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Anabolic Steroids

SymBiotics (U.S. domestic)

pfdept59 said:
Hey Sym,what do you think the half life is of your Test U? I thought I read that you plan on pinning every 2 weeks.If this is true is it due to the carrier oil you are using?Test U in castor oil has a half life of 33.9 days when injected IM.I have been told take initial dose then 4 weeks later take second dose then every 10 weeks.Can you please explain this to us.Thank you
Click to expand...
To be completely honest, I am going down a path with this that is completely by the seat of my pants.
I will tell you this though: the data contained in the Nebido prescribing information is either A) skewed tremendously in favor of the manufacturer's claims; or B) well, there is no B. They are just marketing.

So the math doesn't work for me either:
For example, one of the members in this thread posted serum testosterone result on my Test-P that was tested as accurately dosed. At 140mg/week; his serum T was around 900. That's perfect in my opinion.
So that person is using 140mg/week, or 560mg/month, or 7280mg/year of Test-P.

The Nebido studies are done on 1000mg injections every 12 weeks with one injection at the onset and 6week marks to load.
The math on that gives us 83mg/week, 333mg/month, or 4333mg/year. The undecylenate ester will take up some amount of the dose weight that would equate to less testosterone than would be cleaved from Test-P; so that is an even lower dose.
I would assume that the study conductors would be satisfied with sub-500 serum testosterone levels; so to get around 900 where I personally feel good, the injection volume would increase at the 12 week intervals to around 8ml. I'm not injecting 8ml of anything in one setting.

Another thing is the literature states there is a rise to eugonadic levels on day 3 post-injection. I just don't see that happening for everyone with this ester.
If you look at their graph, the duration of the 12 week interval between injections is spent on a decline in serum testosterone: not the flat line that they want you to believe.

I could see spacing injections out maybe up to 4 weeks and it would be reasonably plausible for testosterostasis (I am copyrighting that word); but not 12 weeks. It just doesn't make sense and I think the data is skewed to facilitate marketing.

I don't think the oil has a single thing to do with it. I just like avocados and I have a friend that has a plantation of them; so it is just a purely personal choice.

I have been a human science project for a while now and I plan to study how this works for my personal use. I think it will be 2 months or more before my blood will be reliable to test because of all the wacko stuff I have been injecting lately with these test batches. I will definitely post it here when available.
 
pfdept59 said:
Hey Sym,Are you a totally jacked chemist or what?I laugh when I picture what you must look like in the lab.
Click to expand...
No, I'm not a chemist.
I get odd stares sometimes, like at the seminar I spoke at last week. I guess I don't really fit the general image of most people in my line of work. I am proud of the progress I have made over the years though. I would love to really get big just once; but at my age I believe that window has long passed. These days I am more focused on keeping my wife attracted to me and maintaining cardiovascular health so that I can still play with grand kids if I live long enough to meet them.
 
SymBiotics said:
To be completely honest, I am going down a path with this that is completely by the seat of my pants.
I will tell you this though: the data contained in the Nebido prescribing information is either A) skewed tremendously in favor of the manufacturer's claims; or B) well, there is no B. They are just marketing.

So the math doesn't work for me either:
For example, one of the members in this thread posted serum testosterone result on my Test-P that was tested as accurately dosed. At 140mg/week; his serum T was around 900. That's perfect in my opinion.
So that person is using 140mg/week, or 560mg/month, or 7280mg/year of Test-P.

The Nebido studies are done on 1000mg injections every 12 weeks with one injection at the onset and 6week marks to load.
The math on that gives us 83mg/week, 333mg/month, or 4333mg/year. The undecylenate ester will take up some amount of the dose weight that would equate to less testosterone than would be cleaved from Test-P; so that is an even lower dose.
I would assume that the study conductors would be satisfied with sub-500 serum testosterone levels; so to get around 900 where I personally feel good, the injection volume would increase at the 12 week intervals to around 8ml. I'm not injecting 8ml of anything in one setting.

Another thing is the literature states there is a rise to eugonadic levels on day 3 post-injection. I just don't see that happening for everyone with this ester.
If you look at their graph, the duration of the 12 week interval between injections is spent on a decline in serum testosterone: not the flat line that they want you to believe.

