"Generic" GH ASSAYS

[PrideofNYC123]

I agree with the last post.
It is still labeled as TP Grey Top when we don't know if it was from TP or if it was even "The Grey Tops". It is a poor result, but at this point, it is misleading to refer to it as from TP or thegreytop.

 

[rpbb]

Ask Mands yourself, Mr. wizard. Apparently, he's stated the Grey top sample came from a member at SF board. That person represented it came from TP but it's not been validated and he's apparently working on that. The source sampling and chain of custody is shot. Your sample collection methodology is flawed fatally. As I SAID, why bother advanced testing methods when your collection method is "some guy donated a grey top and said it was from TP." Jesus. Look how Millard collects samples at anaboliclab.com, straight from the supply chain, anonymously, no bs. Controlled chain of custody. Anyone who has seen my other posts on other boards knows I am not just some TP/grey top cheerleader. So alleging I'm incentivized or bias is false. But I have to call it like I see it. Your collection here is all jacked up and you have grey top results that's refute a pretty solid history of good labs and other testing results. I've yet to see any effort where sample collecting made a bit of sense. As I said PM's tests were screwed (SIMEC's fault) and their collection procedure was no better. What you have done here is possibly smear a decent gh branding with potentially flawed results of a sample that may not have been legit Greys or was old and not taken care of. Is misinformation better than lack of information? Probably.

if you had actually read the whole thread dipshit you would have seen the greytop sample was questionable at the beginning and nobody debated it. And if you had read the whole thread dipshit, you would have also known that Dr Jim has no idea who the samples are from and what the vendor is. So keep writing your ignorant no nothing comments

 

[mands]

I agree with the last post.
It is still labeled as TP Grey Top when we don't know if it was from TP or if it was even "The Grey Tops". It is a poor result, but at this point, it is misleading to refer to it as from TP or thegreytop.

It actually states under the description needs to confirm.

I have also spoke with TP and he has no record of the transaction with that particular member from another board.

I don't believe it misleading to call it the GreyTop. That's what it was sold and presented to me as. It could of well have been purchased from TheGreyTop website and not from TP. It's just a generic grey flip off top.

At this point I personally think it should be thrown out because we are not certain of it's origin.

mands

 

[G.I. Bro]

if you had actually read the whole thread dipshit you would have seen the greytop sample was questionable at the beginning and nobody debated it. And if you had read the whole thread dipshit, you would have also known that Dr Jim has no idea who the samples are from and what the vendor is. So keep writing your ignorant no nothing comments

I'm aware of all of that. I'm simply pointing out the blatant flaws I see. Mands is a stand up guy though (and not an ass like Jim). He's clearly being transparent about all of it with full disclosure. His interest in all this is the same as ours. Sometimes I'm seriously not sure about Jim. It's like he doesn't want to see a decent generic gh brand because he's been adamant forever that it can't really be (in terms of consistency) and pharma is the only way.

 

[mands]

I'm aware of all of that. I'm simply pointing out the blatant flaws I see. Mands is a stand up guy though (and not an ass like Jim). He's clearly being transparent about all of it with full disclosure. His interest in all this is the same as ours. Sometimes I'm seriously not sure about Jim. It's like he doesn't want to see a decent generic gh brand because he's been adamant forever that it can't really be (in terms of consistency) and pharma is the only way.

I don't believe JIM actually believes China or whoever cannot manufacture good GH. It's the fact that they are being sold on the black market with no restrictions or control.

He advocates Pharma because you know what you are getting. "Generics" can be good one day and bad the next if someone wanted them to be.

I believe there are some others reason. He can elaborate on those if he would like.

mands

 

[Dr JIM]

I'm aware of all of that. I'm simply pointing out the blatant flaws I see. Mands is a stand up guy though (and not an ass like Jim). He's clearly being transparent about all of it with full disclosure. His interest in all this is the same as ours. Sometimes I'm seriously not sure about Jim. It's like he doesn't want to see a decent generic gh brand because he's been adamant forever that it can't really be (in terms of consistency) and pharma is the only way.

 

[Dr JIM]

I'm aware of all of that. I'm simply pointing out the blatant flaws I see. Mands is a stand up guy though (and not an ass like Jim). He's clearly being transparent about all of it with full disclosure. His interest in all this is the same as ours. Sometimes I'm seriously not sure about Jim. It's like he doesn't want to see a decent generic gh brand because he's been adamant forever that it can't really be (in terms of consistency) and pharma is the only way.

Since when is full disclosure a "flaw" clown. So there's ONE out of roughly fifteen samples in which the vendor can not be identified.

Yep time to discontinue the entire thread, and "throw the baby out with the bath water".

Did you ever confirm that "standard problem"!

Pull your head out of your ASS, less they become ONE, lol!

 

[heady muscle]

This thread is back to name calling and yelling again. Boy, how very intellectual. Or should I say Ineffectual?

