TUDCA source?

[Blkhrt]

Ps, maybe you suffer from some form of autism if you can't see that bill Roberts thinks using TUDCA is a good idea since he says that if it were him he would use it. Arguing that isn't a recommendation is.. a bit obtuse.


Thanks for the kardashian insult though. Really validates your position. /s

 

[Docd187123]

Ps, maybe you suffer from some form of autism if you can't see that bill Roberts thinks using TUDCA is a good idea since he says that if it were him he would use it. Arguing that isn't a recommendation is.. a bit obtuse.


Thanks for the kardashian insult though. Really validates your position. /s

The article posted here in no way, shape or form says he would use it himself. Since you couldn't even understand the article I'm surprised you even know what autism means....

 

[Blkhrt]

Well then I will assume you are basing your beliefs in tudca on nothing but bro science then correct? You know being how all doctors are goons and morons right? I could come in here with real life experience having had hep c for 10 years and trying all of these supplements to help liver values but it seems you only want one answer so I won't waste my time.

I'm actually not basing my belief in broscience but a combination of my own thought processes and the available literature. It's simple. What the doctor and the fake doctor are saying doesn't agree with a practical understanding of the information.

You do know there are cures for hep c right?! You don't have to spend a decade managing it when a 12 week therapy has something like ninety percentile cure rates


For the love of god someone tell me why reducing liver damage during periods of reduced bile flow can ever be a bad thing

 

[Docd187123]

Just ordered 20g of TUDCA to spite you bro

Oh you didn't spite me, you spired yourself bc My bank account remains unchanged while yours is a little lighter due to pipe dreams and lack of understanding.

 

[Blkhrt]

You're insane and I should just copy and paste the exact paragraph where he says he would use it but I'll let you keep living in your fantasy world. I can't argue with an imbecile.


Seriously, go back and read it. TUDCA is mentioned three times. It's not that hard.

 

[Blkhrt]

"If it were me, and at some near point I will do it, I’d try the Dianabol at 50 mg/day with TUDCA 500 mg/day with intention to probably do all 8 weeks with the Dianabol. "


Would love to hear your reply to this. That's a direct quote from the linked article.

 

[Blkhrt]

I have to go but I really really look forward to your response. Maybe you just have selective attention skills lol and your brain refuses to recognize or process an opposing point of view

 

[CdnGuy]

"If it were me, and at some near point I will do it, I’d try the Dianabol at 50 mg/day with TUDCA 500 mg/day with intention to probably do all 8 weeks with the Dianabol. "


Would love to hear your reply to this. That's a direct quote from the linked article.

Dude not trying to jump in and bash but I read that article an hour go. I believe that out left out the part were Bill said Tudca is by no means some miracle cure to answer liver toxicity. He said it "can't hurt" to use and why he would recommend it to thousands because it's safe. What your doing is potentially dangerous and by no means should any novice think it's OK to run dbol 8 weeks. With or without Tudca!!!!

 

[Blkhrt]

Dude not trying to jump in and bash but I read that article an hour go. I believe that out left out the part were Bill said Tudca is by no means some miracle cure to answer liver toxicity. He said it "can't hurt" to use and why he would recommend it to thousands because it's safe. What your doing is potentially dangerous and by no means should any novice think it's OK to run dbol 8 weeks. With or without Tudca!!!!

Guys... that's a quote directly from bill Roberts. I have never and don't ever plan to run dianabol let alone for 8 weeks. The fake doc187 is trying to tell me I don't know how to read because according to him Roberts doesn't refdlmend TUDCA. Which we all see is totally incorrect as the quote i posted says otherwise

 

[Savagesteve]

I'm no expert and didn't even read the article but I did read the thread. Im with @Docd187123 in that why take something when the liver values go back to normal once you come off the orals? I did a terrible ph cycle which raised my liver enzymes substantially and after coming off the ph my liver enzymes returned to perfect normal levels.

