Can touching a barbell in the gym get you sick with the coronavirus?

[Michael Scally MD]

The primary way of person-to-person corona virus transmission is via aerosols or small droplets created by breathing, sneezing or coughing. The reach of exhaled air can be effectively reduced using a face mask as shown in the video.

A simple Schlieren imaging technique is applied to visualize the air flow caused by a person breathing and coughing. Using a face mask the exhaled air flow is blocked reducing effectively the risk of infection. Also nicely shown is the heat transfer from the body to the cooler ambient air.

 

[Michael Scally MD]

 

[ickyrica]

View attachment 128010

The wife and I were talking about the virus in a visual context, just like your post. If you could actually see the virus in a physical form would you be going out?

I say it's a toss up. Can't say until I can see it, but if I had to make an educated guess I'd stay in right now

 

[Jankauskas]

The wife and I were talking about the virus in a visual context, just like your post. If you could actually see the virus in a physical form would you be going out?

I say it's a toss up. Can't say until I can see it, but if I had to make an educated guess I'd stay in right now

I absolutely would go out, seeing it would make it easy to avoid it.

 

[Old]

So, after new science comes to light about a disease's transmission, sue the people that have to deal with an emerging global pandemic and make suggested guidelines for public safety? Maybe we use that science to augment current standards rather than place blame for not having a crystal ball and knowing all right off the rip? The fact someone would actually entertain legal action like this other worldly short sighted. Talk about biting the hand that feeds, weak as fuck.

Who really is the hand feeding?

Liability is a curious issue. Businesses and individuals get sued all the time. The current president threatens lawsuits for people quoting him. So should public organizations and governments be exempt?

While the MIT study of 27 feet is technically new - and that does not even take into account 'upwind' vs 'downwind' - the idea of social distancing is helpful, but hardly full proof. So 6 feet was supposed to be safe but 70 inches is too close? It actually doesn't take much thought to understand that 6 feet is better than 2 feet but most people don't like to think and instead conclude that 6 feet is totally safe.

One thing highlighted here is the need for masks. Yet repeatedly and persistently we have been told that they are not needed. Now we suddenly are being told to make our own. Yet masks are part of how China and South Korea significantly slowed down this virus. And the latter didn't shut down. Instead they started making masks, medical ventilators, etc. Why hasn't USA started making enough masks for their citizens - let alone their doctors?

In another thread, Corona hits home, a members works in a hospital and has only one mask per shift. Yet the government repeatedly says it has things under control.

Now are masks 100%? No. But being told its all under control, masks are not needed, its a hoax, etc. influences people to think precautions are not really needed. For example, my aunt asked her neighbor yesterday why she doesn't use a mask when she goes in public. The response was, "I don't need to because the president doesn't wear one".

But back to social distancing announcements, where are there medical studies demonstrating that 2 meters or 6 feet are safe with any airborne contagion? It would make sense that guidelines be based on science - especially when announced from scientific/health organizations. Is there no accountability for this?

 

[master.on]

Who really is the hand feeding?

Liability is a curious issue. Businesses and individuals get sued all the time. The current president threatens lawsuits for people quoting him. So should public organizations and governments be exempt?

While the MIT study of 27 feet is technically new - and that does not even take into account 'upwind' vs 'downwind' - the idea of social distancing is helpful, but hardly full proof. So 6 feet was supposed to be safe but 70 inches is too close? It actually doesn't take much thought to understand that 6 feet is better than 2 feet but most people don't like to think and instead conclude that 6 feet is totally safe.

One thing highlighted here is the need for masks. Yet repeatedly and persistently we have been told that they are not needed. Now we suddenly are being told to make our own. Yet masks are part of how China and South Korea significantly slowed down this virus. And the latter didn't shut down. Instead they started making masks, medical ventilators, etc. Why hasn't USA started making enough masks for their citizens - let alone their doctors?

In another thread, Corona hits home, a members works in a hospital and has only one mask per shift. Yet the government repeatedly says it has things under control.

Now are masks 100%? No. But being told its all under control, masks are not needed, its a hoax, etc. influences people to think precautions are not really needed. For example, my aunt asked her neighbor yesterday why she doesn't use a mask when she goes in public. The response was, "I don't need to because the president doesn't wear one".

But back to social distancing announcements, where are there medical studies demonstrating that 2 meters or 6 feet are safe with any airborne contagion? It would make sense that guidelines be based on science - especially when announced from scientific/health organizations. Is there no accountability for this?

I'm surprised that nobody has caught that they just said to the American people: "you're too stupid to wear masks"
While I agree that many people don't realize that masks should fit tight, even using tape if needed, that can easily be taught.

