HGH and burning fat

[may2021]

Is this true?

I mean, I notice better results with GH, but I am not sensitive enough to figure out, or it works too slowly for me to figure out, the differences between 2 iu and 3 iu and 4 iu and 5 and 6.

I think theoretically, timing - spread out through the day - is more important than the amount. I'm also not sure how someone that takes more than 6ius pharma a day (predicated is they are also doing a lot of other stuff) would be able to distinguish between the singular efficacy of GH combined with all the other shit they're also taking. Who knows.

 

[juicebro]

There's literally a study comparing different dosages on lipolysis.

There is a ceiling on lipolysis, and the highest GH dose for maximizing fat loss per administration is much lower than most people think.

As you can see here in the following study assessing the pharmacokinetics and acute lipolytic actions of GH, there were significant dose-response effects when comparing the incremental area under the curve of both free fatty acids and blood 3-hydroxy-butyrate following 0, 1, and 3 mcg/kg GH, whereas there were no differences between the responses following 3 and 6 mcg/kg GH [R].

The Most Effective GH Dose For Fat Loss Per Administration

Growth Hormone (GH) is often used to increase lipolysis. In this article I show what the most effective GH dose for fat loss is.

moreplatesmoredates.com

I understand nobody gives a fuck about studies here but you have to admit it is interesting to say the least.

 

[Methyl Mike]

There's literally a study comparing different dosages on lipolysis.

There is a ceiling on lipolysis, and the highest GH dose for maximizing fat loss per administration is much lower than most people think.

As you can see here in the following study assessing the pharmacokinetics and acute lipolytic actions of GH, there were significant dose-response effects when comparing the incremental area under the curve of both free fatty acids and blood 3-hydroxy-butyrate following 0, 1, and 3 mcg/kg GH, whereas there were no differences between the responses following 3 and 6 mcg/kg GH [R].

The Most Effective GH Dose For Fat Loss Per Administration

Growth Hormone (GH) is often used to increase lipolysis. In this article I show what the most effective GH dose for fat loss is.

moreplatesmoredates.com

I understand nobody gives a fuck about studies here but you have to admit it is interesting to say the least.

Mpmd made this vid when he didn't suck. I think its accurate.

 

[may2021]

There's literally a study comparing different dosages on lipolysis.

There is a ceiling on lipolysis, and the highest GH dose for maximizing fat loss per administration is much lower than most people think.

As you can see here in the following study assessing the pharmacokinetics and acute lipolytic actions of GH, there were significant dose-response effects when comparing the incremental area under the curve of both free fatty acids and blood 3-hydroxy-butyrate following 0, 1, and 3 mcg/kg GH, whereas there were no differences between the responses following 3 and 6 mcg/kg GH [R].

The Most Effective GH Dose For Fat Loss Per Administration

Growth Hormone (GH) is often used to increase lipolysis. In this article I show what the most effective GH dose for fat loss is.

moreplatesmoredates.com

I understand nobody gives a fuck about studies here but you have to admit it is interesting to say the least.

Using studies wasn't the point of my post - it was the subjective nature of gh use, timing and ones inability to objectively distinguish fat loss efficacy (much less Body Fat %), during a cycle loaded with other peds. I love science, btw and have read that article.

 

[lilhawk]

Is this true?

I mean, I notice better results with GH, but I am not sensitive enough to figure out, or it works too slowly for me to figure out, the differences between 2 iu and 3 iu and 4 iu and 5 and 6.

Yes. Big difference in 2iu and 6-8iu in terms of fat loss, fullness, etc. There is a reason pros, and really anyone uses the shit out of it. Hell at Junior Nationals 5 years ago guys openly talked about using 15-20iu of GH per day.

 

[may2021]

Yes. Big difference in 2iu and 6-8iu in terms of fat loss, fullness, etc. There is a reason pros, and really anyone uses the shit out of it. Hell at Junior Nationals 5 years ago guys openly talked about using 15-20iu of GH per day.

I seriously would like to do the daily 6-8 iu for a fat loss TEST ONLY. It seems like the lazy ass man's approach to it, if it actually worked. However, it actually working is questionable at best, as:

1. I've seen so many posts where people are completely off the mark in terms of describing their own body fat % (usually, they're far fatter than they think) which makes their claims about the efficacy of fat loss on larger daily iu's of GH, say, above 6 units, dubious.

2. My own experience with the efficacy of low intensity, long term cardio sessions and positive fat loss over a one year test IS completely photo objective. Similarly, I used zero PEDS during this period and modified my diet only slightly.

3. In 2021 - who the fuck actually thinks GH is a viable longevity solution, much less healthy, beyond Doctor quacks in the longevity field? There seems to be so many negatives that come with 6+ daily Ius, to render such a 'self-prescribed' test, ridiculous.

Now if someone actually photographed their transformation - completely absent of all other PEDs - I'd be interested in looking further but, I'm not holding my breath.