I could see spacing injections out maybe up to 4 weeks and it would be reasonably plausible for testosterostasis (I am copyrighting that word); but not 12 weeks. It just doesn't make sense and I think the data is skewed to facilitate marketing.

I don't think the oil has a single thing to do with it. I just like avocados and I have a friend that has a plantation of them; so it is just a purely personal choice.

I have been a human science project for a while now and I plan to study how this works for my personal use. I think it will be 2 months or more before my blood will be reliable to test because of all the wacko stuff I have been injecting lately with these test batches. I will definitely post it here when available.
Click to expand...
Thanks for explaining that I really appreciate it.I don’t mind pinning my TRT IM twice a week and HGH sub q everyday.I need the Test U for international vacations I have a daughter in medical school in Germany and we visit her a few times a year for 2+ weeks at a time and I don’t want to travel with my illegal gear.Hoping you Test U will do the trick for me.Thanks
 
Akuj said:
Can't wait for mine to come in already, although I never used eo base. Hopefully won't have any issues with it. :)
Click to expand...
This was something I have never seen either, EO strictly as a base. I was told ethyl oleate is what compounding pharmacies use when patients have allergies to multiple botanical oils. It is very pleasant to inject, that is, if you can remember to slow down because it flows so easily.

Sounds like it's good unless someone has an allergy to it.
 
I have to have an outlet for this, and it is something only men would understand. My wife has been absolutely of no help with it:

It's Saturday and I am home alone. The girls' event was rained out; so we just came back home.
Periodically, my wife and I monitor out teenagers' cell phone messages and the apps and such.
Well, it was my turn this time so I grabbed the oldest's phone and went through a few messages. Mainly I was looking for conversations with guys. There weren't really any to speak of.
BUT, the most recent conversation she had was with here best friend who is actually staying the weekend with us. They were texting back and forth from opposite ends of the facility while we were waiting on the rainout decision.

They were texting about me and I wish more than anything I could get that thing from Men In Black to wipe my memory.

Here's how the conversation went:
Friend: "Is this gonna happen or what?"
Daughter: "IDK. I'm hungry. Let's see if they will take us to Mo's."
Friend: "Whatever, just as long as your dad doesn't get all dorky with the burrito guy again."
Daughter: "IKR. He's such a NERD sometimes.Ugh!"
Friend: "Yeah. Good thing he's hot or I'd never go anywhere with your family."
Daughter: "IKR maybe he will keep it tucked in today."
Daighter: "Wait WTF??!?!? GROSS??!! You can't say that ugh.
Friend: "What? He is hot. We all talk about it when he's around. I'd totally f#*&k your dad."

I couldn't read past that. I'm sick to my stomach and my wife just laughs like it is the funniest thing ever. She took all the girls to get pedicures and I couldn't even look at my daughter's friend when they were walking out the door.

I will NEVER spy on their messages again. It is obvious that that daughter has reached the age where I no longer belong in personal business and am just a support person.

But I can't stop feeling disgusted about this. I was at the hospital with her friend's dad the day she was born. She has been in our lives for 16 years; and she is just like one of my children.

I very rarely even drink but I think I need a bottle of something strong.
This is just sick.

And my wife is still texting me stupid stuff right now from the nail place; like telling me she is getting a school uniform on the way home.
Geez. This is just the worst.
 
B Ware said:
Huh? Doc signed a form so I could donate more frequently and has me going once a month.


My hemo isn’t even terrible. This lab is from last week.
View attachment 125412

Edit: when you go to a blood donation center their method of pricking your finger to check hemo is crap. Last month they said I was at a 56. My labs show less than 50. No way that donations dropped me 6 points.
Click to expand...
first ...your dr is an idiot.
find a new one.
49 is great...If u go and donate that often you will crash ferritan bigtime.
If you ever crashed e2...crashing iron/ferritan is worse.
Donating a pint will usually drop hct by 4 to 5 % ...so 2 to 2.5 points.
 
