Post up your Natty IGF-1 Level

[FunkOdyssey]

Thanks for the book link, I will read it for sure. So you think GH at low doses (3iu and under) should not be used by older people for the recovery benefits or for anyone looking for the weight loss benefits?Just looking for your personal belief and the reasons why since you have read the book.

If there is a dose of GH you can take which does not significantly affect insulin resistance, then that would be better (though still suspect to reduce longevity via other mechanisms).

I've heard from others that they are seeing negative IR effects as low as 2 IU daily. I'm sure the exact threshold where it becomes problematic is different for everyone, but the doses most people are interested in, which are high enough to make a dent in their body composition, are probably over that line. If you're only looking at fasting glucose, that alone probably won't be sensitive enough of a measurement to detect the negative effects in most people. Definitely want to also look at fasting insulin.

One of my key criteria for substance use is now simply, does it promote insulin resistance?

Androgens? No, gtg.
GH? Yes
Insulin? Yes
Caffeine? Yes (crying)

 

[glpfun]

Mine is 158

 

[glpfun]

question about the insulin resistance. Can this be mitigated by fasting a couple hours before bed and taking daily dose right before bed? Or are there other habits that can help manage the insulin resistance effects?

 

[Grey Spartan]

though still suspect to reduce longevity via other mechanisms

I read an article which I can not find for the life of me, that quoted a study done in women that concluded, high IGF-1 levels reduced lifespan and cognition.

Caffeine? Yes (crying)

LIES!!!!

 

[FunkOdyssey]

I read an article which I can not find for the life of me, that quoted a study done in women that concluded, high IGF-1 levels reduced lifespan and cognition.

Yes, it gets ugly if you look into it. There's a ton of studies around the GH/IGF-1 axis as pro-aging in animal models, longest-lived people have lower GH/IGF-1, etc.

LIES!!!!

I know, it pains me to say it. I'll share some of my notes on this, which are a mix of studies and AI chats. The problem: caffeine increases epinephrine levels chronically above baseline. It's basically liquid stress. You can actually prevent the insulin resistance caused by caffeine with a non-selective beta blocker (nebivolol won't work). Of course, those are shitty drugs to take for other reasons.

Caffeine / Insulin Resistance Notes


View: https://youtu.be/gi4WOD54xeA?si=bEkoIwb_rXusOk9I

 

[Ghoul]

There is a lot of evidence linking coffee consumption to (not caffeine specifically) younger biological age and longevity. But this round up of expert reactions to one of the more significant studies helps put it in context:

expert reaction to study on coffee drinking and increased longevity | Science Media Centre

 

[FunkOdyssey]

There is a lot of evidence linking coffee consumption to (not caffeine specifically) younger biological age and longevity. But this round up of expert reactions to one of the more significant studies helps put it in context:

expert reaction to study on coffee drinking and increased longevity | Science Media Centre

The polyphenols in coffee have insulin-sensitizing effects that help counteract the negative effects of caffeine somewhat. Decaf coffee shows the most positive effects for this reason. Individual differences in the speed of caffeine metabolism become relevant here, to determine whether caffeinated coffee will be beneficial or harmful.

Epidemiological studies on coffee are confounded by many factors, one of which is survivorship bias. The ability to tolerate caffeinated coffee at advanced ages can become a type of stress test that sicker people don't pass.

 

[Benf15harp]

Just for the record: I couldn’t give a flying fuk about longevity

 

[Jin23]

question about the insulin resistance. Can this be mitigated by fasting a couple hours before bed and taking daily dose right before bed? Or are there other habits that can help manage the insulin resistance effects?

Well yes, ofc, the best suited diet for GH would be IF. Something in the lines of 8/16 should be adequate, followed by a fasting workout with GH. The GH schedule should thus be in the morning as moving (not to mention working out) helps burn off the liberated ffa's which are the major factor in causing IR. Also you get enhanced fat burning by working out fasted with elevated GH levels.

 

[Grey Spartan]

Well yes, ofc, the best suited diet for GH would be IF. Something in the lines of 8/16 should be adequate, followed by a fasting workout with GH. The GH schedule should thus be in the morning as moving (not to mention working out) helps burn off the liberated ffa's which are the major factor in causing IR. Also you get enhanced fat burning by working out fasted with elevated GH levels.

