Sterilising vials the pedantic way

[Cdtoth666]

I feel like this has devolved into almost a bad joke.. when preparing injectables why wouldn’t you want to be as sanitary as possible, extra work or not?

Better question: why would you want to do extra work if it makes absolutely no difference?

As I have stated before and in doing so really improved the lives of people who produce at scale...all you have to do is filter to .22 microns and use a bacteriostatic agent and you will have a product that is just as safe as if you autoclaved everything inside of a larger autoclave in outer space.

You can take sewage water or HIV blood and filter it at .22 microns and you can inject it into your eyeball and you will be fine.

I don't understand the resistance to someone giving you information that will make some aspect of your life easier. I find this confusing. If someone told me this and there I am individually vaccum sealing and nuclear fission sterilizing every rubber stopper inside of the f*cking space station...I would be thrilled that I didn't have to do that anymore

 

[TestTrenPrimo]

Better question: why would you want to do extra work if it makes absolutely no difference?

As I have stated before and in doing so really improved the lives of people who produce at scale...all you have to do is filter to .22 microns and use a bacteriostatic agent and you will have a product that is just as safe as if you autoclaved everything inside of a larger autoclave in outer space.

You can take sewage water or HIV blood and filter it at .22 microns and you can inject it into your eyeball and you will be fine.

I don't understand the resistance to someone giving you information that will make some aspect of your life easier. I find this confusing. If someone told me this and there I am individually vaccum sealing and nuclear fission sterilizing every rubber stopper inside of the f*cking space station...I would be thrilled that I didn't have to do that anymore

I’m not agreeing or disagreeing with you in the slightest, I haven’t even finished my lab setup for personal use yet.

BUT, can you back this up at all? Can you provide any literature explaining that all the extra cleanliness is unnecessary?

I only say this because pharma labs go that extra mile, surely that isn’t for absolutely nothing right?

 

[clearheaded]

AGAIN, filtering does NOT clean vile your putting it into. and NO you have NO idea what you are talking about NO you cannot run sewage through 22micron filter and infect in ur eye. you have ZERO idea about what you are talking about. .22 is not a carbon filter that scrubs toxins, manufacture residues etc FYI.. this is a HARM REDUCTION FORUM. not a bro science reuse syringes or needles cause its been fine for me for years doesn't make it smart to promote.
this guy thought u dont need PC for mushroom cultivation either buhaha

no he can not prove anything and doesn't even know what a CFU test is, other than its what he does and has been ok.

again, you would be amazed how much shit rains down constantly in open air and best to avoid injecting as much black mold spores or staph as possible..junkies use street puddles to shoot up and often are fine, doesn't make it smart..

 

[TestTrenPrimo]

AGAIN, filtering does NOT clean vile your putting it into. and NO you have NO idea what you are talking about NO you cannot run sewage through 22micron filter and infect in ur eye. you have ZERO idea about what you are talking about. .22 is not a carbon filter that scrubs toxins FYI.. this is a HARM REDUCTION FORUM. not a bro science reuse needles cause its been fine for me for years lol..
this guy thought u dont need PC for mushroom cultivation either buhaha

This, is why I asked for some receipts on the claims haha

 

[narta]

In a personal usage homebrewing scenario, like the one most of us are, being extra cautious is really wise. Why not spend an extra 3 hours every 6 months that you make a batch, in order to have peace of mind?

I make batches very 6 to 9 months, maybe 100ml total and it takes me roughly 4 hours from start to finish. 20 years later I have had zero infections, zero knots and zero test flu. If I had a set up that I could use for terminal sterilization I would, that's the best practice by far, but I am not going to spend a fortune on something like that. Syringe filters do me fine. I will continue to dry heat everything and wiping it with alcohol and distilled water, because, why the f not?

 

[klokke23]

I really hate it when people say it's a harm reduction forum to win some petty argument. We're all here for sources lol

 

[tuffie]

I really hate it when people say it's a harm reduction forum to win some petty argument. We're all here for sources lol

implying
we all pseudo-frends here :3

 

[TestTrenPrimo]

I really hate it when people say it's a harm reduction forum to win some petty argument. We're all here for sources lol

Speak for yourself; im here to learn.

 

[29trt]

Better question: why would you want to do extra work if it makes absolutely no difference?

As I have stated before and in doing so really improved the lives of people who produce at scale...all you have to do is filter to .22 microns and use a bacteriostatic agent and you will have a product that is just as safe as if you autoclaved everything inside of a larger autoclave in outer space.

You can take sewage water or HIV blood and filter it at .22 microns and you can inject it into your eyeball and you will be fine.

I don't understand the resistance to someone giving you information that will make some aspect of your life easier. I find this confusing. If someone told me this and there I am individually vaccum sealing and nuclear fission sterilizing every rubber stopper inside of the f*cking space station...I would be thrilled that I didn't have to do that anymore

you are really starting to piss me off, I see you posting on all kind of threads nothing but contrarian idiocy...
If I read your post here when I started brewing my own stuff I might have been inclined to listen to your advice...
BA Does NOT kill bacteria! It merely stops its growth, so if you bought vials from amaz or ebay and they are contaminated with who knows what and you pour in filtered oil you will still have contamined oil!!!
Stop telling people to cut corners on sterilising!
If you have proof that what you are saying is indeed true produce it or STFU!

 

[MDrabbit]

hey man awesome setup, do you find the vials carry alot of condensated water after the autoclave?

Once autoclaved you can place the dental pouches with the vials inside the oven to dry them up.

 

[ObsidianLabs]

Better question: why would you want to do extra work if it makes absolutely no difference?

