When did shoulders being larger than pecs become in?

[illuminatty]

Dang that is a work of art. My idol is frank zane

 

[newtoketo]

emm Arnold used steroids as well though...imho. Arnold had a great physique no doubt. Ronnie Coleman also had a great physique. It' s ok to like them both lol. Usually the problem with the extended stomach's come down to food intake mainly. If you take a 200 pound body with say a 30 inch waist and add 100 pounds to it you know the waist has to come up as well. Eat 6 or more meals a day and when you get to your highest bodyweight...yes your waist will come up some lol.

 

[4leafclover]

No, the extended stomach is due to HGH overuse and insulin, period. It has to do with how HGH and insulin promote muscle growth.

Arnold (and every body builder of his generation) used steroids, they were legal. He goes over this in several of his interviews and books. He stated (who knows how accurate this is, and we will probably never know) that he only used steroids because everyone else was, and it would of been an unfair competitive advantage, and he wanted to win, so he used. They also used pharmaceutical grade gear, since it was legal. Their doses were smaller than many used today (they also lacked PCT).

 

[newtoketo]

yes as well as gh and insulin ...you are correct

 

[newtoketo]

Doggcrapp:: Andoni do you think your waist would be the exact same if you lost 50lbs? Do you think it will be the exact same if you gained 50lbs? No its going to change and your going to have to make the decision of what you want to be as a bodybuilder. As I said on CFP many peoples guts stick out as they get dramatically larger-- Your midriff is the axis of the body and as you see any man over 250lbs who is a bodybuilder/powerlifter usually has distended abs. Jay Cutler is the only pro near 300lbs offseason that I can think of whose gut doesnt stick out so if you got Jays genetics I say go for it.
As far as distended abs some of that could be contributed to force feeding, high androgens, insulin and doing movements (squatting, deads) that force the abdomen out but since the 250 and above guys almost all have it and the 250 and below guys rarely have it--I believe it comes alot from having to support that kind of muscle mass up top all day long--something has to give slightly when lack of posture and tiredness take over. And I believe the same reasons effect the lower back also-- I find when my olive oil intake is high my lower back blows up like no tommorrow during squats, and heavy back movements. Ive never had a structural problem with my back ever but Ive had to have my gf drive my car home many a time after legs and back because my back was so insanely blown up and painful. By the time i get home its gone ever single time. If I walk around for the entire day my lower back starts aching and blowing up also especially when Im at my largest. This is a consequence of getting much larger and Andoni you have to make the decision of whether you want to be a 4.0lbs per inch of height bodybuilder or someone with a smaller physique than he can truly accomplish. I cant comprehend how someone can think that their waist measuring 32 inches around at 210lbs will still be 32 inches around at 260lbs when all other bodyparts have gotten dramatically larger. As far as gaining weight with the guys Ive trained--they sure arent getting fatter--they are staying at the same bodyfat or leaner while getting larger----thats the reasoning behind the carb cutoffs and certain other things i do with cardio and diet. If a problem arises and someone feels they are gaining bodyfat at an unacceptable rate--Ill tweak things so they dont but I have to reinforce repeatedly (some of these guys on this thread have heard this) that their stomach will be sticking out all day long from the food intake AND I WANT IT TO BE. Because if it isnt we arent eating our way up to the next level. Nothing is sadder to me then some guy 205lbs who lifts for 5-6 years and is weighing 208lbs now. You just did all those workouts and all that time for 3 measly lbs? If anyone I personally train is gaining bodyfat 90% of the time they are skipping the 20-30 min cardio sessions i have them do 2-3 times a week or cheating after carb cuttoffs more than they are telling me.

 

[4leafclover]

The prob with todays pro body builders is that they talk about all this extra bullshit, but don't talk about the gear they use, so I always take anything they say with a grain of salt. Two people who have been willing to discuss gear use in pro bodybuilding attribute the gut to HGH and insulin. Rich Piana even states he started to get it, so he quit those compounds and lost the gut. The other one is MR 3 CC's, and he's got the gut, and he's on HGH and insulin (and a myriad of other things). I'm sure it does have to do with the extra 50 pounds they carry, but how did they get to that weight in the first place?

 

[newtoketo]

At my highest bdw I was 260..natural and not even trt. Mostly muscle but def. some fat too lol. I couldn't walk half of the mall without sitting down.