SymBiotics said:
I have to have an outlet for this, and it is something only men would understand. My wife has been absolutely of no help with it:

It's Saturday and I am home alone. The girls' event was rained out; so we just came back home.
Periodically, my wife and I monitor out teenagers' cell phone messages and the apps and such.
Well, it was my turn this time so I grabbed the oldest's phone and went through a few messages. Mainly I was looking for conversations with guys. There weren't really any to speak of.
BUT, the most recent conversation she had was with here best friend who is actually staying the weekend with us. They were texting back and forth from opposite ends of the facility while we were waiting on the rainout decision.

They were texting about me and I wish more than anything I could get that thing from Men In Black to wipe my memory.

Here's how the conversation went:
Friend: "Is this gonna happen or what?"
Daughter: "IDK. I'm hungry. Let's see if they will take us to Mo's."
Friend: "Whatever, just as long as your dad doesn't get all dorky with the burrito guy again."
Daughter: "IKR. He's such a NERD sometimes.Ugh!"
Friend: "Yeah. Good thing he's hot or I'd never go anywhere with your family."
Daughter: "IKR maybe he will keep it tucked in today."
Daighter: "Wait WTF??!?!? GROSS??!! You can't say that ugh.
Friend: "What? He is hot. We all talk about it when he's around. I'd totally f#*&k your dad."

I couldn't read past that. I'm sick to my stomach and my wife just laughs like it is the funniest thing ever. She took all the girls to get pedicures and I couldn't even look at my daughter's friend when they were walking out the door.

I will NEVER spy on their messages again. It is obvious that that daughter has reached the age where I no longer belong in personal business and am just a support person.

But I can't stop feeling disgusted about this. I was at the hospital with her friend's dad the day she was born. She has been in our lives for 16 years; and she is just like one of my children.

I very rarely even drink but I think I need a bottle of something strong.
This is just sick.

And my wife is still texting me stupid stuff right now from the nail place; like telling me she is getting a school uniform on the way home.
Geez. This is just the worst.
Click to expand...

Sounds like a teenage girl just shit talking similar to teenage boys. I can see how it'd be weird but if your wife is busting your balls about it that reinforces it was shit talking. Still not something I'd want to read from a friend of my girls either.
 
Last edited:
SymBiotics said:
I have to have an outlet for this, and it is something only men would understand. My wife has been absolutely of no help with it:

It's Saturday and I am home alone. The girls' event was rained out; so we just came back home.
Periodically, my wife and I monitor out teenagers' cell phone messages and the apps and such.
Well, it was my turn this time so I grabbed the oldest's phone and went through a few messages. Mainly I was looking for conversations with guys. There weren't really any to speak of.
BUT, the most recent conversation she had was with here best friend who is actually staying the weekend with us. They were texting back and forth from opposite ends of the facility while we were waiting on the rainout decision.

They were texting about me and I wish more than anything I could get that thing from Men In Black to wipe my memory.

Here's how the conversation went:
Friend: "Is this gonna happen or what?"
Daughter: "IDK. I'm hungry. Let's see if they will take us to Mo's."
Friend: "Whatever, just as long as your dad doesn't get all dorky with the burrito guy again."
Daughter: "IKR. He's such a NERD sometimes.Ugh!"
Friend: "Yeah. Good thing he's hot or I'd never go anywhere with your family."
Daughter: "IKR maybe he will keep it tucked in today."
Daighter: "Wait WTF??!?!? GROSS??!! You can't say that ugh.
Friend: "What? He is hot. We all talk about it when he's around. I'd totally f#*&k your dad."

I couldn't read past that. I'm sick to my stomach and my wife just laughs like it is the funniest thing ever. She took all the girls to get pedicures and I couldn't even look at my daughter's friend when they were walking out the door.

I will NEVER spy on their messages again. It is obvious that that daughter has reached the age where I no longer belong in personal business and am just a support person.

But I can't stop feeling disgusted about this. I was at the hospital with her friend's dad the day she was born. She has been in our lives for 16 years; and she is just like one of my children.

I very rarely even drink but I think I need a bottle of something strong.
This is just sick.