 

[Docd187123]

Guys... that's a quote directly from bill Roberts. I have never and don't ever plan to run dianabol let alone for 8 weeks. The fake doc187 is trying to tell me I don't know how to read because according to him Roberts doesn't refdlmend TUDCA. Which we all see is totally incorrect as the quote i posted says otherwise

You were right he said he would try it. That was my mistake for not reading it correctly but that's still a far cry from recommending it. He even says:

"I doubt that TUDCA is a cure-all for the liver issues of alkylated steroids, but it’s possible it may help enough to make routine 8-week use acceptable. I mean acceptable in the sense that it can be recommended to thousands of people and not harm any of them."

And also:

"However, I’d do a liver test at 6 weeks and would discontinue use if serum bilirubin or GGT were outside the normal range"

That doesn't sound like a responding endorsement nor is he even sure it works. He's speculating. Couple this with the fact that besides acetaminophen overdose there's no specific indicated treatment for drug induced cholestasis, that severe and lasting liver damage from AAS use is very rare even with the mega doses we see daily on the forums, LFTs return to normal within a reasonable amount of time after discontinuing the offending agent, Dr. Scally and Dr. Jim both agree it's uses as a prophylactic treatment for AAS induced hepatotxocity, etc etc etc etc it's a waste of time and money.

 

[Blkhrt]

Oh you didn't spite me, you spired yourself bc My bank account remains unchanged while yours is a little lighter due to pipe dreams and lack of understanding.

I'm totally fine spending $50 on a supplement that Without a doubt keeps your liver safe from AAS induced bile flow impairment. Which i realize you don't believe exists but I guess I just have to accept that you are somewhat deranged for thinking the most common side effect of hepatoxic oral steroids doesn't exist. Because your favorite doctor (who once had his medical license revoked) says it doesn't work it must be true!!! Nope. In the exact thread from 2014, in which you take your quotes from, another user posts a link to a page describing the purported method that TUDCA can very well help those using oral steroids retain optimal liver health...


You're a fucking parrot. You tried to insult me a couple times in here, telling me I'm wrong wrong wrong because your favourite doctor buddy says I'm wasting my money. And that I can't read because Bill Roberts didn't say what you think he said, even though I posted the exact quote disproving you.

You, my dimwitted wannabe, are wrong. Even a mainstream site like examine.com has a section, complete with references, supporting the use of TUDCA for steroid users. Scally and you are both grasping at straws when you say we waste our money by using this supplement. Technically, you're right in the sense that the medical community doesn't have a positive consensus regarding TUDCA and AAS. But that doesn't mean we can't think and use our minds to come to (extremely fucking obvious) conclusions after reading the material and combining that knowledge with our own experience and aptitude.

That isn't "bro science". 'Tis common sense my dear little dumbass. Maybe before you tell me I'm only good for a laugh and that I know nothing, familiarize yourself with the concepts behind the supplements and drugs we are discussing. Well, I'm discussing, you're simply parroting some bullshit by a doctor who is so far up his own ass he can't open his eyes to see the obvious conclusions.


This post and exchange had really been an eye opener as to the types of people that inhabit these boards. I knew I was getting into something when I started posting here. You folks bash good sources and call people shills for no reason. Y'all have some fucked up ideas about how to brew. I've never heard of autoclaving finished vials until I logged on here lol. And now this dude is telling me TUDCA is worthless yet all of the evidence pointing to its worth as a liver aid is there.

Scally says NOTHING will help your liver. While Sam-e is used in Russia to treat choleostasis and other liver conditions, and is set to begin trials for an IV formulation for North American markets, udca/TUDCA is obvious choice in lessening damage of AAS induced choleostasis (super rare according to you-most likely cause scally said it so you just repeat it lol!!) and even the derided milk thistle has been shown to been beneficial alongside betaine, choline, inositol.. you blow my mind.

 

[Blkhrt]

Jimmyinkedup said it best in 2014, hopefully this shuts the moron gallery up:

"Its benefits in patients suffering from biliary cirrhosis and it improvement in choleostasis are more than enough anecdotal evidence for me to consider udca more than prudent when it comes to liver support , function and treatment, The reason that we cannot attribute direct cases due to aas use where it made a difference it obvious but so are the positive effects udca has on the liver in other circumstances. To assume these positive effects would miraculously not occur due to aas administration is not prudent imo. Yeah no direct case studies but enough anecdotal and solid evidence of these positive effects on liver ( as well as kidney function when itcomes to NAC) make it foolish imo to dismiss them as useless. Sadly in this game we have to rely on some speculation until science catches up. Hell in the case of NAC its conversion to glutathione, an extremely powerful anti oxidant and the benefits that come along with its administration OUTSIDE of liver protection and function make it a prudent staplesupplement choice...and I am far from a supp junkie. In fact I have been banned from more forums for trashing garbage supps than I can even count or recall."

