LGOP528
Member
Again, you made the claim, it is on you to provide proof. Not send me on a wild goose chase.
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Anabolic Steroids
Most sustainable way using PEDs - User opinions
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LGOP528
Member
I understand that bloodwork is a snap shot. I spend a lot of time on steroid plotter, that is why I am questioning your peak is double the trough claim.
LGOP528
Member
Personal attacks just means you have no real argument.
When do you do bloodwork? I have not seen you talk about any personal experiences with any of these compounds.
Your claim is imprecise and misleading. The data provided by you shows your trough reached ~800 ng/dl . That dosage and dosing frequency did not get you only to 800. What the body of scientific knowledge for the pharmacokinetics of injectable testosterone has taught the human race is that your mean TT was considerably greater than 800 ng/dl. Peak even higher still.
References provided for you to educate yourself if so desired.
Really just an observation. Not meant to be a personal attack. My argument stands on its own.
Then you should look harder if interested to learn more.
LGOP528
Member
when do you do your bloodwork?
I typically pull my blood work at trough yet understand that is a minimum point during the week and does not represent the mean.
Hence my serum TT levels on exogenous Test don't simply reach the trough. Yours don't either.
More info if you want to understand the pharmacokinetics of injectable test esters.
Those spikes are due to tools like SteroidPlotter not including absorption rate but only apparent elimination rate constant. I'll skip all the long winded flip flop kinetics stuff.
More realistic first order absorption plus elimination model:
Same AUC but peaks get clipped.
Low Dose Sustanon250 Cycle?
Sustanon pinned eod is a good protocol for a cycle or a blast. The point of cycling/blasting is to be at absurdly supraphysiological levels as much as possible for the length of the cycle. Sustanon for trt is aiming for something entirely different. There’s no one size fits all for how to...
forums.t-nation.com
More data and parameters...
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Table: conversion between peak/trough/mean for first order absorption/elimination PK model assuming 4.5 day elimination half life and 8 hr absorption half life
one more time for those that desire a handy conversion tool. Yes there are variance bars on each one of these entries. It's a useful approximation to drive home the concept nonetheless.
Lmfao. IYKYK.
I hope QSC comes back soon for you. Appreciate your civil discourse.
lukiss96
Member
When it comes to this, I always imagine it like this: what are you willing to sacrifice to achieve something that you really want The more you want the more you've got to sacrifice, there is no free ride. Some want just to look like fake natty or whatever that is, others settle for nothing less than that person who's obviously using steroids and looks freaky.
I think when we all started, we thought we gonna explode and look like Arnold or John Cena in his prime. Most of us realized somewhere along the way that we are limited by not only our genetics, but also our lifestyle, job, carreer, finances, family life and access to all what is needed.
So I believe, that you have to use enough of that stuff to get close to your goals, but you have to master your body and your response. Once you know it all, then there must be some sort of limits and that mindset that more is not better, but too little is not enough. Finding that optimal range for yourself.
Here's my example, I have used various steroids in the past to get to my goals. I have since stopped using almost all except Testosterone only. Of course many things changed during that time of 6+ years.
For example I only blast Test say 300-350mg for 6-8 months and monitor my blood work, health, how I feel and etc.
Then I TRT/cruise on 150-160mg, for 3 good months and it's usually enough for me to get healthy and feel human again. I feel rested after this phase. Not to say I'm unhealthy blasting 350mg/week for extended amount of time cuz all health markers are still decent looking.
So this is my current SUSTAINABLE strategy, for now. Will it be in 10 years? Time will tell. That's all I can say
I think when we all started, we thought we gonna explode and look like Arnold or John Cena in his prime. Most of us realized somewhere along the way that we are limited by not only our genetics, but also our lifestyle, job, carreer, finances, family life and access to all what is needed.
So I believe, that you have to use enough of that stuff to get close to your goals, but you have to master your body and your response. Once you know it all, then there must be some sort of limits and that mindset that more is not better, but too little is not enough. Finding that optimal range for yourself.
Here's my example, I have used various steroids in the past to get to my goals. I have since stopped using almost all except Testosterone only. Of course many things changed during that time of 6+ years.
For example I only blast Test say 300-350mg for 6-8 months and monitor my blood work, health, how I feel and etc.
Then I TRT/cruise on 150-160mg, for 3 good months and it's usually enough for me to get healthy and feel human again. I feel rested after this phase. Not to say I'm unhealthy blasting 350mg/week for extended amount of time cuz all health markers are still decent looking.
So this is my current SUSTAINABLE strategy, for now. Will it be in 10 years? Time will tell. That's all I can say
LGOP528
Member
The trough is used because it is a constant point in blood concentrations. This allows for comparisons. You are trying to use this standard as way to make yourself seem right. This is why I have a bad attitude towards you. You are disingenuous.
LGOP528
Member
I am done with this.
Bullshit. You are spouting off misinfo on a board with people trying to learn then doubling and tripling down after presented with the exhaustive facts. So I can't now conclude you were simply ignorant.
I've been very generous sharing accurate and helpful material with you.
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And of course you can't use the trough for comparisons on various protocols with different injection frequencies. The appropriate comparator is mean not trough. Mean is appropriate since it scales 1:1 with area under the curve (AUC). Now you have a simple tool to help you convert. Every exogenous Test user should understand these concepts so they don't lull themselves into thinking their serum levels throughout the week are simply the trough.
It's impossible to be the throughout lol I mean even a child would understand that. It spike and then it decrease if you measure just before your next injection that's the lowest point you have but the day before it was higher and the one earlier was even more high.. it's impossible to argue against this lol
LGOP528
Member
Ok, I don’t want to waste my time on this but you are not going to join in on his fun and games to misrepresent what I have said.
Show me where I said this was my peak and where I am confused about peaks and troughs.
LGOP528
Member
800 is by general standards low for a trough on 320mg. You are playing on words to hide the fact you mostly likely didn’t know that it is standard to draw blood at the trough. A fact, you probably found out by googling and reluctantly had to admit. I pointed this out and you started a smear campaign.
Every single post I have made in here is pointing out the variability for each individual. At the end of the day, everyone has to figure out how they respond. Maybe you should try and do some steroids instead of reading a lot about them.
The internet has empowered people like you to thrive because there are no consequences for your actions. You care more about being right than the actual truth and would gladly trade your soul for a few likes. I would hope most people can see what happened here.
800 ng/dl trough low on 320 mg/week? Of course. Bottom <2.5 percentile response. Oh right, we have a graph for that you ignored. I'm not playing with any words. Using clear, plain English and appropriate terminology.
I had no idea it was standard to measure at trough. Wow! You got me Brother. Lol.
Your last paragraph directly reflects your condition, not mine. QSC brain rot? Not sure. I guess you just want to "oppose" me as you said the other day? I don't know.
You refuse to learn. Refuse to read. I sure hope folks can accurately assess what happened here. Hope for the best.
Good luck to you.
I had no idea it was standard to measure at trough. Wow! You got me Brother. Lol.
Your last paragraph directly reflects your condition, not mine. QSC brain rot? Not sure. I guess you just want to "oppose" me as you said the other day? I don't know.
You refuse to learn. Refuse to read. I sure hope folks can accurately assess what happened here. Hope for the best.
Good luck to you.
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lukiss96
Member
Come on now, this makes no sense. This argument sounds like Dbossa talking -dictator type, arrogant and ignorant at the same time. Everyone is an idiot except me sort of thing.
I think you shall all accept your differences and move on, there is not much to prove and gain.
I think you shall all accept your differences and move on, there is not much to prove and gain.
