Sust log /dennis

[Big_Brad29]

Good to see your log Dennis! I hope everything will go good! Too bad i am leaving at Tuesday, 13. The army can't wait.

Let God keep you safe!
Be safe and watch you back and your comrades backs!! good luck!!

 

[juggernaught]

There has to be an impact on ability via state of mind...

Most of our strength comes from the ability to recruit muscle cells appropriately and then to increase the signaling speed as opposed to actual capacity of the cells. As the cells stretch under tension the muscle spindle sends impulses to the spinal cord to 'notify' the body that it is under tension. When that tension extends for a period of time >~5 seconds the golgi tendon signals the spinal cord that potential damage may occur and overrides other impulses, actually preventing the muscle from continuing the movement or contraction. Over time we adapt to repeated effort and our nervous system upgrades our responses so that we can add additional resistance and/or stretch to a movement because it believes that it can be done safely without damaging the muscle. This is why beginners put up more weight quickly, there muscles aren't growing larger, but they are becoming more efficient at using those muscles.

I know this is pretty specific to neurological adaptation with regards to weight training, but it has a clear cross application to motivational desire and state of mind. Think about those strange instances everyone has heard of where super-human strength was exhibited by someone who would otherwise never be capable. Androgens certainly have an effect on signaling and strength, but there must also be some kind of effect from the self-knowledge that AAS is inside, working it's magic, hence allowing the mind to believe that it is stronger.

What do you think?

I agree Fraggle , how often do you hear of someone getting huge strength increases the first few weeks of a cycle? Evon though they are taking a long ester that hasnt realized yet? We actualy see a placebo like effect, I know I did during my first sevral cycles lol.......

 

[solo47]

Let God keep you safe!
Be safe and watch you back and your comrades backs!! good luck!!

So which is it God, playing safe, or luck?

Solo

 

[solo47]

RE: The "Fraggle Taper".

Sounds reasonable, but you gotta realize that such a taper would mean only one cycle a year. I'm beginning to think that, as I get into my second half-century, that should be enough.

Another unpleasant truth izzat those long esters already allow for a natural taper, if you let them. What I mean is: I really love doing Test P and/or Tren Ace during the two or three weeks after final injection and maybe through final HCG recovery and up to the start of Nolva-Clomid PCT, BUT it now seems clear to me that those short ester blasts at the end of a long cycle do not allow (a) the long esters to naturally taper out of your system (really takes at least a month), or (b) the HCG to stimulate the testicles back to full size & production.

What I mean izzat a short taper is already available "naturally" from long ester AAS. (Still, I'm feeling so robust these days, a really long taper, Fraggle-style or otherwise, sounds like a wonderful idea.)

Solo

 

[dennis]

RE: The "Fraggle Taper".

Sounds reasonable, but you gotta realize that such a taper would mean only one cycle a year. I'm beginning to think that, as I get into my second half-century, that should be enough.

Another unpleasant truth izzat those long esters already allow for a natural taper, if you let them. What I mean is: I really love doing Test P and/or Tren Ace during the two or three weeks after final injection and maybe through final HCG recovery and up to the start of Nolva-Clomid PCT, BUT it now seems clear to me that those short ester blasts at the end of a long cycle do not allow (a) the long esters to naturally taper out of your system (really takes at least a month), or (b) the HCG to stimulate the testicles back to full size & production.

What I mean izzat a short taper is already available "naturally" from long ester AAS. (Still, I'm feeling so robust these days, a really long taper, Fraggle-style or otherwise, sounds like a wonderful idea.)

Solo

Solo makes more good points here guys.And solo, I cannot imagine you of all people considering only 1 cycle per year ???!!!!!Fraggle..great points as well...mind over matter..the power of positive thinking.

 

[neocount]

So do you feel that it would be better to do the Prop blasts 2 weeks before the last injection of long ester rather than 2 weeks after the last?

 

[solo47]

So do you feel that it would be better to do the Prop blasts 2 weeks before the last injection of long ester rather than 2 weeks after the last?

Just thinking this through, there's no practical reason to do "prop blasts" at all. After your last long ester inject, they will only cause a sudden drop-off in your test levels when you stop & they'll combat the benefits of HCG. If you must do a prop blast (and I do), why not do them during your last two weeks of the cycle? I guess I'm saying it makes sense to me, but, man, prop & lots of HCG is horn-dog heaven.[}]

Ah well, sacrifices must be made...

Solo

 

[neocount]

Solo, so I'm slightly confused...
Normally I'd have my last long ester inject and then do 2 weeks of prop EOD until I start PCT.
Is this what you are saying, or are you suggesting it might be better to do 2 weeks of Prop
ending on the day you do your last long ester inject?

 

[Fraggle]

The long esters don't really act as a taper. They drop off much too fast to allow your body to compensate and restart production of endogenous testosterone.

For a competitive BB, it's not going to work anyway. They're going to be on cycle virtually all year. But for someone who wants to facilitate body re-composition with minimum sides and great recovery, it's definitely worth trying.

Fraggle

 

[Fraggle]

OK, here's something unresolved in my mind about end-of-cycle short ester use.

1) SHBG is going to increase during the course of the cycle.
2) The more mass gained, the more difficult to regain homeostasis and retain those gains.

