Scoc/Musings of a madman

[brutus79]

So happy 2015 everyone! I have been noticing a few things lately that disturb me a bit and feel the need to address them in no particular order.

1. The scoc is well Intentioned, but for all intents and purposes it is worthless. The ideas are great but not enforceable. The division among meso membership even has people telling the source not to worry about conforming to the scoc- they will get orders no matter what. They are right.

2. The approach taken with new sources is wrong in my opinion. All this chest thumping, ego driven attack puts the "source" on the defensive. .. but I feel it undermines our credibility not only "on the street", but also among other members old and new. If we are confrontational to the extreme in the beginning and at the end, plus eveey time we sense an issue we simply become a parody of ourselves... Why not take the approach that the ideas in the scoc be the questions we calmly ask the source about? Why flip out when they say no to something? We can't do shit about it anyway, right? Just make it known why we feel it is a concern they do not reveal or follow tenets of the scoc.

3. Stop harassing newbies who buy- and that means don't smash the thread with "DO NOT BUY SCAMMER" shit when we actually have no proof of scamming... it seems we just yell scammer when they refuse to bend toward our egomaniacal ways- and that isn't right either. People that buy- newbies especially- are gonna buy pretty much no matter what. If we encourage feedback, encourage bloods and encourage labmax use by new members we will have an ever-expanding network of like minded, knowledgeable colleagues. Instead of getting burned and sheepishly running back silently with their tail between their legs they will provide valuable feedback.

4. More bloods. More labmax. We are doing great- I think the strength for the future lies in a larger, well informed membership of empowered individuals. When someone posts asking for a source someone should be VERY NICE- AND NOBODY SHOULD BE A FUCKING ASSHOLE IN THE THREAD. This drives them right to the scammer sources with their flashing neon lights for the ignorant. Explain things. Cut and paste a "reasons why" for a newbie thread. Something that doesn't make someone buy from a scammer and leave the board thinking we are the assholes who drove them to it.

We need more of us- not more enemies. I am finished taking the gargantuan shit I took as I wrote this but I would like to hear feedback from both sides of the fence.

@Millard Baker @Burrr @CensoredBoardsSuck @Oregongearhead @weighted chinup @Masters Power @johnnyBALLZ @flenser @pumpingiron22 @Colt44 @Voltrader @gr8whitetrukker @biggerben69

If I forgot to tag you just be happy you aren't on my mind while I take a shit.

 

[BIGMESC]

Very well put @brutus79 or whoever hacked brutus account.
Kinda different side to ya, I like it.

 

[Manny]

You didn't tag me but next time you're spanking it please do!! This is a great idea man, I fully agree with this 100% Good idea.

 

[Manny]

Very well put @brutus79 or whoever hacked brutus account.
Kinda different side to ya, I like it.

I was thinking the same bro, who is this!!??

 

[Fckit]

Great points. The trick will be getting everyone (including newbs) to understand the importance of testing. Bloodwork, MS and labmax will naturally weed out the scammers. Plus, us viciously attacking a source verbally doesn't seem to run them off - only create trolls.

If we create the rep of a true testing board, scammers will eventually be less likely to want to source here AND it will drive more traffic to Meso.

Now the asshole sources that start off with the arrogance mentality, is a whole different ballgame. They're usually just pissed we called out their scam from the get go. Some guys are actually trying though.

 

[pmac928]

Brutus your ideas sound great and Your a well spoken man who brings a lot to the table. My question to you is what happens when we have a source like hammer anabolics who is a brand new start up lab? Do we really give him a shot? Someone who is arrogant and won't answer questions. I'm guilty of jumping all over sources when they show up. But just think guys like him with zero credibility bring nothing to this board. Fact remains sources are going to come, but as history has shown it will ALWAYS and up in the end the same exact way. Astro along with countless others is the proof.

 

[Voltrader]

Lets calm the F$^%$ down. I am with that. I think we all know the right questions to ask. Most of the time the source will hang themselves. Let's educate and keep going in the same direction. Stay off the new members back and guide them. I believe we could resurrect a couple of old thread directed to the new member. I know @pumpingiron22 wrote one and so did I. We were heading in the right direction and lost ourselves for a bit when it came to new members.

We need to realize everyone here is a big boy and it is their money and in the end we all learn. I can't say I found much to disagree with what you wrote.

 

[Voltrader]

Brutus your ideas sound great and Your a well spoken man who brings a lot to the table. My question to you is what happens when we have a source like hammer anabolics who is a brand new start up lab? Do we really give him a shot? Someone who is arrogant and won't answer questions. I'm guilty of jumping all over sources when they show up. But just think guys like him with zero credibility bring nothing to this board. Fact remains try are going to come, but as history has shown it will ALWAYS and up in the end the same exact way. Astro along with countless others is the proof.

Do you notice that guy has yet to answer any of my questions. All stated in a non confrontational manner. That should speak volumes and we need to teach guys the signs of what to look out for. I think Brutus point is if we yell scammer then the guy who ordered is now fearful of coming out and letting the community know he ordered. It is alienating the group that ordered which in the end we need to here from. We just continue to ask the questions that expose. Once exposed and questions answered I think it is quite obvious on what to do. Well obvious for some.

 

[Masters Power]

Nice work Brutus I agree with everything but have a different idea on the new guy asking for a source issue. I think these guys are the most dangerous to everyone involved.

Maybe someone a lot smarter than me could start a thread that becomes a sticky about this issue that isn't to condescending but lays out the various reasons why they need to educate themselves before making their own decisions on this issue. That way when the question gets asked (10 times a day) the first person reading it could link the sticky thread and that new guy won't get flamed.

Brutus as well thought out as your post was I am now considering taking my laptop with me to the shitter.

