Package seized

[malfeasance]

I think getting popped is the luck of the draw. Kinda like winning Mega Millions.

It absolutely is luck of the draw, but the odds are nowhere near as extreme as winning "Mega Millions." The odds are pretty low. But it happens, and it happens much more frequently than most here are willing to admit.

There is a whole system that goes into how the postal service looks for things like this.

 

[a123]

Just to weigh in here.

It absolutely is luck of the draw, but the odds are nowhere near as extreme as winning "Mega Millions." The odds are pretty low. But it happens, and it happens much more frequently than most here are willing to admit.

There is a whole system that goes into how the postal service looks for things like this.

You can post 10 articles over 3 years, even if that’s 10% of the actual arrests, that’s insanely low.

It’s like saying that you’re risking being raped by hanging out with illegal immigrants because an illegal raped somebody… get real…

Also, IMPORTANTLY, although not directly stated, most/all of these cases involved a snitch. That’s the real risk, ending up in a situation where you get tattled on. Don’t expose yourself to people who might rat. Easier said than done but that’s the real way you get caught, not randomly by some task force.

Ordering for personal use, posting about it on an online forum with a pseudonym, thats not going to get you in trouble. Even if the package gets caught caught nobody is wasting their time on a rando with no criminal history for one suspicious package. Doing something erratic and getting busted with it in your possession is obviously a problem, it’s contraband. If you distribute it, recognize that your risk increases as you grow.
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I ONE HUNDRED PERCENT guarantee that your story about the traffic stop with the trooper involved an outside informant. We’ve all gotten traffic tickets…. do you get “randomly” searched when that happens? No. It’s because it’s not random.

 

[JackyLarko1991]

Hello, recently one of my packages containing HGH was seized. This is the first time something like this has happened to me, and I really needed this HGH. How should I go about my next order? Order under a different name? Address?
Package was seized about a week ago. How long should I wait until my next order?

If possible, change recipient address

 

[malfeasance]

Also, IMPORTANTLY, although not directly stated, most/all of these cases involved a snitch. That’s the real risk, ending up in a situation where you get tattled on. Don’t expose yourself to people who might rat. Easier said than done but that’s the real way you get caught, not randomly by some task force.

That's nonsense.

The vast majority involve nothing but dumb luck on the postal inspector's part.

Most cases are made by a dog.

Dogs cannot sniff out steroids.

Nevertheless, the dogs that the local police on task forces at the postal distribution centers use are nowhere near as good or reliable as they would like us to believe. Dogs hit on packages that do not contain the drugs that dogs are trained to look for ALL THE TIME. The packages hit on get pulled off to the side for further investigation. Then the postal inspectors have a checklist they go down. Unfortunately, your steroid package checks off most or all of the checklist.

So that's when the investigation starts. They have a record of everything ever sent to you by everyone and the tracking for it.

Then they try to deliver and question you or knock and talk or, worst of all, see a judge to try to get a search warrant. The first two options are followed up by a search warrant, as well, frequently. Then if the federal prosecutor is not interested (and he won't be), they go to the local PD and SO drug teams, who are almost always interested.

I have previously posted the USPS checklist and case law describing exactly what the postal inspectors and local police do in these situations. No, I am not going to go find all of that again this time around.

 

[a123]

That's nonsense.

The vast majority involve nothing but dumb luck on the postal inspector's part.

Most cases are made by a dog.

Dogs cannot sniff out steroids.

Nevertheless, the dogs that the local police on task forces at the postal distribution centers use are nowhere near as good or reliable as they would like us to believe. Dogs hit on packages that do not contain the drugs that dogs are trained to look for ALL THE TIME. The packages hit on get pulled off to the side for further investigation. Then the postal inspectors have a checklist they go down. Unfortunately, your steroid package checks off most or all of the checklist.

So that's when the investigation starts. They have a record of everything ever sent to you by everyone and the tracking for it.

Then they try to deliver and question you or knock and talk or, worst of all, see a judge to try to get a search warrant. The first two options are followed up by a search warrant, as well, frequently. Then if the federal prosecutor is not interested (and he won't be), they go to the local PD and SO drug teams, who are almost always interested.

I have previously posted the USPS checklist and case law describing exactly what the postal inspectors and local police do in these situations. No, I am not going to go find all of that again this time around.

DOGS??? Bahahahah.

Dogs are a tool to circumvent fourth amendment and police brutality laws, any asshole knows that.

It’s not fucking dogs dude.

 

[malfeasance]

DOGS??? Bahahahah.

Dogs are a tool to circumvent fourth amendment and police brutality laws, any asshole knows that.

It’s not fucking dogs dude.

They are absolutely a tool to circumvent the Fourth Amendment, but, there you are. They are using the dogs to catch things the dogs were never meant to catch.

The courts sign the warrant.

Once they have a warrant, it does not matter that the dog caught something he is not trained to catch.

It is, like somebody said above, a numbers game. Luck.

Thankfully, they catch very few shipments this way, but they do catch some.