 

[ickyrica]

Who really is the hand feeding?

every check that hits a personal account, businesses that can keep people gainfully employed because of stimulus infusion, the weeks of paid leave that have been added to the countries workforce. The boiler plate rendition of it is nauseating, I stopped reading after a half hour. There will be more financial help as well, direct to consumer. Some of this is currently hitting the checking accounts of about 75 employees at my work. I understand these are tax dollars so we could get cute and play word games, but that's the context of my post.

Is there no accountability for this?

if I worked in a hospital and they weren't ready to support a global pandemic I would blame the hospital, the hospitals governing body, etc. It's their job to maintain that supply. We have a federal stockpile if you will but that was never intended to supply an entire country endlessly. If that was the intention, every administration fucked that up royally and Trump just got short straw by being the sitting president.

Social distancing when everyone stays at home works just fine. That's not how people are living where the stressed communities are, are they? Don't turn a blind eye to the societal missteps. NYC? LA? Detroit? Florida? NOLA? Each one of these areas had major breakdowns in the communities ability to listen to and head the warnings. Massive gathers continued and you get what we've got going on today. Each one of these states governors made massive errors in allowing their cities to continue to function. I'd say that easily surpasses any accountability the feds may be on the hook for.

Going into your local Market Basket and grabbing some food while keeping a few yards apart from one another is fine. Keep the fucking socializing to a minimum, that's it. Wash your hands and change your clothes when you you get home.

Accountability. Lol.

I'd blame the tobacco company too, if I got cancer after 35 years of ripping butts and hacking up a lung. Who knew hacking up a lung would be a tell tale sign of disaster on the horizon? Just like who knew mingling with large crowds of people as the federal government is telling people to stay home unless essential would be deadly?

Accountability is a funny perspective.

Back to Market Basket for a second. They're negligent and I could sue them, right? I mean, if I get covid I probably got it there because that's basically the only place I go. Works for me.

Your accountability shit list should start with the direct failure point. The medical centers. It works out from there. Your biggest winners on the failure list are the governors. They, imo, should be (and I think are) directly responsible for their states welfare. The feds can shoulder their fair share of blame, I'd agree. But a lawsuit? Really? Let's run up 5/6 trillion in covid disaster relief and then class action the mother fuckers to the tune of what? Another trillion? That'll work out around 3k per person. Worth the debt? Add the litigation cost to that as well. Why not.

I love this billboard I saw the other day while driving to work (yes, I have work as I'm "essential". It's debatable but I like money so I go) that said "your grandparents were called to war, you're being called to sit on your couch." Massive disconnect between what happened in reality and what was asked of the general public. This American generation couldn't stay home for a few weeks.

To dump blame on one specific source is a short sighted blame game, very political in a time when humanity is needed. Politics and humanity are not synonymous, on either political side.

I'll end my editorial now

 

[Michael Scally MD]

 

[Old]

To dump blame on one specific source is a short sighted blame game, very political in a time when humanity is needed. Politics and humanity are not synonymous, on either political side.

I'm surprised that nobody has caught that they just said to the American people: "you're too stupid to wear masks"
While I agree that many people don't realize that masks should fit tight, even using tape if needed, that can easily be taught.

It might help if folks actually read the article. Posting it again (which is one man's viewpoint) BREAKING NEWS! Covid-19 Prevention: New Study Proves That Social Distancing Of 1 to 3 Meters Is Nothing But Fake News and Misinformation - Thailand Medical News

He does say, which is perhaps inflammatory "we strongly advocate that individuals and the public worldwide start taking legal actions and class suits against all sites, experts and authorities advocating social distancing of between 1 to 3 meters as these ignorant buffoons are actually endangering the lives of many."

"To make matters worse, since the beginning of this Covid-19 breakout, we have allowed government authorities, health officials, unreliable medical experts and academics, social media platforms and search engines and also health organizations to get away with fake news and misinformation."​

So no one individual or country is being singled out. The context is regarding social distancing as a solution rather than something that is helpful.
If you care to read other editorials from this gentleman in Thailand, you will see blame for misinformation towards WHO among others (not an American organization). In these he points out science then known about Covid19 by WHO and how it was thus ignored, probably political reasons.


As for masks (again), note what the Surgeon General said over a month ago Face masks: Surgeon general wants Americans to stop buying them - CNN

"Seriously people… STOP BUYING MASKS! They are NOT effective in preventing general public from catching Coronavirus, but if healthcare providers can't get them to care for sick patients, it puts them and our communities at risk!"​

Now we are supposed to make our own because they are important for the general public. Naturally, health care worker should have priority. And that likely was the real motive. But in reality, good masks were no longer available at the time of this message, so it didn't help and said something that was not true.