 

[PrideofNYC123]

Mands,

I see some notations about Glycine contaminants on the reports

SANDOZ OMNITROPE (generic)
1 Vial contains:
Somatropin 5.8 mg
Glycine 27.6 mg

If the somatropin is a pure protein without formulation buffer AAA will allow quantification of the protein using standard AAA.

However, if somatropin is formulated as a pharmaceutical drug for injection, a glycine buffer is used for the formulation. Therefore the glycine peak will be very large and comprise the data.

Are there additional steps (additional testing procedures) taken to give the correct quantification (microgram scale)



-Analyze somatropin aliquot by gel electrophoresis to verify the presence of the correct protein band

-Use UV absorbance at 280 nm to measure specific absorbance. To quantify use a NIST BSA standard for comparison


-Amino acid analysis (AAA) can be used if resulting data is corrected for the presence of excess glycine

Thanks

Bump to this


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[mands]

Bump to this


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So are you asking if aaa testing can quantity the difference per mg and separate the total mg. like the omnitrope ingredients? Sorry I'm not understanding the question.

Most pharmacy grade gh uses other ingredients like sucrose or sodium hydroxide. I've seen others but not glycine.

I might have to differ this question to @Dr JIM Or @jano

I just finished up the gym and on my phone. I'll reread when I get back home.

Sorry I missed this @ProfessorX

mands

 

[ProfessorX]

So are you asking if aaa testing can quantity the difference per mg and separate the total mg. like the omnitrope ingredients? Sorry I'm not understanding the question.

Most pharmacy grade gh uses other ingredients like sucrose or sodium hydroxide. I've seen others but not glycine.

I might have to differ this question to @Dr JIM Or @jano

I just finished up the gym and on my phone. I'll reread when I get back home.

Sorry I missed this @ProfessorX

mands

No worries Mands

With Tablets, Powders, Finished oils.....it's so much easier to get it tested

LC-MS/MS
GC-MS

Mg present, etc

I had posted this earlier because I contacted the Lab I used for my previous HGH samples

Intact Mass/Protein Characterization (Jin, God, Ang)

I was needing some info because I don't speak "Scientific"

I'm sending samples for:

Amino acid composition and distribution assay: UPLC-HRAM-MS measurement of 21 amino acids, reporting of concentration of each amino acid relative to total amino acid

I contacted an additional lab to send more samples

The back and forth communication was what I posted previous

Omnitrope 5.8mg/vial contains:

Somatropin - 5.6 mg
Glycine - 27.6 mg
Disodium hygdrogen phosphate heptahydrate - 2.09 mg
Sodium dihydrogen phosphate dihydrate - 0.56 mg

Lab stated:

Correction for AAA is done by using the correct protein sequence to calculate the theoretical amino acid ratios and comparing them to the experimental results. If the data correlate with the expected ratio of almost all the amino acids observed but show an excess of glycine, correction can be done to calculate the correct amount of protein in the sample.

Basically was needing some direction on what exact process you were using (Basic AAA)

But I think I got it figured out

With synthetic proteins it seems there are many tests and testing methods

Way above my pay scale buddy

 

[Mr MASSE]

Are there more tests in the pipeline or better I want to ask, can you please tell us about when the next tests are going public here?
And maybe what brands are tested next here...

 

[ickyrica]

Are there more tests in the pipeline or better I want to ask, can you please tell us about when the next tests are going public here?
And maybe what brands are tested next here...

The remainder of the results will be posted in the correlating thread. The results are based on random testing so my assumption is that the name of the brands tested will be released sporadically, with results.

 

[Dr JIM]

I read it all. It's mostly you and a few other people arguing like children and making zero progress. You always come out the most pompous though. Culling any useful info is quite difficult. Not sure who or what to believe. The thread is a fucking embarrassment. It makes the entire community look like a bunch of idiots.

Here's a suggestion. Why bother going through the trouble and expense of doing advanced testing when you guys can't even get a valid sample collection procedure in place. You should have asked Millard to advise you. Lol. Mands has no fucking idea if the Grey top sample came from TP? It came from some source on SF? He said it was from TP but it can't be validated? Your reference standard is also in question? Sample collection and chain of custody is easily the most important part of an endeavor like this. The very foundation (sample collection) appears fatally flawed. A problem shared by the PM testing project. Way to go... It's just fucking embarrassing. No wonder everyone thinks we're all meatheads.

This thread is back to name calling and yelling again. Boy, how very intellectual. Or should I say Ineffectual?

And as long as no nothing clowns like GI Bro, who prefer to "scan" rather than read the damn thread, continue to proclaim self indulging ignorance as one of enlightenment, I will be there to correct their nonsense, bc ignoring such bullshit is not an option IMO.

(And to think the GI Bro post I cited is
only one of several that prove how little this fool knew about this thread, the testing methodology, sample collection, its objectives, or the results already cited, utterly pathetic)

 

[Dr JIM]

Are there more tests in the pipeline or better I want to ask, can you please tell us about when the next tests are going public here?
And maybe what brands are tested next here...

1)
This is the second time you have asked this question and it tells me you have rarely if ever dealt with an ANALYTICAL LAB.

