Very low test dose for PCT

[pierrebobin]

Hi guys,
who has tryed no regular PCT, but this kind of pattern...let's say the cycle runs 500mg/week of enanthate...for a period of 10 weeks.
week 11: 250
week 12: 125
week 13: 62,5
week 14: 31
week 15: 15
You get the idea right.
i read a reference where it says that AS SOON as the test level gest under the natural range,
the system tries to balance...so with this protocole, there should be no crash.
Crash is inevitable when last injection is 250 for example.
also, the weeks at very low doses, enable the system to work again slowly,
with stil maintaining some test in the blood.
who has tryed?

 

[grey]

who has tryed?

Haven't tried, but I have to think the peak absorption levels would be the major interference point?

You have to consider that the "taper" occurs even with larger dosing since that last dose of 250 takes weeks to reduce through half-life.

 

[Jeffg353]

I was under the impression any amount of exogenous test, no matter how small, will keep the system shut down.

 

[pierrebobin]

grey, no matter what the half life is, since the amounts are sloooowly reduced, he body gets "informed" of low test very gradualy, so it can adjust...
jeffg353, this impresion you had is not correct according what i read...the body does NOT make the difference btwn natural or synthetic test...therefore, as soon as the level drops below physiological level, body starts to produce IN ORDER TO STAY in natural range...and since for the lasts weeks, there is still a bit of synthetic test, the body does NOT have to produce a lot...it goes gradually with the lowerinf of exogenous test...CRASH AVOIDED...

 

[grey]

grey, no matter what the half life is, since the amounts are sloooowly reduced, he body gets "informed" of low test very gradualy, so it can adjust...

No... it doesn't.

Here is the plot of your proposed dosing and reduction by week graphed out to week 20.



At day 84 you finally drop down to roughly 1/6th of the cycle peaks (from ~60 mg available per day to ~9mg available per day) at which point you "might" start some level of renewed production signalling. I honestly doubt that it would likely start again until somewhere closer to day 112+ though.

Here is the same cycle, but simply stopping at week 12 cold turkey:


You hit day 84's of the previous taper cycle availability levels at day 87. If you stopped the dose in week 11, you would hit those levels at day 81.

Once again, levels of available exo test don't really get down to where PCT bloodwork indicates that natural production seems to resume until right around day 112.

With the taper, you just end up one a slow move from "ineffective cycle dose" (still suppressed) to "TRT dose" (TRT doses even at low levels still completely suppress) before smacking into the asymptotic curve at virtually the exact same point in the chronology except you bump along at low levels for a few MORE days).

Feel free to try it yourself. But my estimate is that the only thing this would do is prolong the duration for natural test production recovery. And cost more.

 

[pierrebobin]

Thanks Grey...that's some wotk you did here.
I do understand your point.
However, only people who actually tryed can see what it does.
I still am intersted by the theory of such a protocol.

 

[Michael Scally MD]

I was under the impression any amount of exogenous test, no matter how small, will keep the system shut down.

Suppress, not shut down!

 

[Michael Scally MD]

Haven't tried, but I have to think the peak absorption levels would be the major interference point?

You have to consider that the "taper" occurs even with larger dosing since that last dose of 250 takes weeks to reduce through half-life.

Precisely, so a taper is of no worth. And, probably work against maximal anabolism.

 

[EcpertRealistic]

Thanks Grey...that's some wotk you did here.
I do understand your point.
However, only people who actually tryed can see what it does.
I still am intersted by the theory of such a protocol.

You just don't want to come off the juice. Same mental games happen in the brain of crack heads trying to find an excuse to get high again without feeling guilt.

Pct is how you avoid the crash. The longer you run exogenous test, the longer and harder will be to recover.

If you are afraid of the crash, run smaller dosages, you'll be able to keep more with less stretch marks

 

[grey]

However, only people who actually tryed can see what it does.

You aren't going to find many people who:

a. Tried this, since it is a pretty widely debunked dosing theory already. You are not the first to suggest it on this forum alone in the last 6 months.

b. Tried it and then kept a good log.

c. Logged it and had frequent enough bloodwork to matter.

d. Then had all the same data for a non-taper cycle that was virtually identical in all other ways.

And that would just be to come up with an N=1 bronecdote.

 

[master.on]

Hi guys,
who has tryed no regular PCT, but this kind of pattern...let's say the cycle runs 500mg/week of enanthate...for a period of 10 weeks.
week 11: 250
week 12: 125
week 13: 62,5
week 14: 31
week 15: 15
You get the idea right.
i read a reference where it says that AS SOON as the test level gest under the natural range,
the system tries to balance...so with this protocole, there should be no crash.
Crash is inevitable when last injection is 250 for example.
also, the weeks at very low doses, enable the system to work again slowly,
with stil maintaining some test in the blood.
who has tryed?

That's called a bridge.
IMO don't.

If anything, use a high but not excessive HCG dose that brings your natural Testosterone at or over the normal range.
You'll likely need an Aromatase Inhibitor+bloodwork to control excess Estrogen.