Situation in Germany after busts

[PoorKitty]

Hi all,
With our beloved Liska probably gone: How do you fellow German customers with typical personal use amount orders handle news of your source being busted in Germany? Do you clean house in anticipation of a LE visit or just keep the gear since you assume they will at most send you a letter threatening a fine?
On the one hand cleaning house means throwing away all gear, on the other hand even one vial of test is technically already beyond the felony amount for possession in Germany and apparently pure users have occasionally been prosecuted...
There is just so much conflicting info on the internet and the situation in Germany regarding legality of personal use seems to be much harsher than in virtually all other countries, so I'm interested in your attitudes and experiences!

 

[bobx]

In the past LE visits happend but often months to years later so you never know. Depending on the dosages that you ordered it can very unlikely, the police dont have the capacity to bust every guy who ordered 1-2 vials, they going for the bigger fish.

 

[Country Club Hero]

Idk about Germany specifically but I would be hesitant to throw away my gears. Hide them for a little while maybe? Good luck German bros.

 

[Dickwang]

Poorkitty…… really bro lol ?!?!

Surprised they didn’t bully you off the forum already just for having that username. ..
They go after connected/linked sources after busts like this. Not the 165 lb gym dude who does curls 5x a week.

Take the labels off your vials and put some essential oil label on it iif you’re worried.

i knew a few sketch balls back in the day who had amounts of other drugs that would not be favorable for them if caught. . They kept it all in the bathroom ready to flush it down the toilet if anyone came knocking… but you can still get charged for destroying evidence.

 

[PoorKitty]

In the past LE visits happend but often months to years later so you never know. Depending on the dosages that you ordered it can very unlikely, the police dont have the capacity to bust every guy who ordered 1-2 vials, they going for the bigger fish.

Thank you! Any idea about the threshold? Steroid orders are small personal amounts like for example 5 vials in total consisting of a few different steroids. But with ancillaries and other non-steroids stuff you can still quickly end up at USD 500-1000 which doesn't sound so small...

 

[PoorKitty]

Poorkitty…… really bro lol ?!?!

Surprised they didn’t bully you off the forum already just for having that username. ..
They go after connected/linked sources after busts like this. Not the 165 lb gym dude who does curls 5x a week.

Take the labels off your vials and put some essential oil label on it iif you’re worried.

i knew a few sketch balls back in the day who had amounts of other drugs that would not be favorable for them if caught. . They kept it all in the bathroom ready to flush it down the toilet if anyone came knocking… but you can still get charged for destroying evidence.

Do you talk specifically about Germany or the US? Very different laws and enforcement procedures...

Glad you like the name, no wonder Germans are renowned for their humor ;-)

 

[MindlessWork]

Liska gone? Wow.

 

[bobx]

Thank you! Any idea about the threshold? Steroid orders are small personal amounts like for example 5 vials in total consisting of a few different steroids. But with ancillaries and other non-steroids stuff you can still quickly end up at USD 500-1000 which doesn't sound so small...

Really no idea

 

[runway]

Thank you! Any idea about the threshold? Steroid orders are small personal amounts like for example 5 vials in total consisting of a few different steroids. But with ancillaries and other non-steroids stuff you can still quickly end up at USD 500-1000 which doesn't sound so small...

Since this is not Bavaria, you shouldn't expect anything. Worst case is you will get a letter from police asking you to come to local police office to talk with them about your order. Just ignore it, don't go and don't talk with them. A few months later you will get another letter saying something like case closed.

Just never order anything from Germany again.

A good rule of thumb is, if you are from Germany, never order from German sources. Always order from other EU countries, then you don't have to worry about cleaning your house in case a source gets busted.

 

[Mishka]

Hi all,
With our beloved Liska probably gone: How do you fellow German customers with typical personal use amount orders handle news of your source being busted in Germany? Do you clean house in anticipation of a LE visit or just keep the gear since you assume they will at most send you a letter threatening a fine?
On the one hand cleaning house means throwing away all gear, on the other hand even one vial of test is technically already beyond the felony amount for possession in Germany and apparently pure users have occasionally been prosecuted...
There is just so much conflicting info on the internet and the situation in Germany regarding legality of personal use seems to be much harsher than in virtually all other countries, so I'm interested in your attitudes and experiences!