 

[flenser]

I had sort of given up on source vetting the last few months. The threads all seemed to be clogged with repetitive attacks. Anything I posted just got lost in the storm. I sure wouldn't mind seeing a reduction in that kind of crap.

Good suggestions all around Brutus.

 

[brutus79]

Brutus your ideas sound great and Your a well spoken man who brings a lot to the table. My question to you is what happens when we have a source like hammer anabolics who is a brand new start up lab? Do we really give him a shot? Someone who is arrogant and won't answer questions. I'm guilty of jumping all over sources when they show up. But just think guys like him with zero credibility bring nothing to this board. Fact remains sources are going to come, but as history has shown it will ALWAYS and up in the end the same exact way. Astro along with countless others is the proof.

My point is we don't "give them a chance"... We just seem to divide the board between the guys swarming the circle jerk of "kick the source" and the guys laughing at the futility of it. Short term it might lead to more rip offs, but if everyone goes to lengths to educate new members on feedback related to testing instead of turnaround the board, I believe, will morph into a force to be reckoned with. These people source other places most times, and even if not we might have a source or two doing well that a well informed member will naturally gravitate to. We can't stop anyone from doing anything- we should encourage members to learn instead of alienating them.

Great points. The trick will be getting everyone (including newbs) to understand the importance of testing. Bloodwork, MS and labmax will naturally weed out the scammers. Plus, us viciously attacking a source verbally doesn't seem to run them off - only create trolls.

If we create the rep of a true testing board, scammers will eventually be less likely to want to source here AND it will drive more traffic to Meso.

Now the asshole sources that start off with the arrogance mentality, is a whole different ballgame. They're usually just pissed we called out their scam from the get go. Some guys are actually trying though.

 

[Voltrader]

@Masters Power I just bumped 2 in the underground. There was another thread that allowed new guys or anyone to ask questions with out fear of harassment.

 

[Masters Power]

Brutus your ideas sound great and Your a well spoken man who brings a lot to the table. My question to you is what happens when we have a source like hammer anabolics who is a brand new start up lab? Do we really give him a shot? Someone who is arrogant and won't answer questions. I'm guilty of jumping all over sources when they show up. But just think guys like him with zero credibility bring nothing to this board. Fact remains sources are going to come, but as history has shown it will ALWAYS and up in the end the same exact way. Astro along with countless others is the proof.

I think the idea is to ask all of the right questions to the new source and to keep doing it. If they refuse to or can't answer that needs to be pointed out. I think the constant scammer tag being thrown out at the new sources is confusing to a lot of the newer guys especially if they know someone or know of someone who received a pack from the new source.

As Millard has rightfully pointed out the word scammer is being used to mean a lot of different things here. Whereas I think most new guys equate scammer with someone who takes money and doesn't send any product. So in the situation above the new guy sees scammer in the new sources thread but knows people who has received his products and thinks the members here must be in the wrong not the source.

Whereas if we stuck to the facts whatever those may be, new source lacks quality control, packaging is poor, email isn't secure, etc.. The newer guys will be able to see what the real issues are.

Having said all this if someone takes the time to fully read a sources thread all of the needed information is already there regardless of how many times he is called a scammer. It would just tone things down a bit and be more of a sticking to the facts without the name calling. Not sure if this makes any sense or not as I am having trouble figuring out the best way to say it.

 

[pmac928]

Our power is in numbers and we for te most part all stick together. If if we can encourage members who jump on just any source who pops in to come forward and let us know he made a purchase things can go smoother. I'm all for a different approach cause what we have been doing just isn't working. I still believe in the end a source won't last here, maybe the new approach will give a more advanced warning to newer members to pull funds and stop purchasing long before what happened with astro happens again.

 

[Mr. Deltoid]

Good thread Brutus I couldn't agree more . We need more educated members posposting blood work, labmax,ms/hplc etc. I'm starting to see the wisdom in not having sources here other than to answer questions and concerns.

 

[pumpingiron22]

Thanks for the post Brutus. I believe yes we should be using smart questions as are ammo. Bloods and labmax our are truth. As far as our attitude im on the fence as sometimes being an ass to sources brings out there true nature. So that does work but we definitely overkill it at time. I still feel the same about just leave your email and no price list. If they want to join in the convo thats great. These are just my opinion

 

[Masters Power]

@Masters Power I just bumped 2 in the underground. There was another thread that allowed new guys or anyone to ask questions with out fear of harassment.

If we can't sticky these two threads we need to bump them to at least stay on page 1 everyday.

 

[brutus79]

Good thread Brutus I couldn't agree more . We need more educated members posposting blood work, labmax,ms/hplc etc. I'm starting to see the wisdom in not having sources here other than to answer questions and concerns.

I just don't think no sources is possible, and I don't think the whole hang out and join conversation thing is any good... it has been of great concern to me of late all these "are you a source" people popping up that just pull people into pm sales. We need this shit out in the open. Feedback and harm reduction baby!

 

[pumpingiron22]

We need to be in the forefront with our science, bloods test, labmax, meltpoints, also I believe some of the real problem is the powder source I believe all source should cough up that info. As it unveils alot.

 

[brutus79]

Thanks for the post Brutus. I believe yes we should be using smart questions as are ammo. Bloods and labmax our are truth. As far as our attitude im on the fence as sometimes being an ass to sources brings out there true nature. So that does work but we definitely overkill it at time. I still feel the same about just leave your email and no price list. If they want to join in the convo thats great. These are just my opinion

Just a bump for you on my response to the email thing brotha- hope contest prep is going well.

I just don't think no sources is possible, and I don't think the whole hang out and join conversation thing is any good... it has been of great concern to me of late all these "are you a source" people popping up that just pull people into pm sales. We need this shit out in the open. Feedback and harm reduction baby!