THE new "Generic" HGH Assay PAGE! AAA testing

[CensoredBoardsSuck]

and muscle has been exposed as a liar

Please, quote him on where exactly did he lie.

Here's one example of MH's "disregard for the truth.

The standard is posted over at PM.

Its in the lab testing forum, not allowed to link it.

I have read through the whole thread again and there is no such standard or data posted

Oops! You're welcome. Point proven. Now gtfo.

And just for the laughs:

Yes, I am biased towards honesty and the truth.

 

[Dr JIM]

Here's one example of MH's "disregard for the truth.

Oops! You're welcome. Point proven. Now gtfo.

And just for the laughs:

NO STANDARD = NO DATA = NO EVIDENCE "FOR COMPARISON", what a joke !

 

[rpbb]

Dr J, this was asked before, but got lost in all the debate, and something you eluded to in the other thread, why are some amino acids missing in a few of the samples raw data

 

[Dr JIM]

It seems quite likely to be due the EXCESSIVE amounts of GLYCINE that is present in the majority of generic GH samples we have tested.

Of course this suggestion is contrary to @jano s opinion, but then again his experience w Amino Acid related HPLCS is obviously quite limited.

Nonetheless, sooner or later I'll
locate a more definitive answer
fer ya.
Jim

^^^^^

Dr J, this was asked before, but got lost in all the debate, and something you eluded to in the other thread, why are some amino acids missing in a few of the samples raw data

 

[janoshik]

It seems quite likely to be due the EXCESSIVE amounts of GLYCINE that is present in the majority of generic GH samples we have tested.

Of course this suggestion is contrary to @jano s opinion, but then again his experience w Amino Acid related HPLCS is obviously quite limited.

Nonetheless, sooner or later I'll
locate a more definitive answer
fer ya.
Jim

^^^^^

So due to the excessive glycine there are amino acids missing?

It would certainly be interesting to hear how exactly would that work - I don't think that is possible.

Also, we are back at it again - I don't think calling a few tens of mgs maximum an excessive amount, assuming it was put there with ill will, is correct.

I though it had been agreed that it serves purpose no other than being a buffer, Mr. JIM.

 

[CdnGuy]

This back & fourth between PM members & Meso members reminded me of this thread. Irony ?

TP's HGH - TheGreytops

 

[Dr JIM]

So due to the excessive glycine there are amino acids missing?

It would certainly be interesting to hear how exactly would that work - I don't think that is possible.

Also, we are back at it again - I don't think calling a few tens of mgs maximum an excessive amount, assuming it was put there with ill will, is correct.

I though it had been agreed that it serves purpose no other than being a buffer, Mr. JIM.

Missing, from the sample hmm that would imply those Greys are NOT GH and MH wouldn't like that

But I do know a couple AA are "missing" from the raw data work sheet.

The latter is a reflection of HOW "huge" quantities of Glycine can effect HPLC results!

Oh and an excessive amount is one that FAR exceeds the expected ratio, concentration for GH, or one that limits data interpretation.

 

[janoshik]

Missing, from the sample hmm that would imply those Greys are NOT GH and MH wouldn't like that

But I do know a couple AA are "missing" from the raw data work sheet.

The latter is a reflection of HOW "huge" quantities of Glycine can effect HPLC results!

Oh and an excessive amount is one that FAR exceeds the expected ratio, concentration for GH, or one that limits data interpretation.

Your first sentence doesn't make too much sense to me, especially after reading the ones coming after that - so are you implying that it might not be HGH or that glycine affected the amino acid readings?

@rpbb which set of results were you asking about, if you don't mind pointing it out? I'd like to take a look - it might be possible for glycine to screw up readings for some AA in AAA.

And true, it is excessive unless one expects it to be used as a buffer - but that happens a lot with the analytical work.

 

[Dr JIM]

Your first sentence doesn't make too much sense to me, especially after reading the ones coming after that - so are you implying that it might not be HGH or that glycine affected the amino acid readings?

@rpbb which set of results were you asking about, if you don't mind pointing it out? I'd like to take a look - it might be possible for glycine to screw up readings for some AA in AAA.

.