The science did not changed, but now the message has. Look at photos in other countries in January and February, particularly China and South Korea. Masks are part of what got things under control (though there are still new cases even now)

So you see, some people are upset when people could have been better protected and were not. And the delay in production of good masks ... why? Is this really the best we can do?

But then why should we when top officials were saying they aren't really needed. Should a company alter its production line to produce something that isn't actually needed and risk being stuck with inventories that will move slow? This is an example of the effects of not telling the truth.


As for lawsuits, IMO they are a waste of time and money. But here is an example of the president threatening lawsuits for essentially free speech ... and his words, quotes regarding Covid19.


There are others such videos including many people besides the president which one can Google if they wish. These are largely being presented for political reason - which is more ad nauseam.

I dislike politics and it isn't for political reasons that I've made these recent posts. As for my opinion, I'll quote an old proverb, "it does not belong to man to direct his own step".

This thread started with regard to catching Covid19 off surfaces (such as a barbell) - the Purell 'run'. So in the beginning of March, attention was diverted from the principle way this virus is spread (though it can be caught of surfaces).

I love this billboard I saw the other day while driving to work (yes, I have work as I'm "essential". It's debatable but I like money so I go) that said "your grandparents were called to war, you're being called to sit on your couch." Massive disconnect between what happened in reality and what was asked of the general public. This American generation couldn't stay home for a few weeks.

That is a great billboard, lol.

As you know, NY was hit early, thus hard. We are in "essential job" mode. My brother-in-law is working because his job is considered essential ... he works at a golf course.

 

[jJjburton]

The stats counters for the virus are so off its stupid. Its like they dont follow up with the recovery patients. West Chester had 260 deaths and 56 recovered. That makes Zero sense. This is all over.

Each state is showing a 50 % mortality rate according to those dam things. Example...100,000 infected 20,000 recovered 10,000 dead. Are the other 70,000 people really still sick?

they only care about deaths, just like the media.

 

[Jankauskas]

The stats counters for the virus are so off its stupid. Its like they dont follow up with the recovery patients. West Chester had 260 deaths and 56 recovered. That makes Zero sense. This is all over.

Each state is showing a 50 % mortality rate according to those dam things. Example...100,000 infected 20,000 recovered 10,000 dead. Are the other 70,000 people really still sick?

they only care about deaths, just like the media.

There was a sports data analyst that said in an article that compared to the job they do with sports statistics, that these covid statistics looked like an amateur job.

Also loved when a 20 year old woman died and that stayed at the top of the Apple news column for 4 days, so you didn’t even know for sure if it was only one person or if 3 or 4 20 year olds had died in that time frame.

 

[jJjburton]

There was a sports data analyst that said in an article that compared to the job they do with sports statistics, that these covid statistics looked like an amateur job.

Also loved when a 20 year old woman died and that stayed at the top of the Apple news column for 4 days, so you didn’t even know for sure if it was only one person or if 3 or 4 20 year olds had died in that time frame.

Its ridiculous. You never hear....8 people recovered in 3 days to get back with there families.

only new born dies and family is distrought. They should report both. Not just death.

 

[Jankauskas]

Its ridiculous. You never hear....8 people recovered in 3 days to get back with there families.

only new born dies and family is distrought. They should report both. Not just death.

Death is what sells

 

[Old]

The stats counters for the virus are so off its stupid. Its like they dont follow up with the recovery patients. West Chester had 260 deaths and 56 recovered. That makes Zero sense. This is all over.

Each state is showing a 50 % mortality rate according to those dam things. Example...100,000 infected 20,000 recovered 10,000 dead. Are the other 70,000 people really still sick?

they only care about deaths, just like the media.

If you look at this site, Coronavirus Update (Live): 1,536,652 Cases and 89,907 Deaths from COVID-19 Virus Pandemic - Worldometer, you can see "total recovered". If you click on USA, then you have to do your own math with "total cases" - "active cases" - "total deaths" = recovered.

The numbers are skewed because cases are flooding in and it takes time to resolve (be it a good or bad outcome). Furthermore, most are not tested and don't get sick enough to go to the hospital, etc. In poorer countries, many will die without ever being tested to know if it was Covid19.

There isn't much point making sense of the numbers, just that it is serious ... and it contradicts the leaders of many countries and organizations. It might be helpful if they posted info for other flues as a comparison. And other causes of death.

Media sells on emotion. Mostly there has been a downplay ... but then one case gets reported.