 

[may2021]

Mpmd made this vid when he didn't suck. I think its accurate.

Derek's channel is total troll. I have zero respect for that guy.
Steve's a douche but knows what he's talking about.

 

[Methyl Mike]

I seriously would like to do the daily 6-8 iu for a fat loss TEST ONLY. It seems like the lazy ass man's approach to it, if it actually worked. However, it actually working is questionable at best, as:

1. I've seen so many posts where people are completely off the mark in terms of describing their own body fat % (usually, they're far fatter than they think) which makes their claims about the efficacy of fat loss on larger daily iu's of GH, say, above 6 units, dubious.

2. My own experience with the efficacy of low intensity, long term cardio sessions and positive fat loss over a one year test IS completely photo objective. Similarly, I used zero PEDS during this period and modified my diet only slightly.

3. In 2021 - who the fuck actually thinks GH is a viable longevity solution, much less healthy, beyond Doctor quacks in the longevity field? There seems to be so many negatives that come with 6+ daily Ius, to render such a 'self-prescribed' test, ridiculous.

Now if someone actually photographed their transformation - completely absent of all other PEDs - I'd be interested in looking further but, I'm not holding my breath.

I can save you some trouble.

First it will take you a while to build up to 6ius a day. Granted, you can jump right to it just like did. I even went higher fast. And I regretted it for quite some time.

Anything over 3-4 ius a day is going to accomplish almost the same thing but with more or less water retention depending on dose and purity of GH.

I have said numerous times on meso-TWO IUS A DAY was the best dose I ran. Personally. In terms of body recomp. I was blown away. I think the reason is purely cosmetic. At that dose you see GH working day to day without much if any water retention.

It's really up to you what you ultimately do. If you decide to run 6ius I urge you to take an over the counter diuretic with it every day. I have had good success with xpel (thank you eman for that one) so you can really see whats happening.

Just my humble .02$

 

[may2021]

I can save you some trouble.

First it will take you a while to build up to 6ius a day. Granted, you can jump right to it just like did. I even went higher fast. And I regretted it for quite some time.

Anything over 3-4 ius a day is going to accomplish almost the same thing but with more or less water retention depending on dose and purity of GH.

I have said numerous times on meso-TWO IUS A DAY was the best dose I ran. Personally. In terms of body recomp. I was blown away. I think the reason is purely cosmetic. At that dose you see GH working day to day without much if any water retention.

It's really up to you what you ultimately do. If you decide to run 6ius I urge you to take an over the counter diuretic with it every day. I have had good success with xpel (thank you eman for that one) so you can really see whats happening.

Just my humble .02$

Right on, bro. Thank you for your feedback.

I've farted around with serostim now since December. While I enthusiastically ran it at 5-6 Iu's during one of those months, I'm keeping it at 1.5-2 am and the same pm. The more I'm learning about it, the more I'm leaning toward keeping it at just 2ius a day. I'm just not a pro bodybuilder and the negatives in all research seem to far outweigh the benefits.

 

[Methyl Mike]

Right on, bro. Thank you for your feedback.

I've farted around with serostim now since December. While I enthusiastically ran it at 5-6 Iu's during one of those months, I'm keeping it at 1.5-2 am and the same pm. The more I'm learning about it, the more I'm leaning toward keeping it at just 2ius a day. I'm just not a pro bodybuilder and the negatives in all research seem to far outweigh the benefits.

You are overthinking IE you aren't a pro whatever

Growth Hormone is a tool in your arsenal. It has a role to play and can be many things depending on YOU.

If your goal is fat loss thats great. 2ius twice a day is the upper end. Meaning going higher may or may not be worth it for you. If you can't stand a strict diet you might use a little more to compensate. But the tradeoff is co$t and sides. Thats how it is.

You could easily diet and be consistent with cardio and love 2ius a day. No sides low cost great results. Thats the beauty of this sport you need not compete to make the knowledge available work for you.

Wish you the best.

 

[malfeasance]

There's literally a study comparing different dosages on lipolysis.

There is a ceiling on lipolysis, and the highest GH dose for maximizing fat loss per administration is much lower than most people think.

As you can see here in the following study assessing the pharmacokinetics and acute lipolytic actions of GH, there were significant dose-response effects when comparing the incremental area under the curve of both free fatty acids and blood 3-hydroxy-butyrate following 0, 1, and 3 mcg/kg GH, whereas there were no differences between the responses following 3 and 6 mcg/kg GH [R].

The Most Effective GH Dose For Fat Loss Per Administration

Growth Hormone (GH) is often used to increase lipolysis. In this article I show what the most effective GH dose for fat loss is.

moreplatesmoredates.com

I understand nobody gives a fuck about studies here but you have to admit it is interesting to say the least.

I am not sure why you think "nobody gives a f*** about studies." Most of us do.