So your saying I'm actually doing something right? I better blast some Tren-A to rectify this warm feeling I'm having.

 

[Jin23]

So your saying I'm actually doing something right? I better blast some Tren-A to rectify this warm feeling I'm having.

Haha Idk what Are you doing?

 

[Grey Spartan]

Haha Idk what Are you doing?

I don't eat 2 hours before bed, sleep 7-9 hours, get up drink 32oz of water, inject 2iu of GH. In the gym about a hour after injection, workout, cardio (total time about 1.5 hours) head home. I then eat my same boring breakfast, 210g egg whits mixed with 3 whole eggs. about 2 hours after that I have a meal with carbs. The one day I don't workout a week, replace the gym and cardio with 1 hour walking (4-5 miles) and contemplating if the people who do not have an internal dialog are really NPC's.

 

[Jin23]

I don't eat 2 hours before bed, sleep 7-9 hours, get up drink 32oz of water, inject 2iu of GH. In the gym about a hour after injection, workout, cardio (total time about 1.5 hours) head home. I then eat my same boring breakfast, 210g egg whits mixed with 3 whole eggs. about 2 hours after that I have a meal with carbs. The one day I don't workout a week, replace the gym and cardio with 1 hour walking (4-5 miles) and contemplating if the people who do not have an internal dialog are really NPC's.

Doesn't sound quite right no. Seems like you're eating around 3 to 4h after injection. Which is a little bit past Tmax. But at least you're having only protein and fats and the carbs are what? 6 hours after injection?

Best would be to workout 2 to 3h after injection and have your first meal at least 6h after but best would be even later if you can. 2 iu's however, isn't such a huge dose ...

 

[Grey Spartan]

Doesn't sound quite right no. Seems like you're eating around 3 to 4h after injection. Which is a little bit past Tmax. But at least you're having only protein and fats and the carbs are what? 6 hours after injection?

Best would be to workout 2 to 3h after injection and have your first meal at least 6h after but best would be even later if you can. 2 iu's however, isn't such a huge dose ...

I do wake up a few times a night so I could inject at 0200 that would be around 3 hours before workout. As far as waiting over 6 hours to eat after working out, you have officially lost you mind. That is almost as blasphemous as @FunkOdyssey bad mouthing caffeine with science.

 

[Jin23]

I do wake up a few times a night so I could inject at 0200 that would be around 3 hours before workout. As far as waiting over 6 hours to eat after working out, you have officially lost you mind. That is almost as blasphemous as @FunkOdyssey bad mouthing caffeine with science.

I wouldn't wait much more then 8h after pin at 2iu's ... I presume this would be app 3h post workout? At 2 iu's, and if there was a workout in between, 6h should cover you.

But if we're talking in absolute terms, you'd want to eat at least 8 if not more hours post pin. Is it necessary for such a small dose? Probably not ... This is also not the thread for such a debate.

 

[zmurphy]

That's still under the curve. So a higher insulin level is to be expected, especially with a higher dose. Are you going off of the declared value on the box or the actual lab measured value? I've no idea how qsc market's it's products, but it seems like you might be injecting more then what you think you are ...

I have the 24iu vials that tested at 27iu so 2.7iu should be pretty close to actual value

 

[zmurphy]

It's still a useful test, irrespective of what your insulin levels are when GH has cleared your system, you still are under the curve (gh) for the better half of the day, every day, so these results are relevant. It's even worse for those who pin 2x day ...

As somebody else noted, tirzepatide is also increasing insulin secretion, as that is what it's suposed to do. @zmurphy where was your BG at?

Glucose was 86. Its was 83 on the last blood test before GH so that hasn't moved much.

 

[thenpc]

I unfortunately never got a natty test done but my levels from running tesa/ipa for 2-3 months (5 days on 2 off) is pretty high (581).

0.75mg tesa & 0.125mg ipa both 2x day

(Nothing taken for 3 days before test bloodwork)

 

[FunkOdyssey]

Glucose was 86. Its was 83 on the last blood test before GH so that hasn't moved much.

Look at fasting insulin to see the damage being done. Glucose will stay reasonable while insulin resistance gets worse and worse, up to a point. Fasting insulin tells the whole story of how hard your pancreas is working to keep glucose down.