"[F]or the record," how?
MESO-Rx
Anabolic Steroids
Using clomid with testosterone
- Thread starter dano79
- Start date
"[F]or the record," how?
anonymous_475692
Member
I've always wondered if using clomid with testosterone would make me shoot porn star loads aha 
but correct me if I'm wrong but if you were taking arimidex too would that mix be bad?
but correct me if I'm wrong but if you were taking arimidex too would that mix be bad?I wonder if the single isomer clomiphene will solve the libido problem.
I am secondary hypo and clomid really works on me pushes my test on the very high end of normal with a very small dose of 25mg eod.
But even tho labs show great I do not feel good on it. My libido is basically as low as in hypogonadal state. I do get a glimpse of improval on the beginning of treatment but it is just downhill from there.
Androxal seems to target this audience with its formula doesn't it?
And before anyone asks, yes I've had complete labs while on clomid. High free test, high total T, low E2,Low prolactin, low SHBG = NO LIBIDO.
Sucks big time.
His previous post states that whilst on Testosterone + 12.5 mg/d clomid his LH was low but in range so in his case you are not correct.
Go back to post 16. One of the members, davesavvy, has bloodwork that says you are incorrect at least in his case and his daily dose of Clomid is very low.
"I'm incorrect" and that statement is based on a single post from ONE member "study" who has NOT posted before and after labs that PROVE the simultaneous administration of TT and a SERM is synergistic.
Have you even read the OPs question? Because the question was does the use of a SEEM, Clomin in this case, raise TT levels even further for those already on PHYSIOLOGIC doses of TRT, and my answer is NO it does NOT.
Now try spending a little more time "Googling" the issues at hand before blindly asserting others are "wrong".
We have a moniker for fellas like yourself who claim victory over evidence based data and make assumptions, force extrapolations and formulate theorems in it's stead and "bro science" is it!s name.
Congratulations on becoming a card carrying member of Meso's elite bro science community!
LOL!
Im really looking forward to Androxal. This might be the exact TRT that i can use longterm.
So the side effect profile will NOT be lowered? Mainly the emotional sides?
All I see is bluster and insult. Post evidence that supports your claim that a true TRT levels of testosterone prevents clomid action to increase LH/FSH or STFU. Acting like a turd is not evidence. Yup you have a member here reporting his experience that used the 2 together and had LH and FSH in normal range and on a very low amount of Clomid. That is evidence in my favor until you can prove otherwise or that he is a liar.
Dude it's not a matter of whether SERMS increase LH or FSH but whether combining both SERMS and TT increase TT levels even further, assuming physiologic levels of TT have been achieved bc of TRT.
If that was the case why isn't every BB cycling and using SERMS simultaneously. Bc they know your FOS!
The fact is your the classic type of bro scientist people must avoid. They cherry pick and extrapolate data as a means of bolstering the garbage they spew. I bet you also think AIs cause rebound and 19 Nors increase prolactin also right, lol!
Go locate your own "evidence" by Googling male infertility and SERM or TT use OR the use of SERMS or TRT for male hypogonadism.
If that was the case why isn't every BB cycling and using SERMS simultaneously. Bc they know your FOS!
The fact is your the classic type of bro scientist people must avoid. They cherry pick and extrapolate data as a means of bolstering the garbage they spew. I bet you also think AIs cause rebound and 19 Nors increase prolactin also right, lol!
Go locate your own "evidence" by Googling male infertility and SERM or TT use OR the use of SERMS or TRT for male hypogonadism.
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There is a big difference between a BBing cycle and a TRT patient. In the former there is 10 or more times the normal level of androgens than normal male levels. In the ladder the goal is to maintain testosterone (and other hormone) levels in normal range. Within normal range it is reasonable to predict that SERM therapy with Clomid can be effective. After all eugonadal men given Clomid see an increase in testosterone levels. When TRT is the goal with long term fertility in mind the goal is to retain HPTA function as it may be needed in the future. Exercising the HPTA with Clomid therapy, which blocks estrogen signaling at the hypothalamus and pituitary (resulting in secretion of GnRH from the former and LH and FSH from the ladder) and allows testosterone production along with the parenthetical protein hormone production.
Your flaw in reasoning is equating bodybuilding doses with TRT doses. These are an order of magnitude or more different (i.e. 100 mg/w versus 1000 mg/w or more). If you can not fathom a difference in effects over a range or more in magnitude then you need not comment again because it is obvious you have no idea what you are talking about.