This one, though. 0.9 iu daily is the maximum lypolitic benefit for a 220 pound person?

Wow.

Doubling it to 1.8 made no difference.

I wonder if they had made it 4, or 6 iu, would it have made a difference?

Is there some reason this does not apply to us?

Does it matter that this was administered intravenously? MPMD says injecting into your belly fat leaves the gh only 63% as available as IV. So that means 0.9 iu is really 1.43 iu (might as well say 1.5) the way we do it.

I can't view the study itself without paying.

What about 1.5 iu more than once a day? Are we still maxed out for the day, or would this increase the amount of fat that disappears?

 

[Type-IIx]

hGH is directly lipolytic and binds to its receptor on the fat cell. It directly blocks differentiation of adipocytes (stops the formation of body fat). In already existing fat cells, it inhibits glucose uptake and lipogenesis, and stimulates lipolysis (reduces size of fat cells).

IGF-1 acts in a manner that actually increases the pool of undifferentiated cells that 'could' create fat cells, but hGH acts in opposition to both the formation of new fat cells and the storage of energy therein.

However, Metformin does not lower IGF-1, but actually increases it with exogenous hGH use (hGH + Metformin: A Good Thing (Metformin does not lower, but rather increases IGF-1))

 

[Type-IIx]

I am not sure why you think "nobody gives a f*** about studies." Most of us do.

This one, though. 0.9 iu daily is the maximum lypolitic benefit for a 220 pound person?

Wow.

Doubling it to 1.8 made no difference.

I wonder if they had made it 4, or 6 iu, would it have made a difference?

Is there some reason this does not apply to us?

Does it matter that this was administered intravenously? MPMD says injecting into your belly fat leaves the gh only 63% as available as IV. So that means 0.9 iu is really 1.43 iu (might as well say 1.5) the way we do it.

I can't view the study itself without paying.

What about 1.5 iu more than once a day? Are we still maxed out for the day, or would this increase the amount of fat that disappears?

I have to agree with malfeasance. This study shows diminishing returns for mobilization of FFAs between .9 and 1.8 iU from a single bolus, yet it still shows a dose-dependent increase in glycerol (is that serum glycerol, i.e., essentially showing that mobilization and metabolism of FFAs is still occurring in a dose-dependent manner?) I'll grab the study and read FT, but I'm focused on some other things at the moment. I will say, that it does not definitively prove a ceiling for lipolysis with rhGH. But I'll take a look if I can obtain FT.

Also, FFA release after rhGH follows an oscillating, rhythymicity. It's rather unusual. See my recent post on Very tricky GH timing protocol

 

[malfeasance]

yet it still shows a dose-dependent increase in glycerol (is that serum glycerol, i.e., essentially showing that mobilization and metabolism of FFAs is still occurring in a dose-dependent manner?)

I noticed that on the chart but did not really know what it meant for our purposes. I would be interested to hear more once you have had a chance to review it further.

I already read your other thread.

 

[Neewbiest guy]

Great thread so far!!

 

[Type-IIx]

There's literally a study comparing different dosages on lipolysis.

There is a ceiling on lipolysis, and the highest GH dose for maximizing fat loss per administration is much lower than most people think.

As you can see here in the following study assessing the pharmacokinetics and acute lipolytic actions of GH, there were significant dose-response effects when comparing the incremental area under the curve of both free fatty acids and blood 3-hydroxy-butyrate following 0, 1, and 3 mcg/kg GH, whereas there were no differences between the responses following 3 and 6 mcg/kg GH [R].

The Most Effective GH Dose For Fat Loss Per Administration

Growth Hormone (GH) is often used to increase lipolysis. In this article I show what the most effective GH dose for fat loss is.

moreplatesmoredates.com

I understand nobody gives a fuck about studies here but you have to admit it is interesting to say the least.

So I actually read this paper. The cited paper is not the paper Derek (presumably) took the data from. Anyhow, rather than showing a "ceiling" for the lipolytic effects of exogenous rhGH this paper showed an inflection point above 3µg/kg of hGH administered as an i.v. bolus to simulate an endogenous pulse with endogenous levels of hGH. This corresponds to the upper limit of naturally occurring secretory bursts from the hypophysis [1]. This is not in any way applicable to the administration of supraphysiological doses of rhGH.

It is a model of endogenous secretory hGH pulses, not a model of supraphysiological administration. Learned something new about interindividual response, though, so thanks for that.

bump @malfeasance

[1] Hansen, T. K., Gravholt, C. H., Ørskov, H., Rasmussen, M. H., Christiansen, J. S., & Jørgensen, J. O. L. (2002). Dose Dependency of the Pharmacokinetics and Acute Lipolytic Actions of Growth Hormone. The Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism, 87(10), 4691–4698. doi:10.1210/jc.2002-020563

 

[malfeasance]

Wow. That's very different than how it was described.