 

[malfeasance]

By the way, for anybody wondering, this is not guess work. I tried to hint above, but there are things I know firsthand, in addition to secondhand confirmation in many other cases.

It is not always dogs, of course, but that is how a large percentage are caught, that is, initially separated and set aside for further scrutiny.

 

[a123]

They are absolutely a tool to circumvent the Fourth Amendment, but, there you are. They are using the dogs to catch things the dogs were never meant to catch.

The courts sign the warrant.

Once they have a warrant, it does not matter that the dog caught something he is not trained to catch.

It is, like somebody said above, a numbers game. Luck.

Thankfully, they catch very few shipments this way, but they do catch some.

Is math like a foreign concept to you or something ??

Do you realize the ODDS of a dog getting a random false alert on your illegal package???


It’s discrimination or snitching. Every. Single. Time.

 

[malfeasance]

Um, no. You are guessing. Your guess sounds plausible, but it's still a guess. I am telling you how things work based on actually knowing. That is the difference between your posts and my posts.

 

[AlexDavis43]

I have previously posted the USPS checklist and case law describing exactly what the postal inspectors and local police do in these situations. No, I am not going to go find all of that again this time around.

That's fine. You did the work, the information is out there for anyone who doesn't need to be spoon fed. Respect.

They are absolutely a tool to circumvent the Fourth Amendment, but, there you are. They are using the dogs to catch things the dogs were never meant to catch.

That makes sense, in line with your interlocutor:

It’s discrimination or snitching. Every. Single. Time.

Sounds like something you'd see in Dexter or a pseudo-dirty serial cop drama. Using less savory means to catch bad guys.

 

[a123]

Um, no. You are guessing. Your guess sounds plausible, but it's still a guess. I am telling you how things work based on actually knowing. That is the difference between your posts and my posts.

Um no. I'm not guessing.

I'm going based off my own experiences and observations of the publicly distributed information related to various cases. Read the discovery it tells a completely different story than the local news posted or that the cops alleged.

For the umpteenth time. Do you not fucking realize the odds of a dog randomly tagging your shit if you don't have contraband they can detect? those odds are like, lottery odds. Like. It's not going to happen. If a dog 'randomly' tags your shit 100% it was selected by a human for one reason or another. There is no denying this.\

Even if you did have cocaine or weed or bomb materials something the dog was trained to detect they still are ineffective half the time. Look it up easy google.

 

[Gigantic]

Dogs cannot sniff out steroids.

Depends on the source. For some sources here, dogs can absolutely smell a very distinct metallic odor (because I can) coming from the packages.

 

[malfeasance]

For the umpteenth time. Do you not fucking realize the odds of a dog randomly tagging your shit if you don't have contraband they can detect?

Holy shit you cannot seem to grasp the most basic of points.

They cannot detect steroids.

Got it?

They are not detecting your steroids.

That is not how this works.

You may have read a lot on the internet (good for you, there is a lot to learn out there), but I have experience with these dogs and how they are used. They will hit on your box if the handler wants them to hit on your box. I do not need to look anything up "on Google." I have lots of experience with this stuff. You are not getting things I looked up on Google. So pay attention and learn or shut the fuck up and just be content with your internet search. This is like an Olympian trying to share with you his advice on how to structure a cycle and diet for bodybuilding success, but you are cutting him down and trying to tell him how wrong he is because of some bullshit you saw in a Tik Tok video.

There are lots of other factors they use, as well, and your shipment checks off almost all of the boxes on their list of factors, every time.

A judge will sign a warrant, 100%. It does not matter if the dog is trained to hit on steroids because nobody knows what is in the box yet when presenting the affidavit to the judge. It is just a formulaic recitation of factors, including the dog hit. Judges never say no to this.

Later, when it is seen that the contents are something on which the dog was not trained to hit, it no longer matters. The box was opened legally pursuant to a warrant. That is it. You cannot challenge admission of the contents based on "there is no way the dog hit on that." Moreover, the only thing that needs to be shown for the dog's reliability is a training certificate. It is not relevant that the dog is unreliable or wrong 50% of the time. There is a Supreme Court decision on that, and you can definitely look that up on Google.

I already said the odds are low. If it wasn't, there would not be so many successful transactions on a forum like this. The odds are not so low, however, as to make this zero risk.

This happens. It is real. I have seen it from both sides. Period. You looked up some stuff on the internet. I mean, that's great. There are valuable things on the internet and a lot of information to learn. But please recognize that your Google search has some limitations when somebody with actual experience comes to tell you something. Instead of yapping and being dismissive, maybe see if there is some little thing you can learn in addition to your Google search learning.

 

[AlexDavis43]

What I've learned from this thread: dogs are used to bypass the 4th amendment. That makes sense.

By that point, they already have you. The dogs are just a convenience to bypass a lack of better evidence.

Not talking about gear, just how shit works.

 

[jankoch]

Holy shit you cannot seem to grasp the most basic of points.

They cannot detect steroids.