My flaw in reasoning was no flaw at all but an attempt to make noobs like you THINK.
Have you looked at the data on the effects of LH production after as little as 50mg of TT weekly?
Perhaps you should bc TRT doses of testosterone inhibit the release of LH markedly and lowering E-2 thru the use of SERMS does NOT ameliorate that effect.
You simply can't get a double whammy by using a SERM and TT in a simultaneous manner bc there MOA are mutually exclusive.
Primarily bc instituting TRT increases BOTH E-2 and TT both of which have a negative feedback on the HTPA.
Your not the first one to make this suggestion and I'm sure you won't be the last, but adding a SERM to a TRT regime is pointless.
Either increase the TT dose to achieve a physiologic response OR institute a SERM if secondary hypogonadism is thought to be causative.
Combining them both to achieve a synergistic or additive effect way is NOT supported in the literature and is bro science.
Incidentally a single anecdote by someone on Meso does NOT in anyway negate that fact, "bro".
Have you looked at the data on the effects of LH production after as little as 50mg of TT weekly?
Perhaps you should bc TRT doses of testosterone inhibit the release of LH markedly and lowering E-2 thru the use of SERMS does NOT ameliorate that effect.
You simply can't get a double whammy by using a SERM and TT in a simultaneous manner bc there MOA are mutually exclusive.
Primarily bc instituting TRT increases BOTH E-2 and TT both of which have a negative feedback on the HTPA.
Your not the first one to make this suggestion and I'm sure you won't be the last, but adding a SERM to a TRT regime is pointless.
Either increase the TT dose to achieve a physiologic response OR institute a SERM if secondary hypogonadism is thought to be causative.
Combining them both to achieve a synergistic or additive effect way is NOT supported in the literature and is bro science.
Incidentally a single anecdote by someone on Meso does NOT in anyway negate that fact, "bro".
Yes I've seen all of that years ago. You are referencing one of Bhasin's articles. In that study where suppression was seen at 50 mg/w was not performed in the presence of clomiphene. So your assertion is not valid. Serum testosterone is not as powerful a suppressor as E2. Again you do not comprehend concentrations that differ in magnitude or differences in their level to suppress. A single post is not proof but it should make your ears perk up if you are inquisitive. If you have been around as long as me in this you would have seen enough evidence that at low TRT level doses SERMs can prevent or reduce suppression. Go to Allthingsmale, Dr. Cristler (formerly on boards as Swale) and you may find others that have dabbled in this and posted bloods. I have seen it work in friends in this game and in my own bloodwork in the past. It is a good tool if it works for you. You might try it when you decide TRT is where you will stay if your HPTA still functions sufficiently.
Frankly, you seem close minded, insulting and childish. I only answer your posts because some of the guys on this board might benefit from the debate and keep an open mind. You should remove Dr. from your screen name since you insult those that spent 8+ actually earning a doctorate.
Frankly, you seem close minded, insulting and childish. I only answer your posts because some of the guys on this board might benefit from the debate and keep an open mind. You should remove Dr. from your screen name since you insult those that spent 8+ actually earning a doctorate.
Anecdotes anecdotes and more anecdotes about what you have seen, posted, witnessed, heard, read about, or dreamed of!
Your well on your way to reaching the pinnacle of bro science where nothing matters but your opinion.
At-a-way "bro", lol
Your well on your way to reaching the pinnacle of bro science where nothing matters but your opinion.
At-a-way "bro", lol
In any event, for guys interested in this thread, for me personally I use Androgel and 25 to 50 mg/d of Clomid. Also have done it with 100 mg/w Test cyp. You can get your bloodwork done at PrivateMD and pick the deluxe male antiaging panel. It will give you the tests you need to look at if you also add in LH/FSH. Please note I have no affiliation with the company or website. But I have used it lots of times. That test panel with give you all your health markers as well for liver, kidney, cardiac, metabolic, etc. If you have it done post up and I can help you with results. I worked in clinical laboratory science in the past. It will cost less than 200 bucks especially if you have a coupon even cheaper. Don't take my word. Test it yourself and see if it works for you. The main factor is to keep your exogenous test to a dose that keeps you in the low mid range to upper quartile of normal range (~ 450 to 750 ng/dL). Then the Clomid should work. The goal is to get LH in normal range, which means your HPTA loop is being artificially maintained, which helps maintain steroid synthetic pathway intermediates like pregnenolone, DHEA, DHEA-S etc.
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