Nope, I just live my life like b4 and look for an equally good source

 

[lukiss96]

Liska gone? Wow.

Holy shit, not good, life is unpredictable...

 

[M@NU]

Thank you! Any idea about the threshold? Steroid orders are small personal amounts like for example 5 vials in total consisting of a few different steroids. But with ancillaries and other non-steroids stuff you can still quickly end up at USD 500-1000 which doesn't sound so small...

if the would want to catch every single small fish they could just knock on the doors of those 100+ influencers who openly talk about steroid usage and their cycles etc on youtube/instagram.
if you have ordered for 20.000++€ during those 5 months then you might want to hide some of the stuff because this could be associated with dealing. Else there is not much to worry.
Imagine they could catch heroin / cocaine / ectasy etc consumer if they just waited at the front door of the rehab clinics

 

[amazonas]

Guys, you know that the parcels sent will be traced back to you, but LE doesn't know how much you've bought, only that it's "illegal". The bust article says Liska was selling antidepressants, insulin, and so-called "weight loss injection". Not just steroids. There is a huge difference between buying steroids vs buying antidepressants, insulin, or weight loss drugs in Germany I would imagine.

So how will they for sure prosecute you over something they can't prove?

 

[narta]

Because my name and address is in someone's database it means dick squat legally. You have to have possession in order to arrest let alone prosecute

 

[Dickwang]

Because my name and address is in someone's database it means dick squat legally. You have to have possession in order to arrest let alone prosecute

In the states if you travel to a different state to buy legal weed they scan your Id at the dispensary…

I’ve done that before… mostly for cbd/thc tinctures…

Wouldn’t be surprised if my info is in a database somewhere for

Out of state person traveling across state lines to buy legal drugs and bring back…

I never gave a shit though.

 

[santa.88]

You have to differentiate a little bit more:

1. If you're above the 'little amounts' (=geringe Menge) you're considered a dealer. And you are above that automatically with 1 vial (10ml) of anything.

2. It's not about getting arrested immediately. They're going for a search-warrant first. Depending on the situation they don't always need it.

3. Re-labeling or un-labeling is totally useless. They will confiscate everything they find suspicious and test(!) it.
The test/tests, if you have more than one vial/substance, will result in a factor like '12,1423 times more than the geringe Menge' and play a big part in the calculation of the fine you have to pay or sentence you get; it's weighed.

/e: In case you've ordered for €20k+ you should definately not just hide but move the stuff somewhere else not connected to your name. Not just in Bavaria.

 

[glizz]

Unfortunatly Germany's law about PEDs and and even certain Peptides are really a pain in the ass for the Consumer.
This is Germanys Anti Doping Law: AntiDopG - Gesetz gegen Doping im Sport

The "legal" amounts & Banned Drugs: DmMV - Verordnung zur Festlegung der nicht geringen Menge von Dopingmitteln

Keep in mind that this weight is purely moculear weight without the ester.
For example of you have a 5ML Vial of Test E, with the standart dosing of 250MG / ML. That means you have 1250mg of total drug weight. minus the Ester weight of 375 mg, you have 875mg purely of Testosterone. so you are 243 mg over the legal limit of 632mg testosterone. You will only get punished for the amount thats over the legal limit. But even than the punishments are kinda over the top. Keep in mind for some reason the amount of Transdermal Testosterone is 1500mg. You would be under the legal limit if you had 3ML of Test E 250mg.

Funnily enough the Judge can and will prosecute you even if you have a prescription for 10-20ml of Test E. Happend to me before, but i was also carrying accross the Dutch German Border. Your doctor can prescribe any medication basically without a limit here. You could get a Prescription for 20ML of Eifelfango Test E, and you will still get prosecuted under the AntiDopG. You would be under the legal limit if you ahd

In the past for drug related busts even small users have gotton their house searched. Because over time the amount purchased adds up to be over the endconsumer limit. They wont go after the smallest of small fish thats true, but dont expect for absolutly nothing to happen.

