Why is my Test >1500?

[Sworder]

Please post the study. I imagine there would be some change with hcg and trt in conjunction with one another but it would likely be insignificant and it wouldn't be through the typical mechanism of action that increases TT from hcg.

HCG is a LH analogue, it works in the same way as LH except that it isn't produced by the pituitary. @Eman you don't know this?!

 

[Eman]

HCG is a LH analogue, it works in the same way as LH except that it isn't produced by the pituitary. @Eman you don't know this?!

What would lead you to believe I don't know what HCG is or how it works?

I'm interested in studies to identify what the MOA is for an increased TT while using TRT. It's clear how it works without TRT, but are the testes going to produce more testosterone on top of the TRT's exogenously supplied testosterone? Or is the TT rising because of HCG's effect on SHBG?

 

[Sworder]

What would lead you to believe I don't know what HCG is or how it works?

I'm interested in studies to identify what the MOA is for an increased TT while using TRT. It's clear how it works without TRT, but are the testes going to produce more testosterone on top of the TRT's exogenously supplied testosterone? Or is the TT rising because of HCG's effect on SHBG?

It works the same with or without TRT. When you are NOT on TRT hCG will suppress natural LH.

HCG is a LH analog..

This is the MOA for T in short:
LH->T
for HCG->T

Both go on the leydigs.

 

[jJjburton]

I think its becasue you took the bloods this time at when yu were peaking....the other times was during the trough. Trough for cyp is 7-9 days....Peak is 3-5 days I think.

 

[The Terminator]

I fixed it for you

lol thanks

That would really be something... Can you actually see the testosterone vial fill up while you're pinning the hcg?

Please post the study. I imagine there would be some change with hcg and trt in conjunction with one another but it would likely be insignificant and it wouldn't be through the typical mechanism of action that increases TT from hcg.

Affirmative you fill it in sterile vials lol I meant endogenous. Anyway the studies were more on fertility so they measured ITT levels, those that did 500iu eod had 26% increase in ITT. Typically ITT is 50-100x serum T, and the excess ITT gets dispatched outside the balls and adds to TT. Anyway if your ITT levels increase so should your TT. Here are the studies:

Indications for the use of human chorionic gonadotropic hormone for the management of infertility in hypogonadal men

Preserving fertility in the hypogonadal patient: an update

I'm not interested in TRT, I'm interested in performance enhancement. More muscle faster.

Thanks, I didn't know that taking T suppresses FSH and LH.

I mentioned above how long after application/injection the tests were:

Do we expect changes in timing to affect results by 2x (Test Cyp) or 3x (Test gel)?

All else being equal, higher T tends to cause higher libido, leading to my question.

The basic question is if this >1500 reading is a problem and I should be aiming for something considerably lower. Decreased sensitivity by over-exposure to Testosterone is what I had in mind with "receptor fatigue." Is that not a concern?

Ah ok but still I don’t see what difference you’d see going from 611 TT to 870 athletic performance wise, maybe at the levels you are now.

I missed that, timing could make a difference of a couple hundred, the hCG could fill the rest. Also did you apply the gel near the area they drew blood? Cause that would affect your results.

Meh I’ve had TT of 2600 and >3000 with very minimal libido and TT of 240-700 with insane libido, it’s mostly a mental thing.

Yeah AAS will suppress LH/FSH via negative feedback from androgens and estrogens, even hCG will suppress LH/FSH but it’s an LH analogue and uhCG might have minimal FSH like effect.

I don’t think receptor fatigue is a thing, at least I’ve never read about it. You will become tolerant ie eventually the same dose won’t yield the same gainzz, that’s why people up their doses. But like I said I would be more concerned about cardiovascular issues in the long run if you have excessively high T levels indefinitely.

 

[Deleted member 59947]

First of all you didn’t need trt, your T was in the 600’s so you probably got yourself a crappy drug pushing dr.