 

[Savagesteve]

Why come and make this thread if you aren't going to listen to anyone but yourself? If you're so set on it then take the TUDCA and stfu.

 

[CdnGuy]

Guys... that's a quote directly from bill Roberts. I have never and don't ever plan to run dianabol let alone for 8 weeks. The fake doc187 is trying to tell me I don't know how to read because according to him Roberts doesn't refdlmend TUDCA. Which we all see is totally incorrect as the quote i posted says otherwise

I'll share a personal story from my old gear dealer(long time ago) . The guy was in his 50's(monster) and started Aas and Drol at 15. This guy loved Drol and had been using it for decades. I asked him if he takes Tudca then? I quote him "tried it many times and my overall liver results never justified the cost". "Big waste of money kid" Unfortunately not long after the guy almost died and went into a coma for 5 days due to kindney failure. The direct result from many decades of heavy use of Aas and orals

 

[Blkhrt]

Scally
and Dr. Jim both agree it's uses as a prophylactic treatment for AAS induced hepatotxocity, etc etc etc etc it's a waste of time and money.

One is a disgraced doc who once had his license revoked. The other posts inanely long explanations of simple concepts in an effort to appear super educated. Neither are able to disprove the fact that a number of worthwhile liver aids exist, and parrots like you latch onto their every word as gospel. If a doctor says it, they must be right!!!

Get over yourself. You're wrong. TUDCA is one of the best liver support supps out there. Just cause there isn't a specific AAS study out there on it doesn't mean it's not worth taking. I can't believe how stubborn you are and it's funny how you toned down the personal insults regarding my supposed lack of reading comprehension when it became clear you have your own faults. When you try to nitpick and talk shit on someone please make sure you cross the i's and dot the t's. You may think you are right and your little group of parrots who follow anyone's with a "dr" before their name around like their word are gospel are pathetic. I can't stand dr JIMs posts by the way, dude must grow daisies out of his shit he loves he smell of his ass so much. I don't automatically respect them because they can talk in medical jargon. Calling my thoughts toward TUDCA as bro science is a bullshit claim and y'all know it. I'll continue using it and reaping its benefits and you can continue existing in a reality where apparently there are no supplements or drugs that can help reduce and repair liver damage. We all know how resilient this organ is but claiming TUDCA and other proven supps don't help is beyond silly. You're arguing for the sake of your position at this point.

 

[Blkhrt]

Why come and make this thread if you aren't going to listen to anyone but yourself? If you're so set on it then take the TUDCA and stfu.

I didn't make the thread dummy. I offered insight and this dude came in to tell me I'm full of shit because a disgraced doctor said so in 2014, completely ignoring the counter argument and the piles of anecdotal evidence as well as the most basic obvious conclusions one could draw having familiarized themselves with the material.

This forum is a truly special place. the truth is you folks love to think meso is where all the great minds come to meet, yet anyone with the most basic critical thinking skills can see that even Reddit has ya beat. There's not much I can do for you people. I've read a lot of dumb stuff in my few days browsing intently here lately. I can't compete against a legion of stubborn vets so I'm out. Keep being you meso.

Wanna know the best way to find a good source? Go to meso and search out the most shit talked and spat on sources. They usually turn out to have the best gear and service lol

 

[CdnGuy]

One is a disgraced doc who once had his license revoked. The other posts inanely long explanations of simple concepts in an effort to appear super educated. Neither are able to disprove the fact that a number of worthwhile liver aids exist, and parrots like you latch onto their every word as gospel. If a doctor says it, they must be right!!!