So, wouldn't it make more sense to front-load as opposed to back-load? When the body can actually use the higher androgen appropriately?

 

[BILLYGRINGO]

OK, here's something unresolved in my mind about end-of-cycle short ester use.

1) SHBG is going to increase during the course of the cycle.
2) The more mass gained, the more difficult to regain homeostasis and retain those gains.

So, wouldn't it make more sense to front-load as opposed to back-load? When the body can actually use the higher androgen appropriately?

Front loading always makes sense with a long acting ester! Back loading is good too with a short acting ester like PROP,

thats why doing prop blasts is awesome

 

[Fraggle]

But once again, sex-hormone binding globulin levels are elevated by the end of a cycle, so the raw ability to gain from the AAS is significantly reduced. Why close out with more steroids at the point when they are least effective?

You pay for minimal gains at that point with an extra dosing of side effects.

Fraggle

 

[solo47]

Solo, so I'm slightly confused...
Normally I'd have my last long ester inject and then do 2 weeks of prop EOD until I start PCT.
Is this what you are saying, or are you suggesting it might be better to do 2 weeks of Prop
ending on the day you do your last long ester inject?

I'm saying it's probably better to do two weeks of Prop ending on the day you do your last long ester inject (or do no backloading at all). BigBench & Dennis have been suggesting the other way, after, so I tried it & loved it. BUT there was quite a fall after I completed HCG & began Nolva-Clomid PCT (which got worse when the Nolva-Clomid ended). Plus my boys did not return to full size until I stopped the Prop & let the HCG do its thing. Thus my reasoning. I'll respond to Fraggle below.

Solo

 

[solo47]

The long esters don't really act as a taper. They drop off much too fast to allow your body to compensate and restart production of endogenous testosterone.

Fraggle, I can't prove to you that such "natural" tapering works, but it's been one of the major reasons for the switch to longer esters over the last decade or two. The idea was that things like Sust, Test E, & EQ (or even Tren E) obviate the need for a planned long-lasting taper precisely because they don't leave your system, in reality, until about six weeks have gone by. This six weeks along with an HCG run, plus the Nolvadex & maybe Clomid are generally agreed to work better toward recovery than a prolonged taper. Why? Because during your prolonged taper you are still "on", no matter how you kid yourself psychologically. But it's not all psychological: since you're still "on" even on lower doses, you'll feel "on" too. The thinking izzat what you're calling a taper is actually a dangerously extended cycle.

For myself, I'm not sure, but the reasoning above has become widely accepted and it makes sense to me.

Solo

 

[solo47]

Front loading always makes sense with a long acting ester! Back loading is good too with a short acting ester like PROP,

thats why doing prop blasts is awesome

I agree that back-loading with Test p, especially while one is doing HCG daily, is awesome to the max. The question is whether or not such back-loading assists, has no effect, or harms recovery of the HPTA. I'm thinking it harms the recovery since the drop off from a full testosterone treatment to no testosterone supplements is so sudden that the body may just cease producing its own test at all for a while.

(I'd like to be proven otherwise on this since I have plenty of Test prop on hand for when my current cycle ends in late July, er August, or maybe September.)

Solo

 

[dennis]

Wow , more great discussion ! I love,as you all know using prop or var at end of cycles for the insane strength gains,the added couple of weeks of great libido.I am speaking of using it after last shot of long esthers for 2-3 weeks.Now, about long esthers being a natural taper..only sust is designed to work that way..regular test enth or cyp will drop rapidly out of your system.solo may be right about me tapering down for many weeks using sust..it could be a dangerously long cycle..remember"shut down is shut down".But..if you are using taper can your natural test start coming back on line as you drop mgs of synthetic test each week ???The old school guys believe it can.About my cycle... I think I am at 60 days now..started april 28th.I am not gaining anymore weight...I am sitting today 12 pounds heavier than on april 28th.I have no atrophy,have not used hcg.I feel good but really have the urge to up my dosage.I do not feel the test high anymore.The libido is calming a bit..I only want sex like eod now.My workouts are good,recovery good,body comp good.I am having trouble sleeping at night,am grinding my teeth at night.I am starting to dread the day I have to come off.My wifes var cycle is coming along really well..our libidos are both increased at the same time..that is a great thing !I guess the delima here is 1. Taper dosage down then start pct or 2. Use prop eod for last 2 -3 weeks of cycle and then start pct. I am honestly leaning towards slow steady taper....

 

[dennis]

So you're doing no extra Test p?

If not, you may find your initial love affair with that small amount of Sust will dissipate as you go on in weeks. The body will react to the small amount of Test p in the Sust initially but then will cease to do so unless the amount (of Test p) is increased.

Or so my experience tells me.

Keep us posted. Everything is relevant so let your mind flow free.

Solo

boy solo..were you ever right !

 

[dennis]

Having problems with my wife to. NOt on quite as high of dose as you on the sust. 250 every 4 days. First cycle and this shit is great! If anyone figures out how to get your wife to get busy 3 or 4 times a day let me know. Good post dennis. 80 some responses is pretty good.

get your wife started on 10 mgs of anavar daily..that should do the trick....

 

[EPOWER]

D, the avatar. Very nice!

E

 

[dennis]

D, the avatar. Very nice!

E

We are both very lucky men E ! Thanks....