I think it makes sense to say they can teach them but in reality they might not do so in most places. For example in my country customs here can just open packages with little paperwork for basically no reason. They still use the dogs to detect stuff. Don't know what they can sniff exactly as info is not open. Its still an effective way.
Its also abused a lot in other countries as you said some just realize why bother to train them to be proper sniffing dogs when you can just teach them to alert whenever you want them to exploit the system. I still think it makes more sense to do so as a police officer, not a customs agent working with packages.

No doubt you have lots of experience in US, but some of the small EU countries LE or lawmakers can have different view on steroids. They might think its good idea to teach the dogs to sniff +20 substances so they can add 2-3 most common peds or pde5Is or else other than narco.

 

[gaylord_focker]

I think it makes sense to say they can teach them but in reality they might not do so in most places. For example in my country customs here can just open packages with little paperwork for basically no reason. They still use the dogs to detect stuff. Don't know what they can sniff exactly as info is not open. Its still an effective way.
Its also abused a lot in other countries as you said some just realize why bother to train them to be proper sniffing dogs when you can just teach them to alert whenever you want them to exploit the system. I still think it makes more sense to do so as a police officer, not a customs agent working with packages.

No doubt you have lots of experience in US, but some of the small EU countries LE or lawmakers can have different view on steroids. They might think its good idea to teach the dogs to sniff +20 substances so they can add 2-3 most common peds or pde5Is or else other than narco.

Hey man if a random dude on the internet says “I’ve got lots of experience with this stuff” you’re cooked man, the convo is basically over. You might as well give up he’s obviously some expert training dogs for the seal teams or some shit.

 

[Ghoul]

Very few people have any idea how customs works for mail in modern countries.

They don't send huge numbers of packs through an x-ray machine or rely on a non existent army of sniffer dogs.

They get info on inbound packs electronically, from a quasi govt organization called the "Universal Postal Union", which has all sorts of info linked to a tracking #, sender, receiver, size, customs declaration etc, and use various methods to choose which are of interest, then have those redirected for close inspection. If you're selected for inspection, you likely aren't getting your stuff if it's verboten.

This is why packages go through "outbound" customs. It's to collect and transmit this info to the receiving country.

They started this system a decade ago when the volume of mail became too overwhelming for any country to be able to inspect everything.

If you track your pack on parcelsapp (dotcom) you can see Universal Postal Union following your shipment.

 

[iris]

Hey man if a random dude on the internet says “I’ve got lots of experience with this stuff” you’re cooked man, the convo is basically over. You might as well give up he’s obviously some expert training dogs for the seal teams or some shit.

Well, I don't know if the multitalented Mr Malfeasance I also a dog trainer, but most of the conversations here are between Americans and about the US.
Sometimes I forget that, just because I enjoy the content that appears on Meso.
For us on the European continent, things will be a little (or a lot) different.
It was good that @jankoch brought a different perspective, if only for comparison and for other people reading this that are not from the US.
In general, though, this would not really be relevant to your situation.
If someone has first hand experience of this kind of thing, it's always good to share and let others know.
Of course, you will see things and make your mind up about it all, anyway.
Hope you are doing well

 

[UncleBuns]

Hey man if a random dude on the internet says “I’ve got lots of experience with this stuff” you’re cooked man, the convo is basically over. You might as well give up he’s obviously some expert training dogs for the seal teams or some shit.

@malfeasance has been around for a while and has contributed a lot of great information. You on the other hand are brand new and seem like a legitimate cunt. You have come here and contributed approximately nothing of value so far.

@a123 If You don't believe any of this then don't believe it. I'm not sure why people are so resistant to the possibility of arrest and criminal charges for acquiring illegal chemicals. I'm guessing it helps them feel better by convincing themselves that it's impossible they will get caught or in legal trouble? Yeah, odds are low if you're not a total idiot. But there is a chance. If you think it's impossible to get in trouble for doing something illegal, you're delusional. I'm not going to pretend to know the details of how that would work, but anything illegal you do there's a possibility of getting caught up in it.

I think the smart move is to conduct yourself in a very reasonable and rational way when buying UGL. Do things as stealth intelligent as possible and know that there is a chance of getting in trouble. It's not a high chance, but it's foolish to think there's no chance.

 

[gaylord_focker]

@malfeasance has been around for a while and has contributed a lot of great information. You on the other hand are brand new and seem like a legitimate cunt. You have come here and contributed approximately nothing of value so far.

@a123 If You don't believe any of this then don't believe it. I'm not sure why people are so resistant to the possibility of arrest and criminal charges for acquiring illegal chemicals. I'm guessing it helps them feel better by convincing themselves that it's impossible they will get caught or in legal trouble? Yeah, odds are low if you're not a total idiot. But there is a chance. If you think it's impossible to get in trouble for doing something illegal, you're delusional. I'm not going to pretend to know the details of how that would work, but anything illegal you do there's a possibility of getting caught up in it.

I think the smart move is to conduct yourself in a very reasonable and rational way when buying UGL. Do things as stealth intelligent as possible and know that there is a chance of getting in trouble. It's not a high chance, but it's foolish to think there's no chance.

Alright Karen have another white wine and breathe a little