Get over yourself. You're wrong. TUDCA is one of the best liver support supps out there. Just cause there isn't a specific AAS study out there on it doesn't mean it's not worth taking. I can't believe how stubborn you are and it's funny how you toned down the personal insults regarding my supposed lack of reading comprehension when it became clear you have your own faults. When you try to nitpick and talk shit on someone please make sure you cross the i's and dot the t's. You may think you are right and your little group of parrots who follow anyone's with a "dr" before their name around like their word are gospel are pathetic. I can't stand dr JIMs posts by the way, dude must grow daisies out of his shit he loves he smell of his ass so much. I don't automatically respect them because they can talk in medical jargon. Calling my thoughts toward TUDCA as bro science is a bullshit claim and y'all know it. I'll continue using it and reaping its benefits and you can continue existing in a reality where apparently there are no supplements or drugs that can help reduce and repair liver damage. We all know how resilient this organ is but claiming TUDCA and other proven supps don't help is beyond silly. You're arguing for the sake of your position at this point.

Lol You're still not getting it and not surprising since today you were telling me older guys(Vets) generally don't know shit. You are finished here dude! Go ahead keep telling us that some of the most helpful and knowledgeable members here are idiots lol OH THE IRONY

 

[Blkhrt]

I'll share a personal story from my old gear dealer(long time ago) . The guy was in his 50's(monster) and started Aas and Drol at 15. This guy loved Drol and had been using it for decades. I asked him if he takes Tudca then? I quote him "tried it many times and my overall liver results never justified the cost". "Big waste of money kid" Unfortunately not long after the guy almost died and went into a coma for 5 days due to kindney failure. The direct result from many decades of heavy use of Aas and orals

orsl steroids are inherently hepatoxic. Taking TUDCA to improve bile flow and knowing how to time it right so you don't do more damage is a great way to extend the amount of time you can abuse orals or reduce the amount of time it takes you to get your associated markers back in range. For liver drugs and supps, its not clear cut but to argue that they are a waste of money is bordering on utter stupidity in the search for ultimate winner of the pendantic parrot award. These guys are choosing to rail against it for whatever reason, and I simply know they're wrong based on my understanding of the subject. Sometimes you don't need a specific medical study focused on AAS users to come to a reasonable conclusion especially in the midst of tons of anecdotal experiences and related research papers that help paint a bigger more accurate picture.

 

[Blkhrt]

Lol You're still not getting it and not surprising since today you were telling me older guys(Vets) generally don't know shit. You are finished here dude! Go ahead keep telling us that some of the most helpful and knowledgeable members here are idiots lol OH THE IRONY

Man, in one post you are arguing to support my point, in another you take the side of the doctors who dismiss the same notion you just put forth. You honestly don't know what you are talking about. You're a little out of your league.

The discussion is about the efficacy of TUDCA. Do you have anything to add irrespective of your personal feelinngs towards these vets? Do you realize that you posted one thing with your little anecdote and now you are arguing against it? It's like talking to a brick wall.

Nice little echo chamber you've got going on.

Ps. Are you meaning to tell me I'm wrong for saying scally had his medical license revoked? And that he's right in saying there exists not one liver supplement or drug that can help aas induced liver disorders?

And Is it not true dr Jim posts obscenely long and full of complex medical jargon explanations when a simple answer exists that the layman could understand? I doubt you understand half of what he says.

Ok queue the point now where you all gang up on me and totally ignore what we are arguing about. Am I wrong when I say TUDCA is the best liver support supp out there? If your answer has nothing to do with that question don't bother, save the mastubation for later tonight with your velvet rabbit hide jerk off rag. This place is not somewhere to go to foment any sort of valuable discussion. You guys just latch into what the your vets say and run with it.

I'm telling you again, just cuz you have time and posts here and are recognized don't mean shit. In fact it breeds this kind of contemptuous misunderstanding of any outsider who dares to question your pecking order. It's funny how you all guard your sources and act like you gotta put your time in to access them when I can login to Reddit and get everything I need at my fingertips. I've seen sources bashed to hell and back here yet when I order from them I get Good product and service. And then I see people who've been members here for years asking if a fucked up source like landmark Is g2g. You guys are so special. I like how you gotta post here for several months before anyone trusts you to share a source when I could google search most of them lolx

Your respected vets here are saying some dumb shit and I'm supposed to respect it Just because... nah. I don't suck dick for the sake of it. Better gimme a good reason . It's funny I came for brewing advice and the first thing I read shoulda warned me away