Encrypt your PC(Fully encrypt all of your HDDs with Veracrypt, with a min of 16-24 Charakters, with numbers and special charekters), Reset your Phone(Switch to GrapheneOS Pixel if you can, they are as far as today protected against UFED attacks, which the German Legal agencies do through Cellebrite ), and try to move Contrabanned to a different location. (Rent an Appartment, or rent one of those Self Storage Garages and dont keep the Key or Receipts in your house.) Use 1 eMail per Order and switch once its delivered. Dont use your own Bank Account to buy Crypto, use Bank Drops + Crypto Exchangers(Can be purchased quite easily usually, for low prices of 2-400€ this saves you if they try to go through your bank logs to find the crypto purchases. Can recommend Zen & N26 for EU.( Can be topped up using Cash in Germany and Poland, and both support crypto) USA a fully LVL 3 verified Cash Apps works. Dont Leave your Devices powered on over night.That way they can just grab the Encryption key out of your Ram. Try to do everything in your Power to if you happen to get your house searched, to switch them off.

Use a VPN, Mullvad or Perfect Privacy have proof that they dont log, because Europol keep constantly raiding their servers, and never finding any useful information. (Could go into detail why but idk if anyone would want that)

Ive had Multiple House searches happen from Multiple German Agencies due to all kinds of cases( starting from Money Laundering, Fraud, Identidy Theft and Steroids and so on) and if you got every aspect of what i told you are basically good to go, and they wont a solid enough file to prosecute you.

Even through technically they cant prosecute you for unrelated contrabanned items that are found during a house search, i`ve seen otherwise over the years.

Hope this helped someone out. Ive any of you got quesitons about staying safe i could make a even more detailed topic about this.

 

[Dickwang]

Encrypt your PC(Fully encrypt all of your HDDs with Veracrypt, with a min of 16-24 Charakters, with numbers and special charekters), Reset your Phone(Switch to GrapheneOS Pixel if you can, they are as far as today protected against UFED attacks, which the German Legal agencies do through Cellebrite ), and try to move Contrabanned to a different location. (Rent an Appartment, or rent one of those Self Storage Garages and dont keep the Key or Receipts in your house.) Use 1 eMail per Order and switch once its delivered. Dont use your own Bank Account to buy Crypto, use Bank Drops + Crypto Exchangers(Can be purchased quite easily usually, for low prices of 2-400€ this saves you if they try to go through your bank logs to find the crypto purchases. Can recommend Zen & N26 for EU.( Can be topped up using Cash in Germany and Poland, and both support crypto) USA a fully LVL 3 verified Cash Apps works. Dont Leave your Devices powered on over night.That way they can just grab the Encryption key out of your Ram. Try to do everything in your Power to if you happen to get your house searched, to switch them off.

So was this directions to follow just for personal use ?

Didn’t know it was that strict In Germany. But there’s a zero percent chance I’d do any of that for personal use… besides using an encrypted email….nor am I renting an apartment or storage unit to hide my personal use…

I’d just stop using steroids at that point …

Maybe if I was a source I’d follow those steps…but not as an average Joe trt user with a few vials of test…

Seems like it sucks to live in Germany…

 

[santa.88]

It sucks just a much as in other western countries.

Neverthelss, some of the precautions glizz mentions should be undertaken no matter where you live, except all - espacially dealing and possession - is totally legal.

LE is always keen to get names of (potential) sellers. If his OPSEC was/is as good as he suggested and he doesn't snitch, most of the buyers might be fine. It depends on him right now.

Btw. if they search your house and find barely anything or even nothing, they might don't even decrypt your HDD/devices. The Kripo (the US-equivalent would be the FBI) tends to outsource this service, which costs around 2 grand. Imagine they don't find anything and you're free to go in the end.

The state you live in might be decisive in terms of prosecution. Bavaria is worst place to be.

 

[laclark89]

In the states if you travel to a different state to buy legal weed they scan your Id at the dispensary…

I’ve done that before… mostly for cbd/thc tinctures…

Wouldn’t be surprised if my info is in a database somewhere for

Out of state person traveling across state lines to buy legal drugs and bring back…

I never gave a shit though.

oh man put the tin foil pipe down lmao

U smoked the whole once before u headed home solved no drugs in hand like Narta said.