Compare use of AAS. About 4,000,000 men use them in USA. Conservatively 50 to 100 million worldwide. They aren't dying like flies. But every so often the media reports a death and make it seems that all AAS users are dying like flies, etc. Yet how many times have see seen this with type II diabeties, or obesity? They are dying like flies, lol - too many donuts.

It is hard to find truth and the media is the worst source. It dumbs down and manipulates. But people want it this way.

Death is what sells

Sadly, people have an obsession with negative things, just as they prefer to watch the lives of others (voyeurism?) rather than live their own life to the full.

Well, starting in 9 months we are going to see an explosion of new life. Wonder where these can be born safely given the projection of 1-2 years for pandemics like this?, lol.

 

[Jankauskas]

If you look at this site, Coronavirus Update (Live): 1,536,652 Cases and 89,907 Deaths from COVID-19 Virus Pandemic - Worldometer, you can see "total recovered". If you click on USA, then you have to do your own math with "total cases" - "active cases" - "total deaths" = recovered.

The numbers are skewed because cases are flooding in and it takes time to resolve (be it a good or bad outcome). Furthermore, most are not tested and don't get sick enough to go to the hospital, etc. In poorer countries, many will die without ever being tested to know if it was Covid19.

There isn't much point making sense of the numbers, just that it is serious ... and it contradicts the leaders of many countries and organizations. It might be helpful if they posted info for other flues as a comparison. And other causes of death.

Media sells on emotion. Mostly there has been a downplay ... but then one case gets reported.

Compare use of AAS. About 4,000,000 men use them in USA. Conservatively 50 to 100 million worldwide. They aren't dying like flies. But every so often the media reports a death and make it seems that all AAS users are dying like flies, etc. Yet how many times have see seen this with type II diabeties, or obesity? They are dying like flies, lol - too many donuts.

It is hard to find truth and the media is the worst source. It dumbs down and manipulates. But people want it this way.



Sadly, people have an obsession with negative things, just as they prefer to watch the lives of others (voyeurism?) rather than live their own life to the full.

Well, starting in 9 months we are going to see an explosion of new life. Wonder where these can be born safely given the projection of 1-2 years for pandemics like this?, lol.

The economy won’t last like this for one or two years.

 

[MisterSuperGod]

Death is what sells

Keeps customers (viewers and readers) watching and clicking.

"Eye on the TV, 'cause tragedy thrills me."

 

[Old]

Keeps customers (viewers and readers) watching and clicking.

"Eye on the TV, 'cause tragedy thrills me."

The economy won’t last like this for one or two years.

It will, but there will be plenty of disappointment. Different. Stocks are going up right now. But then the market has always been at least 50% irrational emotions.

Here is a link interviewing a famous Epidemiologist The Doctor Who Helped Defeat Smallpox Explains What's Coming

While this is "the most dangerous pandemic in our lifetime", it could have been worse: “A billion people would get sick, As many as 165 million people would die. There would be a global recession and depression, and the cost to our economy of $1 to $3 trillion would be far worse for everyone than merely 100 million people dying, because so many more people would lose their jobs and their health care benefits, that the consequences are almost unthinkable.”

 

[Jankauskas]

It will, but there will be plenty of disappointment. Different. Stocks are going up right now. But then the market has always been at least 50% irrational emotions.

Here is a link interviewing a famous Epidemiologist The Doctor Who Helped Defeat Smallpox Explains What's Coming

While this is "the most dangerous pandemic in our lifetime", it could have been worse: “A billion people would get sick, As many as 165 million people would die. There would be a global recession and depression, and the cost to our economy of $1 to $3 trillion would be far worse for everyone than merely 100 million people dying, because so many more people would lose their jobs and their health care benefits, that the consequences are almost unthinkable.”

How would it be worse? The planet is overpopulated, even if 200 million people died, how would it be worse for the economy?
There’s always someone to take your job from your hands, and most of these people that would die would be the old and sick with some type of chronic illness, not the able workforce, so the impact couldn’t be as drastic.

Also less people to work would mean that your employers would also have to actually treat you like a person, instead of treating you like a piece of garbage that they can easily replace.

Everyone would have more rights, and they wouldn’t be able to make so many fucking job requirements so that you had to do stupid fucking paid formations to do your job because they actually needed you.

As it stands we are going into a global recession/depression anyway, so I really don’t see how letting this shit peak early so we could move on with our lives and get back to work would actually be worse that where it’s headed now.

Im no expert or economist, but I think it’s more of a question of common sense anyway...