You can have seemingly fine serum levels, but all the symptoms of low T.
The only way to know is to do a TRT trial just like this gentleman did, and see if symptoms get resolved.
Some men have to push their total T to close to 2000 on transcrotal cream for symptoms to be alleviated.

You can search for Dr Keith Nichols’ videos on youtube, he is really good.

 

[Deleted member 59947]

You will become tolerant ie eventually the same dose won’t yield the same gainz

Oh? According to what principle exactly?

 

[Sworder]

Oh? According to what principle exactly?

Homeostasis

 

[The Terminator]

You can have seemingly fine serum levels, but all the symptoms of low T.
The only way to know is to do a TRT trial just like this gentleman did, and see if symptoms get resolved.
Some men have to push their total T to close to 2000 on transcrotal cream for symptoms to be alleviated.

You can search for Dr Keith Nichols’ videos on youtube, he is really good.

That would simply prove T was never an issue, pretty sure I’ve mentioned many times that just because you feel good with blast level trt doesn’t mean it’s good for you. These people have likely fallen victim to the multi-billion dollar trt industry ads: they convince themselves they need trt despite normal T and regular trt doses yield similar levels as before so they think they need more. I fell victim to the trt ads too, I actually had low T at the time due to life style but I thought trt was the answer. It helped in the gym and I started working out again but didn’t fix anything so I said F it and stopped trt. Improved libido and what not..

Oh? According to what principle exactly?

If this wasn’t true you’d see dudes just do 500mg of T and keep gaining. The body always adapts

 

[Deleted member 59947]

That would simply prove T was never an issue, pretty sure I’ve mentioned many times that just because you feel good with blast level trt doesn’t mean it’s good for you. These people have likely fallen victim to the multi-billion dollar trt industry ads: they convince themselves they need trt despite normal T and regular trt doses yield similar levels as before so they think they need more. I fell victim to the trt ads too, I actually had low T at the time due to life style but I thought trt was the answer. It helped in the gym and I started working out again but didn’t fix anything so I said F it and stopped trt. Improved libido and what not..



If this wasn’t true you’d see dudes just do 500mg of T and keep gaining. The body always adapts

It doesn’t adapt, it’s just that 500mg will only yield so much muscle.

To x amount of gear corresponds y muscle mass, and y is reached after z amount of months.

Once you’ve reached y after z, it’s normal that you don’t put more muscle.

Just like after a few years natty you don’t keep growing: you’ve reached the max amount of muscle for your T level

 

[The Terminator]

It doesn’t adapt, it’s just that 500mg will only yield so much muscle.

To x amount of gear corresponds y muscle mass, and y is reached after z amount of months.

Once you’ve reached y after z, it’s normal that you don’t put more muscle.

Just like after a few years natty you don’t keep growing: you’ve reached the max amount of muscle for your T level

What you mention is the body adapting, it will yield only so much muscle because of the changes taking place in the body. I mean they even have a phrase for the beginning of trt called the “honeymoon phase” where you feel good and your libido is super high but after a couple weeks or months you start feeling normal again.

 

[Deleted member 59947]

What you mention is the body adapting, it will yield only so much muscle because of the changes taking place in the body. I mean they even have a phrase for the beginning of trt called the “honeymoon phase” where you feel good and your libido is super high but after a couple weeks or months you start feeling normal again.

That’s only because your trt dose adds up to your natural test still being produced.
After a while (the weeks mentioned), you’re shut down and only left with the exogenous hormones

 

[The Terminator]

That’s only because your trt dose adds up to your natural test still being produced.
After a while (the weeks mentioned), you’re shut down and only left with the exogenous hormones

First of all I highly doubt dudes that started trt at <200 are getting such a massive libido boost from the natural T but rather suddenly their T jumps 4-10x. I mean could be other hormones you lose when you’re suppressed or if we’re talking about dudes that never needed trt to begin with. I just don’t see ~100 points being the difference between teenage boy libido and normal libido. Anyway suppression is one of the more obvious adaptations the body makes..