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[Ghoul]

I definitely would not say that.
Some of these pharmaceutical companies are so large that they probably can afford not to care about alot of these regulations. A fine is just a slap on the wrist.

I'm just saying to not blindly put faith just because it is "pharma quality". Also one of the reasons i switched alot of my medications to US pharma (but yet it still comes from India lol)

India pharma is certainly a step below US pharma, but Sun is a billion dollar company that can be sued in the US. Slip ups are very costly (like $500 million costly, see below) and they have QA processes in place to avoid them. The FDA has shut down Indian pharma factories failing to meet standards. Those inspections aren't simple or easy to pass and required standards are (now) equal to those US plants have to meet...if they sell in the US or have pending applications to sell in the US. I try to use India pharma companies that have US exposure.

This is a great read on how India generic pharma works and how bad, really bad, it was not too long ago. This expose got things somewhat turned around in India.

The audiobook's enjoyably narrated if you're into those:

Amazon.com

But as bad as India pharma is, there is no reason whatsoever to have faith that Chinese UGLs do anything for safety or quality that would add 5¢ to the process as long as they don't think it'll be discovered and interfere with sales. This is a place where manufacturers still get caught adding kidney destroying melamine to baby formula so protein content tests higher than it really is.

Jano found 20% of peptide samples were unsterile, and it's probobly more than that since the tests only check for 5 common bacteria. I guarantee you Serostim and other lyophilized pharma meds in the US are sterile. Lyophilization machines are cheap. Aseptic clean rooms are expensive.

 

[Spaceman Spiff]

I understand what you're saying, and the same with cheap vials. I'd rather be safe than sorry and the oil is cheap enough that it is still worth it. Someone else brought up EO, which I read about in the homebrew threads but still dont know what it is. I haven't ever tried chinese oils and want to know, it makes sense that they would cut corners. It also has me thinking because the raw shortage that domestic sources are just buying chinese oil, filtering it and then reselling it in new vials

Some top Sources may have hoarded 50+ kilos of gear over the years.

Some of these smaller ones that appeared out of nowhere may be doing what you are suggesting

 

[pheno609]

If those Chinese oils have EO (which is likely the case), it is likely they will not last as long as the other oils you have. EO has a much shorter shelf life, same for GSO.



How is this done for pharmaceutical peps that can't handle heat? Gamma radiation?

What exactly is EO, is it like a super solvent to keep the gear from crashing like the guacigol or whatever its called. Please dont rip me because I have limited knowledge with brewing

 

[AllGoodThings]

What exactly is EO, is it like a super solvent to keep the gear from crashing like the guacigol or whatever its called. Please dont rip me because I have limited knowledge with brewing

Ethyl oleate, a solvent. It's not as bad as guaiacol to most, but still has inflammatory properties and other qualities that make people avoid it.

 

[pheno609]

Ethyl oleate, a solvent. It's not as bad as guaiacol to most, but still has inflammatory properties and other qualities that make people avoid it.

So benzyl benzoate is the preferred solvent that many domestic sources use and benzyl alcohol is added for anti bacterial purposes right?

 

[BamaCrazy]

What exactly is EO, is it like a super solvent to keep the gear from crashing like the guacigol or whatever its called. Please dont rip me because I have limited knowledge with brewing

As he said above it’s a solvent. It does help keep certain compounds in solution and it also thins out the oil for a smoother injection. It disperses well and most people have no allergic reaction to it. But some people do. But it’s nowhere near as toxic as guaiacol.

 

[AllGoodThings]

So benzyl benzoate is the preferred solvent that many domestic sources use and benzyl alcohol is added for anti bacterial purposes right?

That's correct as far as I know, but I'm far from knowledgeable on the subject

 

[Oldhand]

Did anyone try SSA‘s reta?

Yes, but not long enough to say if it is working or not. I can say it reconstituted perfectly clear. No issues after pinning either.

I used up another sources stuff and am on my first vial of SSA Reta now.

 

[AnTabolic73]

What exactly is EO, is it like a super solvent to keep the gear from crashing like the guacigol or whatever its called. Please dont rip me because I have limited knowledge with brewing

Ethyl oleate is more a carrier oil than a solvent. It does have solvent properties. But you mainly use it to thin out your carrier oil. For e.g. instead of using 100% grapeseed oil, you could use 50/50 gso/eo.

Its not unheard of to use 100% eo for brews. Or at least once upon a time it wasn't. People say its toxic. Others love it. Ive never used it.

 

[Ghoul]

So benzyl benzoate is the preferred solvent that many domestic sources use and benzyl alcohol is added for anti bacterial purposes right?

Technically "bacteriostatic" purposes. They prevent bacteria from multiplying. Keeping their population "static". The concentration needed to kill bacteria is much higher than used in injectables.

 

[pheno609]

Ethyl oleate is more a carrier oil than a solvent. It does have solvent properties. But you mainly use it to thin out your carrier oil. For e.g. instead of using 100% grapeseed oil, you could use 50/50 gso/eo.