And my wife is still texting me stupid stuff right now from the nail place; like telling me she is getting a school uniform on the way home.
Geez. This is just the worst.
Click to expand...
This sounded like an exact clip from America. Beauty when the daughters friend said she would totally fuck her dad if he just worked out a little more.
I have a 9yr old daughter and thank god she hasn’t reached the age of introducing boys yet or reaching that mindset yet.
I try to prepare myself for when the day comes so I don’t over react because of attempting to be over protective.
In your situation I can only imagine how concerning it can be reading that but as long as she never tries to cross the line and bring something like that into light with you I’m sure it is just a phase as her hormonal levels are developing.
 
SymBiotics said:
I have to have an outlet for this, and it is something only men would understand. My wife has been absolutely of no help with it:

It's Saturday and I am home alone. The girls' event was rained out; so we just came back home.
Periodically, my wife and I monitor out teenagers' cell phone messages and the apps and such.
Well, it was my turn this time so I grabbed the oldest's phone and went through a few messages. Mainly I was looking for conversations with guys. There weren't really any to speak of.
BUT, the most recent conversation she had was with here best friend who is actually staying the weekend with us. They were texting back and forth from opposite ends of the facility while we were waiting on the rainout decision.

They were texting about me and I wish more than anything I could get that thing from Men In Black to wipe my memory.

Here's how the conversation went:
Friend: "Is this gonna happen or what?"
Daughter: "IDK. I'm hungry. Let's see if they will take us to Mo's."
Friend: "Whatever, just as long as your dad doesn't get all dorky with the burrito guy again."
Daughter: "IKR. He's such a NERD sometimes.Ugh!"
Friend: "Yeah. Good thing he's hot or I'd never go anywhere with your family."
Daughter: "IKR maybe he will keep it tucked in today."
Daighter: "Wait WTF??!?!? GROSS??!! You can't say that ugh.
Friend: "What? He is hot. We all talk about it when he's around. I'd totally f#*&k your dad."

I couldn't read past that. I'm sick to my stomach and my wife just laughs like it is the funniest thing ever. She took all the girls to get pedicures and I couldn't even look at my daughter's friend when they were walking out the door.

I will NEVER spy on their messages again. It is obvious that that daughter has reached the age where I no longer belong in personal business and am just a support person.

But I can't stop feeling disgusted about this. I was at the hospital with her friend's dad the day she was born. She has been in our lives for 16 years; and she is just like one of my children.

I very rarely even drink but I think I need a bottle of something strong.
This is just sick.

And my wife is still texting me stupid stuff right now from the nail place; like telling me she is getting a school uniform on the way home.
Geez. This is just the worst.
Click to expand...

But your wife's about to go get a school girl outfit to wear for you... I dont see the problem here...
 
SymBiotics said:
I have to have an outlet for this, and it is something only men would understand. My wife has been absolutely of no help with it:

It's Saturday and I am home alone. The girls' event was rained out; so we just came back home.
Periodically, my wife and I monitor out teenagers' cell phone messages and the apps and such.
Well, it was my turn this time so I grabbed the oldest's phone and went through a few messages. Mainly I was looking for conversations with guys. There weren't really any to speak of.
BUT, the most recent conversation she had was with here best friend who is actually staying the weekend with us. They were texting back and forth from opposite ends of the facility while we were waiting on the rainout decision.

They were texting about me and I wish more than anything I could get that thing from Men In Black to wipe my memory.

Here's how the conversation went:
Friend: "Is this gonna happen or what?"
Daughter: "IDK. I'm hungry. Let's see if they will take us to Mo's."
Friend: "Whatever, just as long as your dad doesn't get all dorky with the burrito guy again."
Daughter: "IKR. He's such a NERD sometimes.Ugh!"
Friend: "Yeah. Good thing he's hot or I'd never go anywhere with your family."
Daughter: "IKR maybe he will keep it tucked in today."
Daighter: "Wait WTF??!?!? GROSS??!! You can't say that ugh.
Friend: "What? He is hot. We all talk about it when he's around. I'd totally f#*&k your dad."

