduction for everyone, not only for the group.
A big part of our test lab are public. We will do our best to have all of them public.
If we really find something harmful, we will tell it to the world straight away.
Having some power over the sources in order to get more test labs. All for health safety.
Since we started, we have noticed already a big change on many sources on meso FR. Nowadays they all publish lab tests. Which was not always the case before. So again, this part has helped everyone.

What the group is really about:
One thing that most of you do not know, is that we are not just a group of lab tester. We are a group of bodybuilding passionate people. We exchange on many topics. We are all friends there. One of our unwritten rule is to try to participate in our conversation once in a while for example.
This privacy gives us a space where we can talk a bit more freely

Rules:
There was no rule at first. Over the time we all make rules together. All pretty fair. However, no one can cross them without getting a sanction.

Sources:
We play fair with all sources. We try to collaborate with them as much as possible in a total transparency with everyone.
@Liska here can testify. We never ask or accept money or product in return of favor. No source knows what the test lab is before paying for it. This guaranty the honesty of everyone.
On that point I can say that the sources who collaborate with us are the most professional ones. They know they have good product and nothing to hide. I thank them for that.

Money:
It seems that money management is an issue for some.
The group is like a car. Without fuel it does not go anywhere. You need money to keep testing.
Member started by putting 25e each. Over the time whoever wanted to add money have done it. This was a big help at first. Now we also rely on refund from sources. Both combined have help us to pay for around 20 test labs. Thousands of dollars fund raised and spent. This is just the beginning of it.
No one in the group make any money, or get free gears or anything else. Some sources add a bit extra for postage and product, that is it.

A secret!
For the stingiest people. The truth is we share good tips about cryto, and some other special tips. So, at the end a lot members got much more than what they spent for participation.


Where to start to make a US group:
Get some trusted members. Talk together. Put money in a pot and start.
Choose carefully who handle the money, etc.
It will grow by itself little by little.
Bear in mind, this ask a lot of work and time.

I will be happy to answer any question that could help to set up a US group.
I will not answer crying babies who keep asking for all lab tests. As I said it all depends of sources if they are out or not. Ask them directly why it is not out.

Thank you for posting this.

 

[Cashton]

I don't like the idea. It's been done before. Leads to fragmentation (e.g., AnaSci), perverse incentives (hoarding the results of testing). I prefer decentralization with this sort of thing.

@SkankHunt has been doing a great job for us. He should put a BTC address in his signature, and guys should fund his testing. If others are going to do what SkankHunt does, do the same, put a BTC address in your signature.

He’s a source now.. that sounds like a conflict of interest for him to be spearheading that campaign still…

 

[Type-IIx]

He’s a source now.. that sounds like a conflict of interest for him to be spearheading that campaign still…

That's a good point for sure. It should never be concentrated in a sole person's hands anyway. The major problem with the paid group model is it is really destructive to the Meso project, which has open communal access to testing at its core. I think it's good for there to be multiple persons doing blind testing without splitting the forum more than it already seems to be doing to itself. Difficult balancing.

 

[janoshik]

Leads to fragmentation (e.g., AnaSci)

What exactly do you mean, please?

Thank you.

 

[Cashton]

That's a good point for sure. It should never be concentrated in a sole person's hands anyway. The major problem with the paid group model is it is really destructive to the Meso project, which has open communal access to testing at its core. I think it's good for there to be multiple persons doing blind testing without splitting the forum more than it already seems to be doing to itself. Difficult balancing.

I agree 100% but how many people do you see doing blind testing these days… ?

 

[Type-IIx]

I agree 100% but how many people do you see doing blind testing these days… ?

I'm all for BTC addy for donations in Signatures. And if in actuality it's just you doing it, I'd be happy to contribute. This solves many of the problems.

 

[Type-IIx]

What exactly do you mean, please?

Thank you.

On the ProM forum there was an attempt at this model and it led to a spinoff forum called AnaSci that just did opaque testing. They try to get people to join, some do, etc. Meso is really the only site with indexed (i.e., search engine) HPLC results.

 

[janoshik]

On the ProM forum there was an attempt at this model and it led to a spinoff forum called AnaSci that just did opaque testing. They try to get people to join, some do, etc. Meso is really the only site with indexed (i.e., search engine) HPLC results.

I understand now. I believe that dividing GH testing projects and AAS testing projects between ProM and AnaSci was a deliberate attempt to drive more people to AnaSci, as it fit the business model of the forums better to have more "evenly" spread customer base. So in a way, it achieved the goal, for a while.

Thank you for your answer.

 

[SkankHunt]

I don't like the idea. It's been done before. Leads to fragmentation (e.g., AnaSci), perverse incentives (hoarding the results of testing). I prefer decentralization with this sort of thing.

@SkankHunt has been doing a great job for us. He should put a BTC address in his signature, and guys should fund his testing. If others are going to do what SkankHunt does, do the same, put a BTC address in your signature.

I’m a source now so that’s a conflict of interest. I’ll be happy to donate but I won’t be in charge of funds. In my opinion it would be ideal for someone in EU to hold the funds and do shipping. Shipping from the US to Jano is $130 at a minimum.

 

[Liska]

I’m a source now so that’s a conflict of interest. I’ll be happy to donate but I won’t be in charge of funds. In my opinion it would be ideal for someone in EU to hold the funds and do shipping. Shipping from the US to Jano is $130 at a minimum.

Ideally a country most sources will be able to ship to without issues as well, which brings us back to France.

Courier shipping to Jano costs about 10-15€ though there are cheaper options available.

 

[Cashton]

I’m a source now so that’s a conflict of interest. I’ll be happy to donate but I won’t be in charge of funds. In my opinion it would be ideal for someone in EU to hold the funds and do shipping. Shipping from the US to Jano is $130 at a minimum.

Thank you for this, that’s awesome to know, we will need to find someone trustworthy in EU to do this.