Its not unheard of to use 100% eo for brews. Or at least once upon a time it wasn't. People say its toxic. Others love it. Ive never used it.

I thought many of the chinese sources claim to use mct though because it's the most popular. I could be wrong and confusing that with domestic sources though, I haven't really looked into chinese oils because I didnt want to have to deal with customs

 

[BamaCrazy]

I thought many of the chinese sources claim to use mct though because it's the most popular. I could be wrong and confusing that with domestic sources though, I haven't really looked into chinese oils because I didnt want to have to deal with customs

We asked JY once for his Test E recipe. He sent the below.

Test E
335mg/ml
3% BA
22.5% BB
22.5% EO

Without testing you’ll never know what’s in the China gear. I guess that can be said about Domestic also.

 

[readalot]

We asked JY once for his Test E recipe. He sent the below.

Test E
335mg/ml
3% BA
22.5% BB
22.5% EO

Without testing you’ll never know what’s in the China gear. I guess that can be said about Domestic also.

Going to ask Jano if he will bundle HPLC and GCMS at a discount. Would be a useful package unless he has a separate EO test for less? I didn't think he did.

 

[dick_starbuck]

Ethyl oleate is more a carrier oil than a solvent. It does have solvent properties. But you mainly use it to thin out your carrier oil. For e.g. instead of using 100% grapeseed oil, you could use 50/50 gso/eo.

Its not unheard of to use 100% eo for brews. Or at least once upon a time it wasn't. People say its toxic. Others love it. Ive never used it.

This.

I say this every time I see EO brought up. Its a carrier oil with a higher ability to hold a solute than other oils while being much more viscous than most oils. This creates a thinner solution that can hold higher mg/ml than a standard GSO or MCT.

It is much more benign than guaiacol and shouldn't be thought of as the same thing.

If youre allergic to EO, stay away from CN oils. If you've been using CN oils and have no issues, chances are you've been using EO and you'll be fine.

 

[BamaCrazy]

Going to ask Jano if he will bundle HPLC and GCMS at a discount. Would be a useful package unless he has a separate EO test for less? I didn't think he did.

I think he does. The question was asked and think he said he could test for EO and guaiacol for a small fee. I’ll see if I can find that post.

 

[readalot]

The idea is that pharma is perfectly, 100% sterile after terminal sterilization. Any compromise of the vial could introduce bacteria that could, over time multiply to the point of causing an infection. They don't want a vial pierced and reused months later.

Sterile filtration isn't 100% effective. As a practical matter what really protects against a vial becoming overrun with bacteria is the bacteriostatic environment created by benzyl alcohol. Just use proper aseptic technique. Sterilize the stopper, use a sterile syringe, and the amount of bacteria you'd introduce into a new sterile vial is inconsequential and not going to overcome the bacteriostatic environment, A good quality stopper fully heals, but to be extra certain, there's a sterile vial sealing sticker you can use to ensure the stopper is fully sealed.

Edit: I see you found the sticker.

Here's an anecdote purely for entertainment. I have pushed in air and pulled out oil intermittently over 9 months with the same 10 ml vial. No issues with proper technique.

 

[readalot]

I think he does. The question was asked and think he said he could test for EO and guaiacol for a small fee. I’ll see if I can find that post.

Thanks. I will check it out.

 

[readalot]

I think he does. The question was asked and think he said he could test for EO and guaiacol for a small fee. I’ll see if I can find that post.

Post in thread 'Janoshik Analytical laboratory testing services'

May 17, 2025

We are getting a bit overwhelmed so I might be missing social media / forum questions.

Guaiacol is only qualitative.
EO is only semi-quantiative via GCMS screening.

BA is actually *too* volatile to encompass in a screening which is supposed to show also high boiling point compounds, unfortunately.

Quote number #25043 :
-------------------------
1x BA/BB testing x 30 USD = 30 USD
1x Guaiacol in AAS oil x 15 USD = 15 USD
1x GCMS screening x 170 USD = 170 USD
-------------------------
TOTAL: 215 USD

This offer remains valid until May 31, 2025.

• janoshik

• 
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Yep, ethyl oleate via GCMS. Would be nice to package with HPLC for discount but he will say no, haha.

Few will pay all that to screen their cheap Chinese oils. But useful for domestic screen right now.

 

[BamaCrazy]

Thanks. I will check it out.

Ok. No to EO. Yes to guaiacol

 

[Ghoul]

Here's an anecdote purely for entertainment. I have pushed in air and pulled out oil intermittently over 9 months with the same 10 ml vial. No issues with proper technique.

The biggest threat with long term storage safety in this scenario may be a pierced stopper that doesn't heal properly allowing the BA to evaporate off and any residual bacteria becoming active. But we're talking a very long time, and the vial seal should eliminate that already low probability. .