Hey Mr Lab man so "when will my results be ready oh in about 1-2 weeks"!

Oh great Mr MASSEE "the results will be ready in "1-2 weeks" and WHEN that doesn't happen, you'll be riding my ass but "Jim you said it would be one to two weeks and it's now 3 weeks"! BEEN THERE DONE THAT many times

So here's your answer; bc I avoid dealing with intangibles I've no control over, when the following comes to fruition

1) I' emailed a prelim report
2) I review the prelim repot
3) all questions are answered by the involved chemist
4) I'm emailed a final report
5) I review the final report
6) I forward the final report to MANDS
7) he reviews and or lists any questions he may have for the involved chemist
8) we both make a final effort to ensure the samples MATCH the data
9) we coordinate our schedules to ensure the VENDOR and SAMPLES data is released and posted on Meso in a near simultaneous manner


Oh yea there's much more involved than just posting "results" bc we want to get it ALL right the first time, and for that reason the best answer to your
question is; additional results will be posted when they are ready.

2) NOPE

 

[janoshik]

So are you asking if aaa testing can quantity the difference per mg and separate the total mg. like the omnitrope ingredients? Sorry I'm not understanding the question.

Most pharmacy grade gh uses other ingredients like sucrose or sodium hydroxide. I've seen others but not glycine.

I might have to differ this question to @Dr JIM Or @jano

I just finished up the gym and on my phone. I'll reread when I get back home.

Sorry I missed this @ProfessorX

mands

Glycine is indeed a buffer and is used as one - but it is not too common imo.

The rest of the question got answered by Mr. ProfessorX

 

[G.I. Bro]

Jim: everytime I check the thread you have re-quoted my initial posts from days ago and are still using my name and hurling dorky insults like only a big goof could. Only I've said nothing more to you. Did I get under your skin by highlighting a few accurate facts and pointing out what a giant tool everyone thinks you are? That's not my opinion, that's a general consensus. Even the people who back you concede you're obtuse and difficult. I'm not bothering to get in a back and forth name calling war like I've seen you childishly do with other members. I have no desire to engage you. It's pointless. You look like a clown on here much more than you realize. When people are making legit points, you ignore those too. You can't be told anything. All this does is erode your credibility. Do you not understand that? Everyone knows you're a pompous, difficult, stubborn ass who thinks he's the ultimate authority on things. Yet in posts past, I've seen you state inaccuracies, give bad advice or just say things that aren't entirely correct. There are other intelligent members who see you for what you are. You could change, but I doubt you have the ability with so many apparent character flaws. Your legacy within the community you devote so much energy to is sealed I'm afraid. Rest assured this is the majority opinion, my friend. And it's kind of sad because it's a waste of talent.

 

[rpbb]

Jim: everytime I check the thread you have re-quoted my initial posts from days ago and are still using my name and hurling dorky insults like only a big goof could. Only I've said nothing more to you. Did I get under your skin by highlighting a few accurate facts and pointing out what a giant tool everyone thinks you are? That's not my opinion, that's a general consensus. Even the people who back you concede you're obtuse and difficult. I'm not bothering to get in a back and forth name calling war like I've seen you childishly do with other members. I have no desire to engage you. It's pointless. You look like a clown on here much more than you realize. When people are making legit points, you ignore those too. You can't be told anything. All this does is erode your credibility. Do you not understand that? Everyone knows you're a pompous, difficult, stubborn ass who thinks he's the ultimate authority on things. Yet in posts past, I've seen you state inaccuracies, give bad advice or just say things that aren't entirely correct. There are other intelligent members who see you for what you are. You could change, but I doubt you have the ability with so many apparent character flaws. Your legacy within the community you devote so much energy to is sealed I'm afraid. Rest assured this is the majority opinion, my friend. And it's kind of sad because it's a waste of talent.

people here appreciate what Jim is doing and don't think he's a tool. you on the other hand, come here and contribute nothing but whining. if you don't like the thread, and don't appreciate the contribution that Dr J and mands are making to the cause, gtfo

 

[G.I. Bro]

people here appreciate what Jim is doing and don't think he's a tool. you on the other hand, come here and contribute nothing but whining. if you don't like the thread, and don't appreciate the contribution that Dr J and mands are making to the cause, gtfo

Has nothing to do with Mands or the general effort. It has to do with Jim being a huge belligerent ass. Mands is appreciated and so are his efforts. Even when the testing is criticized (by me) he handles it like an adult and acknowledges a clear issue. It's respectable. Instead, Jim goes on the attack and lashes out at anyone who disagrees with him or questions the procedures or data.

 

[rpbb]

Has nothing to do with Mands or the general effort. It has to do with Jim being a huge belligerent ass. Mands is appreciated and so are his efforts. Even when the testing is criticized (by me) he handles it like an adult and acknowledges a clear issue. It's respectable. Instead, Jim goes on the attack and lashes out at anyone who disagrees with him or questions the procedures or data.

most people after they turn 12 develop a thicker skin than you