 

[4leafclover]

Speaking of Rich, he just released a new vid on distended guts

 

[MANWHORE]

I didn't know the intestines were inside our stomachs

 

[MANWHORE]

It's ridiculous to see the pros these days with shoulders so large that they are bigger than their pecs. Am I alone in this view??

Too much shoulder press, not enough pecker deck?
I always liked a wide chest but never a chest too big like boobies..

 

[BIGMESC]

Speaking of Rich, he just released a new vid on distended guts

Anyone else think this guy looks 5 yrs older every video he makes.

 

[4leafclover]

He is in his 40's, so time was bound to catch up with him, sooner rather than later.

 

[alphastrength50]

his vids are quite helpful and entertaining hahaha

 

[blazinshotguns]

Don't shoulders and traps grow faster than pecs?

 

[alphastrength50]

for some they do

 

[MANWHORE]

Don't shoulders and traps grow faster than pecs?

The Shoulders and Traps get more work, from other things, so YES

Mechanics of body causes shoulders to come
into play above chest, for some but I hate to think
Pros don't know how to directly stimulate chest..

Arnold sure as hell did, but Arnold
was about the workout, while these guys are after the new drug

 

[weighted chinup]

No, the extended stomach is due to HGH overuse and insulin, period. It has to do with how HGH and insulin promote muscle growth.

Arnold (and every body builder of his generation) used steroids, they were legal. He goes over this in several of his interviews and books. He stated (who knows how accurate this is, and we will probably never know) that he only used steroids because everyone else was, and it would of been an unfair competitive advantage, and he wanted to win, so he used. They also used pharmaceutical grade gear, since it was legal. Their doses were smaller than many used today (they also lacked PCT).

I never bought into the idea that top level bodybuilders in the 70's used 'minimal' doses of AAS.

A physique like Arnolds, Serge Nubrets, Frank Zanes etc) is pretty much a maxed out physique from just regular anabolics alone. I don't think these guys would have been much bigger even if they were to substantially increase their androgen use, because their drug intake was most likely extremely high in the first place.

I have no doubt that the doses these guys were using in the 70's were anything but small....

CASEY LAUGHED and then said this….” Mentzer used up to 2.5 grams of deca a week, God knows how much primobolin acetate, along with d-bol and growth, so as I said don’t be fooled about our low doses as we were just as reckless as theses guys are today.

 

[4leafclover]

I don't think they used tremendous amounts, they had access to pharma grade gear, and the doses gear came in back then was far less than UGL gear now. You also have to remember they didn't have SERM's/AI either, so they couldn't run huge doses without running the risk of sides. They probably ran gear for long amounts of time, (Dbol used to come in 5-10mg tabs when it was legal from the Pharma companies, not 50mg), far longer than 8-12 weeks at lower doses. At least this is what my coach tells me.

 

[weighted chinup]

I don't think they used tremendous amounts, they had access to pharma grade gear, and the doses gear came in back then was far less than UGL gear now. You also have to remember they didn't have SERM's/AI either, so they couldn't run huge doses without running the risk of sides. They probably ran gear for long amounts of time, (Dbol used to come in 5-10mg tabs when it was legal from the Pharma companies, not 50mg), far longer than 8-12 weeks at lower doses. At least this is what my coach tells me.

This is the other side of the coin as well, its hard to imagine running 2-3g of gear a week without any real support drugs or ancillaries, not to mention that pharma grade drugs were dosed smaller than a lot of Underground stuff now...

We will never know for certain, but there is a lot of anecdotal evidence suggesting these guys were pretty much maxed out in terms of their androgen intake, obviously they could take more but I think there wouldn't have been a substantial difference in size.

But since there is no way to prove or verify any of these claims it could go either way.

For me personally, just based on how much size these guys were carrying leads me to believe their doses were on the higher side, even by today's standards.

I would say a physique like this is the upper limit of what is achievable with AAS use alone..

 

[4leafclover]

You also got to rem, Arnold says he was introduced to steroids at 15 (or 16 I can't rem), so by that point he would of been using them for 20 years. 20 years of lifting and a moderate steroid dose would produce his results. Especially when you consider he trained 6 days on, 1 day off, for all of off season, and on pre-contest, double training a day (5+ hours) 6 days on, 1 day off.

I also think body builders of his generation worked a lot harder at it, than todays build a drug body builders.