As I have stated before and in doing so really improved the lives of people who produce at scale...all you have to do is filter to .22 microns and use a bacteriostatic agent and you will have a product that is just as safe as if you autoclaved everything inside of a larger autoclave in outer space.

You can take sewage water or HIV blood and filter it at .22 microns and you can inject it into your eyeball and you will be fine.

I don't understand the resistance to someone giving you information that will make some aspect of your life easier. I find this confusing. If someone told me this and there I am individually vaccum sealing and nuclear fission sterilizing every rubber stopper inside of the f*cking space station...I would be thrilled that I didn't have to do that anymore

I think the phrase "better safe than sorry" fits perfectly here.

When brewing for yourself, it is very easy to take responsibility for your risk tolerance, no matter how high.

However, when preparing injectables for others, who are you to decide that level of risk tolerance for the end user?

I know I for one would much rather spend a little extra time on even my personal brews, to avoid an urgent care visit for an infection.

Obsidian.

 

[narta]

BA Does NOT kill bacteria!

In high enough doses it is though. That does not imply it should be used as such in our case.

 

[Cdtoth666]

This, is why I asked for some receipts on the claims haha

Did you read his post? Nothing he said refutes my point lol. It was a bunch of absolute rubbish…

Again. If you want to obtain a safe to inject product, all you have to do is 1. use a .22 micron filter and 2. use a bacteriostatic agent. That is all you have to do, and i beckon anyone to refute that claim.

Literally thousands of injection at this point in my life and zero infections, and I have many other people again who produce at scale that have optimized efficiency by adhering to those principles without any record of infection.

And this is is backed by science, as to why filtering and and using Benzyl alcohol is all you need to do, and furthermore you don’t even need to keep this in vials, you can just keep it in a bottle indefinitely.

 

[narta]

Did you read his post? Nothing he said refutes my point lol. It was a bunch of absolute rubbish…

Again. If you want to obtain a safe to inject product, all you have to do is 1. use a .22 micron filter and 2. use a bacteriostatic agent. That is all you have to do, and i beckon anyone to refute that claim.

Literally thousands of injection at this point in my life and zero infections, and I have many other people again who produce at scale that have optimized efficiency by adhering to those principles without any record of infection.

And this is is backed by science, as to why filtering and and using Benzyl alcohol is all you need to do, and furthermore you don’t even need to keep this in vials, you can just keep it in a bottle indefinitely.

So the final vials do not need to be sterilized, just the liquid?

 

[Cdtoth666]

So the final vials do not need to be sterilized, just the liquid?

Just the liquid . What I’m saying is well documented so idk why there is any controversy. Beats me.

This is the most reductionist explanation: Filtering makes it sterile, essentially, in the broadest sense and Benzyl alcohol keeps it “sterile” in the broadest sense. It is really this simple. Does the standard filter theoretically get everything? No, but that isn’t an issue at all.

If you wanted to make a sterile depot, well that’s where you see things like ampoules and single use vials. These have no additives and require USP FDA CDC blah blah standards to be certified. But these are single use, so if you make a multi use (10 ml) vial under the same conditions Well after the first puncture it isn’t sterile anymore so all of those sterile procedures become irrelevant.

Things cannot exactly survive or grow on glass, and if these things are sealed then the anaerobic environment inside the vial is even more inhospitable and a filled vial has very little dead space.

And the filters don’t contain everything so let’s use the Coronavirus would be a good example of something that say we want to make sure doesn’t get in our bodies. Regardless of what you do, I repeat as long as you filter to .22 microns and use BA you will not have to worry about coronavirus. Use 2% BA if it makes you feel better, but that stuff is extremely strong, to the point that it is prohibited from use in infants due to acute poisoning that can be fatal. It kills head lice, etc and yes it can even kill you in relatively small amounts. If you use a high conc. Of BA and you are say part of the 3CC suicide squad or even higher than that then you can experience BA toxicity which is no joke. Anyway the point is that it’s strong sh*t.

 

[narta]

So

Just the liquid . What I’m saying is well documented so idk why there is any controversy. Beats me.

So the rat that has been shiting in the vials when they were sitting in the warehouse has sterile shit too, right?

You need sterile vials and sterile liquid.

 

[Cdtoth666]

So

So the rat that has been shiting in the vials when they were sitting in the warehouse has sterile shit too, right?

You need sterile vials and sterile liquid.

No you do not. This is unequivocally false. I don’t know where you read this or how you came to this understanding, but that is not accurate information.

 

[narta]

No you do not. This is unequivocally false. I don’t know where you read this or how you came to this understanding, but that is not accurate information.

Oh gtfo. You are plain dangerous.

 

[Cdtoth666]

Oh gtfo. You are plain dangerous.

I consistently overestimate the reading comprehension of roid heads so this is my fault. I made a lengthy post…did you understand nothing? Bruh you do all that crazy autoclaving nonsense and as soon as you puncture a 10 ml vial for the first time it’s no longer sterile. Like bruh. We’re gonna get this together I’m not giving up on you

Alright well I tried but this outreach mission has failed. And in that spirit, you can’t be sterile enough can you? There is sooo much more you could be doing. Do you have a haz mat suit ? You need one of those. And a respirator you need to wear one of those at all times. And you should be triple sterilizing your empty vials one by one you gotta make sure that glass is sterilized. And actually since covid they have revised the sterility guidelines for injectable drugs to recommend a hadron collider for final sterilization.LOL

 

[narta]

Trying to sound funny and knowledgeable at the same time, wow!

You are still dangerous and an asshole though.