Sadly, it doesn’t solve the problem for some.Yes lowering the Test dose does include lowering it to Zero or to actual TRT. Hemochromatosis (homozygous and sometimes heterozygous carriers) plus AAS can be trouble. But some can do TRT plus regular phlebotomy.
Figure - PMC
Hereditary hemochromatosis is a genetic disease that progresses silently. This disease is often diagnosed late when complications appear. Hypogonadotropic hypogonadism (HH) is one of the classical complications of hemochromatosis. Its frequency is ...www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
Lab work should I be concerned?
- Thread starter accidentaljedi173
- Start date
Bumpygooch
Well-known Member
Another anecdote, if I may, regarding hydration. I had labs pulled on a Friday, endo messaged me frantically to stop TRT as my HCT was 56. I told him to pull labs again on Wednesday before I stop. Donated Monday, went in for labs on Wednesday with 5 liters of water in me, HCT cams back at 47. So, I can’t tell you which was more impactful, but, 9 points in 4 days is absurd.
accidentaljedi173
Well-known Member
After much research, I've learned that nothing is set in stone to what works. So I'm adding natokinase, and baby aspirin. I will also be donating and going from there. I guess I'm in a guessing game as to what will work for me. But for now this is where I will start. Any continued advise is welcomed. I appreciate every single one of you for the information.
Bumpygooch
Well-known Member
Good luck, sorry with all the experience and knowledge here, we can’t offer anything more definitive than anecdotal nonsense.
accidentaljedi173
Well-known Member
It's a direction to a solution either way. Any information is appreciated here.
readalot
Member
Same lab? Method precision on modern Hct measurement is 1.5 to 2%. Can differ between labs.
Bumpygooch
Well-known Member
Yessir, endo labs are done in house. I know, it’s almost not a believable result.
readalot
Member
You sure got your money's worth. I'd call this a thread well loved.
Take care and best wishes.
readalot
Member
Make em show you the triplicates. They really should show triplicates but no one will ever press the matter.
That is a good example. I have submitted the same blood for repeats and gotten a spead of up to 2%. 9% swing with "hydration" is incredible. Thanks for sharing.
This is all we can do. Remember most of what we do is a very unique niche. Most of what we employ now is just bro science done by bodybuilders and so called forum vets who practiced/experimented on themselves or their clients. Take telmisartan, it originally made popular for bodybuilding purposes by someone in Pro muscle.
You can hate all the gurus and fitness influencers now but all they do is regurgitate things that were practiced by hardcore gymbros in these forum boards since the 2000’s. I for one will combine what protocols used by guys who have been blasting since then and combine it with what sensible methods available nowadays.
accidentaljedi173
Well-known Member
That's exactly why I brought this to the board. Most of my research is through this reading peoples experiences and trying them myself. This includes how I run my gear and the vitamins I take. The fact I know anything about aas or how to take care of myself while on them I'll credit to people posting about their experiences in almost specifically this forum. When I say my appreciation is endless to the people on this board is almost literally an understatement.
Jin23
Well-known Member
Seriously, I said check your iron and depending on your levels, try donations, on the first page of this discussion.
@DECLAN chelating is an option and IP6 does drop ferritin. You should also give apolactoferrin a try and if your issues seem to be persistent, above average, then checking your genes (HFE, TFR2, ...) for hemochromatosis makes sense. Less severe, heterozygous mutations in H63D, which isn't an official hemo diagnosis, can still push your ferritin to higher levels, especially if aas are in the picture. The cheapest 23andme test will give you all the info you need.
Jin23
Well-known Member
@accidentaljedi173 please reconsider aspirin and try chelating.
accidentaljedi173
Well-known Member
With a quick Google search I can only see that chelating is the removal of toxic metals from the body. But what do I use for the therapy?
readalot
Member
That would be an option if you were found to have iron overload. First you would need the iron testing @Jin23 suggested.