My reply is based on the FACT if Histidine and/or Thyronine are actually ABSENT from a sample (rather than being difficult to detect) it can NOT be LEGIT GH, bc those TWO amino acids (and 15 others) must be present in HUMAN GH

Although certain matrices can interfere with some aspects of AA hydrolysis, bc of their differing solubility buffers "fall out" of the solution and are accounted for by adjusting the PH.

Glycine as a buffer? I think that's unlikely but is added bc it can enhance endogenous GH secretion, the difference is bc it' an AMINO ACID it reacts in a manner similar to the characteristics of the sample, AND that can be a real problem

 

[Dr JIM]

Glycine is NOT being used as a buffer and you should know that Jano, as its presence will have a minimal effect on
PH !

Glycine is much more likely to be added (or not removed) bc it may enhance endogenous GH production.

The problem arises when it's concentration becomes excessive as is typical of generic GH.

Such a practice is entirely consistent with the "more is better" concept of bro-science and whoever manufactured those Greys apparently follows a similar line of thought.

There were a couple Grey samples where His and Try data was omitted and lie somewhere between 20-24.

 

[muscle96ss]

Glycine is NOT being used as a buffer and you should know that Jano, as its presence will have a minimal effect on
PH !

Glycine is much more likely to be added (or not removed) bc it may enhance endogenous GH production.

The problem arises when it's concentration becomes excessive as is typical of generic GH.

Such a practice is entirely consistent with the "more is better" concept of bro-science and whoever manufactured those Greys apparently follows a similar line of thought.

The Grey samples where His and Try data was omitted are between 20-24.

I

Per the literature( Liquid formulations with high concentration of human growth hormone (high) comprising glycine US 20070065469 A1), glycine is added for the following reasons:

• Preferably, in the pharmaceutical formulations of the present invention, glycine may mainly act as as a stabilizing agent and/or as tonicity-adjusting agent for bringing about a desired tonicity.

 

[Dr JIM]

The bottom line "EXCESSIVE" amounts of Glycine most certainly can effect HPLC results, something Jano refuted when @mands made this suggestion some time ago!

 

[Dr JIM]

Per the literature( Liquid formulations with high concentration of human growth hormone (high) comprising glycine US 20070065469 A1), glycine is added for the following reasons:

• Preferably, in the pharmaceutical formulations of the present invention, glycine may mainly act as as a stabilizing agent and/or as tonicity-adjusting agent for bringing about a desired tonicity.

Obviously you don't understand the difference bt a matrix stabilizer, emulsifier, tonic agent and a BUFFER, and GLYCINE is NO "BUFFER", especially at those Phs used for HPLC
AA analysis.

Almost all of those added agents "fall out" of rather than "fall onto" the HPLC grid, bc if they did "fall into" the grid, HPLC data interpretation could be much more difficult.?

Once again glycine poses a problem bc it falls onto the grid in an area VERYY close to where His and Try elute and THAT results in an interference when large quantities of the former are involved, bc it can obscure visualization of the SMALLER HIS and THY peaks.

 

[muscle96ss]

Obviously you don't understand the difference bt a matrix stabilizer, emulsifier, tonic agent and a BUFFER, and GLYCINE is NO "BUFFER", especially at those Phs used for HPLC
AA analysis.

Almost all of those added agents "fall out" of rather than "fall onto" the HPLC grid, bc if they did "fall into" the grid, HPLC data interpretation could be much more difficult.?

Once again glycine poses a problem bc it falls onto the grid in an area VERYY close to where His and Try elute and THAT results in an interference when large quantities of the former are involved, bc it can obscure visualization of the SMALLER HIS and THY peaks.

Jim, I wasn't agreeing or arguing with either you or Jano. I was simply stating what the literature states the purpose of the glycine is; and I believe that patent I posted is from Genetch.

Anyway, my question then is: so if the glycine is making some of the amino acids appear as if they are missing, does that then effect the total content or is that just made up in extra glycine? In other words if the peaks can't be visualized and are reported as none, then isn't that content thats reported as none missing from the total contents reported. Hope that makes sense.

 

[Dr JIM]

1) Jim, I wasn't agreeing or arguing with either you or Jano. I was simply stating what the literature states the purpose of the glycine is; and I believe that patent I posted is from Genetch.