I couldn't read past that. I'm sick to my stomach and my wife just laughs like it is the funniest thing ever. She took all the girls to get pedicures and I couldn't even look at my daughter's friend when they were walking out the door.

I will NEVER spy on their messages again. It is obvious that that daughter has reached the age where I no longer belong in personal business and am just a support person.

But I can't stop feeling disgusted about this. I was at the hospital with her friend's dad the day she was born. She has been in our lives for 16 years; and she is just like one of my children.

I very rarely even drink but I think I need a bottle of something strong.
This is just sick.

And my wife is still texting me stupid stuff right now from the nail place; like telling me she is getting a school uniform on the way home.
Geez. This is just the worst.
Click to expand...

So you read your daughter’s text?

You got to the part where the friend says she would fuck you.

And you told your wife? [emoji1787]

I guess you’re honest with everything.
 
SymBiotics said:
I have to have an outlet for this, and it is something only men would understand. My wife has been absolutely of no help with it:

It's Saturday and I am home alone. The girls' event was rained out; so we just came back home.
Periodically, my wife and I monitor out teenagers' cell phone messages and the apps and such.
Well, it was my turn this time so I grabbed the oldest's phone and went through a few messages. Mainly I was looking for conversations with guys. There weren't really any to speak of.
BUT, the most recent conversation she had was with here best friend who is actually staying the weekend with us. They were texting back and forth from opposite ends of the facility while we were waiting on the rainout decision.

They were texting about me and I wish more than anything I could get that thing from Men In Black to wipe my memory.

Here's how the conversation went:
Friend: "Is this gonna happen or what?"
Daughter: "IDK. I'm hungry. Let's see if they will take us to Mo's."
Friend: "Whatever, just as long as your dad doesn't get all dorky with the burrito guy again."
Daughter: "IKR. He's such a NERD sometimes.Ugh!"
Friend: "Yeah. Good thing he's hot or I'd never go anywhere with your family."
Daughter: "IKR maybe he will keep it tucked in today."
Daighter: "Wait WTF??!?!? GROSS??!! You can't say that ugh.
Friend: "What? He is hot. We all talk about it when he's around. I'd totally f#*&k your dad."

I couldn't read past that. I'm sick to my stomach and my wife just laughs like it is the funniest thing ever. She took all the girls to get pedicures and I couldn't even look at my daughter's friend when they were walking out the door.

I will NEVER spy on their messages again. It is obvious that that daughter has reached the age where I no longer belong in personal business and am just a support person.

But I can't stop feeling disgusted about this. I was at the hospital with her friend's dad the day she was born. She has been in our lives for 16 years; and she is just like one of my children.

I very rarely even drink but I think I need a bottle of something strong.
This is just sick.

And my wife is still texting me stupid stuff right now from the nail place; like telling me she is getting a school uniform on the way home.
Geez. This is just the worst.
Click to expand...
It's one of those young girl phase things..whoa American Beauty..just dont start smoking pot and jamming out to jimi hendrix in your car :rolleyes:
 
Sp2.0 said:
Sounds like a teenage girl just shit talking similar to teenage boys. I can see how it'd be weird but if your wife is busting your balls about that reinforces it was shit talking. Still not something I'd want to read from a friend of my girls either.
Click to expand...
Rationally thinking, I know it was just crap talking.
I just never imagined them even talking like that. They are still babies in my mind. I'm usually pretty collected and even keeled with anything that comes my way; but that just elicited a visceral response that I was unprepared for.
Thanks. It felt better to type it out at least so maybe another dad would read it.
My wife has her talons in me on this one; and she is sinking them deeper and deeper. I'm about to turn my phone off.
 
Tiredandhot said:
This was something I have never seen either, EO strictly as a base. I was told ethyl oleate is what compounding pharmacies use when patients have allergies to multiple botanical oils. It is very pleasant to inject, that is, if you can remember to slow down because it flows so easily.

Sounds like it's good unless someone has an allergy to it.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that info, from what I've read peoples response are 50/50. Some say it's great others say it has given them huge infection looking lumps. Was slightly concerned but am going to use like .1 to check for allergies.
 
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