In the meantime I am glad you are studying up on viscosity, hgb/hct, plasma viscosity, rbc deformability, etc since you dabble in AAS.
Low dose aspirin is a somewhat controversial choice but I am comfortable with the choice. It does appear to have benefits in addition to affecting platelet aggregation.
Effects of Aspirin on Rheological Properties of Erythrocytes In Vitro - PMC
Aspirin is of proven value as an antithrombotic drug. In unstable angina it reduces the risk of death and myocardial infarction by half. Most studies on the mechanism of action of aspirin have concentrated on the effect of aspirin on platelets. In ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
RBC deformability is another factor influencing whole blood viscosity. A whole new thread on hct/hgb/whole blood viscosity does seem in order.
Nattokinase is another wild card. Are you getting the fibrinolytic units claimed on the bottle? Supplement quality a crap shoot unless you test. Dosage, etc. I have been using 10k FU for a few months now (maybe haha).
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accidentaljedi173
Well-known Member
I'll be testing my iron after I donate. And I got 8k fu that'll start on Monday.That would be an option if you were found to have iron overload. First you would need the iron testing @Jin23 suggested.
In the meantime I am glad you are studying up on viscosity, hgb/hct, plasma viscosity, rbc deformability, etc since you dabble in AAS.
Low dose aspirin is a somewhat controversial choice but I am comfortable with the choice. It does appear to have benefits in addition to affecting platelet aggregation.
Effects of Aspirin on Rheological Properties of Erythrocytes In Vitro - PMC
Aspirin is of proven value as an antithrombotic drug. In unstable angina it reduces the risk of death and myocardial infarction by half. Most studies on the mechanism of action of aspirin have concentrated on the effect of aspirin on platelets. In ...
RBC deformability is another factor influencing whole blood viscosity. A whole new thread on hct/hgb/whole blood viscosity does seem in order.
Nattokinase is another wild card. Are you getting the fibrinolytic units claimed on the bottle? Supplement quality a crap shoot unless you test. Dosage, etc. I have been using 10k FU for a few months now (maybe haha).
Jin23
Well-known Member
Why?? Test it now and after donation!
Jin23
Well-known Member
I'm surprised, given your gut issues ... What's your reasoning behind you being ok with it's use?
accidentaljedi173
Well-known Member
What would be the reasoning to test it twice?
readalot
Member
Tradeoff. Neither 325 mg/day nor 81 mg/day seem to exacerbate symptoms but I'll get a better look inside soon.
So far I've weighted the potential cardiovascular benefit more heavily than any gut hit for my personal objective function.
Actual net negative for low dose aspirin with IBD is murky from my understanding. What are your thoughts?
Daily Aspirin Use Does Not Impact Clinical Outcomes in Patients With Inflammatory Bowel Disease
AbstractBackground. Although several studies have associated the use of nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs with disease flares in patients with inflammat
academic.oup.com
The impact of aspirin use on outcomes in patients with inflammatory bowel disease: Insights from a national database - PMC
Inflammatory bowel disease (IBD) is an inflammatory disorder that can increase the risk of mortality. Aspirin is an anti-inflammatory drug used for primary prevention of cardiovascular events. A single center analysis previously reported that ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
Aspirin, Nonsteroidal Anti-inflammatory Drug Use, and Risk for Crohn Disease Ulcerative Colitis: A Cohort Study - PMC
Aspirin and nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs) are anti-inflammatory but have been linked in some studies to Crohn disease (CD) and ulcerative colitis (UC). To assess the association between aspirin and NSAID use and incident CD and UC. ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
International consensus on the prevention of venous and arterial thrombotic events in patients with inflammatory bowel disease - Nature Reviews Gastroenterology & Hepatology
Patients with inflammatory bowel disease (IBD) are at increased risk of thrombotic events. This Evidence-Based Guideline presents an international consensus on the prevention of venous and arterial thrombotic events in patients with IBD, and includes 19 recommendations for clinical practice.
www.nature.com
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