Anyway, my question then is: so if the glycine is making some of the amino acids appear as if they are missing, does that then effect the total content or is that just made up in extra glycine? In other words if the peaks can't be visualized and are reported as none, then isn't that content thats reported as none missing from the total contents reported. Hope that makes sense.

1) I've posted TWO abstracts that revealed parenteral Glycine CAN increase GH secretion and knowing that makes me skeptical
about Pharmas non-therapeuti motives, especially since such info would likely be considered PROPRIETARY.

FACT IS there are many agents that could be used for the same purpose as Glycine. For instance almost anything that is soluble in water will change its tonicity.


2) Youll have to rephrase the question bc there's a considerable difference bt;

-measured but not reported,

"missing" as in present but not measurable

-missing" as in entirely absent
from the sample

-"visualized" on the chromatograph

- "visualized" but partly or completely obscured on the Chromo

- "detected" based upon spectrographic changes or differences

"ETC

I just don't want to make any ERRORS bc I've every reason to suspect what your really looking for, a "defect" in the data you can run with!

Kinda like "anything and everything I say can or will be used against me" in
MHs court of law.

Especially when the verdict has already been rendered "Jims data can NOT be accurate".

 

[Sampei]

I have defended you few times but we are all still waiting for the standard used on Pm
Test. Mands couldn't find it, you said you were going to post it... but nothing.

Can you please?

Jim, I wasn't agreeing or arguing with either you or Jano. I was simply stating what the literature states the purpose of the glycine is; and I believe that patent I posted is from Genetch.

Anyway, my question then is: so if the glycine is making some of the amino acids appear as if they are missing, does that then effect the total content or is that just made up in extra glycine? In other words if the peaks can't be visualized and are reported as none, then isn't that content thats reported as none missing from the total contents reported. Hope that makes sense.

 

[Mr.B66]

Its nice to see you guys being civil to each other[emoji4]

 

[Dr JIM]

FUCDANMCANTSTANTHATSORRASSSONSABITERBOOT

Oh me too!

 

[justaphan]

A pharm sample will tell how accurate these results are. The brands that overlap the tests we did over at PM came back with different results. The results here are all roughly 25% off of what we got as well as what other tests performed in other scenarios got. In addition the factory that the grey tops are produced in is regulated and audited by the government and would be taking a huge risk by underdosing their GH. So, when it comes to common sense and logic, anybody who does not think that you need a test of a known substance(i.e. pharm grade) is being completely naive and buying into Jim's rhetoric.

Do you have links for those? I'm going to openly admit I'm feeling way too lazy to click the little magnifying glass in the corner right now

Also I don't understand what you want to discredit this info is. They show black tops being pretty fucking great, and I thought you support and recommend pd and tp, both of whom carry that. Why not point to that and be happy? I'm not trying to instigate, I'm just a little confused

 

[muscle96ss]

1) I've posted TWO abstracts that revealed parenteral Glycine CAN increase GH secretion and knowing that makes me skeptical
about Pharmas non-therapeuti motives, especially since such info would likely be considered PROPRIETARY.

FACT IS there are many agents that could be used for the same purpose as Glycine. For instance almost anything that is soluble in water will change its tonicity.


2) Youll have to rephrase the question bc there's a considerable difference bt;

-measured but not reported,

"missing" as in present but not measurable

-missing" as in entirely absent
from the sample

-"visualized" on the chromatograph

- "visualized" but partly or completely obscured on the Chromo

- "detected" based upon spectrographic changes or differences

"ETC

I just don't want to make any ERRORS bc I've every reason to suspect what your really looking for, a "defect" in the data you can run with!

Kinda like "anything and everything I say can or will be used against me" in
MHs court of law.

Especially when the verdict has already been rendered "Jims data can NOT be accurate".

I wasn't looking for a defect. I am just trying to understand how it can be determined that the sample actually is GH if its missing AA's. And if it is GH, then logic would dictate that those AA's that are shown as being absent would need to be added into the contents somewhere. So I think those are valid questions to help everyone understand. In fact, this was a question that was asked to me last week and I still am not sure I have a good understanding of the explanation.