 

[Old]

How would it be worse? The planet is overpopulated, even if 200 million people died, how would it be worse for the economy?
There’s always someone to take your job from your hands, and most of these people that would die would be the old and sick with some type of chronic illness, not the able workforce, so the impact couldn’t be as drastic.

Also less people to work would mean that your employers would also have to actually treat you like a person, instead of treating you like a piece of garbage that they can easily replace.

Everyone would have more rights, and they wouldn’t be able to make so many fucking job requirements so that you had to do stupid fucking paid formations to do your job because they actually needed you.

As it stands we are going into a global recession/depression anyway, so I really don’t see how letting this shit peak early so we could move on with our lives and get back to work would actually be worse that where it’s headed now.

Im no expert or economist, but I think it’s more of a question of common sense anyway...

Isolation is a humanitarian effort - not so much economic. As the vice president of India said, “Between the considerations of the health of the people and stabilization of our economy being debated, the former shall take precedence over the later. In my view, while the concerns of economy can wait for another day, that of health can’t"

Fewer buyers (because they died) mean less need for supplies, thus fewer jobs. Taking care of elderly/sick will be replaced with caring for babies. In either case, employers will probably not treat employees any better.

Supply disruptions will be a big problem. Nearly all the worlds medicine come from India, then China. Mass death in India will not help any more than their lockdown if extended.

Because much of our life is imported, the USA will have an adjustment period. Everything more expensive without the money to purchase - that is why job went oversees in the first place (cheap labor). Out standard of living will go down. The wealthy will do fine, of course ... except those who die.

I doubt we will ever have more rights. If we shift to military rule (dictatorship), will it eventually end up with our not just getting the rights we had, but more rights, or less?

Given that this virus has 4 separate inserts from the HIV virus, the question remains how (if) many people will be stuck sick. Or if this is a mild form of AIDS that happens to be airborne. This would mean that people who didn't get sick will years later have sicknesses.

There are plenty of "it could be worse" scenarios. This virus might have a 4% overall death rate. The Spanish flu had a death rate of >2.5% 1918 Influenza: the Mother of All Pandemics. Many non-elderly died with that one.

Now if this was Ebola that went pandemic, that has a 50% death rate (90% without medical help). Ebola is still active in Africa ... what if it goes out of control because those doctors are busy with this thing (or died from it)?

It is hard to count one's blessing with this curse. But this generation in America hasn't experienced hardship even near that of the Great Depression. Back then, 50% of the population lived on farms and could at least survive by their own hand. Today less than 2% are involved in agriculture - so self reliance isn't a ready option.

As a side, if you bought stocks in the top 100 companies at the start of the Great Depression, 11 years later, 97 of these companies still existed.

 

[Jankauskas]

Isolation is a humanitarian effort - not so much economic. As the vice president of India said, “Between the considerations of the health of the people and stabilization of our economy being debated, the former shall take precedence over the later. In my view, while the concerns of economy can wait for another day, that of health can’t"

Fewer buyers (because they died) mean less need for supplies, thus fewer jobs. Taking care of elderly/sick will be replaced with caring for babies. In either case, employers will probably not treat employees any better.

Supply disruptions will be a big problem. Nearly all the worlds medicine come from India, then China. Mass death in India will not help any more than their lockdown if extended.

Because much of our life is imported, the USA will have an adjustment period. Everything more expensive without the money to purchase - that is why job went oversees in the first place (cheap labor). Out standard of living will go down. The wealthy will do fine, of course ... except those who die.

I doubt we will ever have more rights. If we shift to military rule (dictatorship), will it eventually end up with our not just getting the rights we had, but more rights, or less?

Given that this virus has 4 separate inserts from the HIV virus, the question remains how (if) many people will be stuck sick. Or if this is a mild form of AIDS that happens to be airborne. This would mean that people who didn't get sick will years later have sicknesses.

There are plenty of "it could be worse" scenarios. This virus might have a 4% overall death rate. The Spanish flu had a death rate of >2.5% 1918 Influenza: the Mother of All Pandemics. Many non-elderly died with that one.

Now if this was Ebola that went pandemic, that has a 50% death rate (90% without medical help). Ebola is still active in Africa ... what if it goes out of control because those doctors are busy with this thing (or died from it)?

It is hard to count one's blessing with this curse. But this generation in America hasn't experienced hardship even near that of the Great Depression. Back then, 50% of the population lived on farms and could at least survive by their own hand. Today less than 2% are involved in agriculture - so self reliance isn't a ready option.

As a side, if you bought stocks in the top 100 companies at the start of the Great Depression, 11 years later, 97 of these companies still existed.

That thing you said about it the possibility of a this Being like a chronic disease, where did you get that info from?